Rooster or Hen? Thoughts on de-sexing?

[ChirpyBrooke]

Hi @ChirpyBrooke . I can relate to you. I'm a vegetarian and very much an animal lover...including all chickens. My 6 girls are like my children.
When I first got my 3 sexed chicks one turned out to be male. You can see him on my profile pic (on my head!). Sweetest Mottled Java ever. I was pretty desperate because the thought of him ending up as someone's meal was just not something I was ok accepting and like you know, there are more roosters out there than people want to keep as pets.
Living in LA, we have several avian specialist vets and I took my baby Velvet to one at around 7 weeks to confirm the sex. I was in denial although he had quite developed comb and wattles and was already starting to crow...I mean you hear of hens crowing all the time after all right?! We had a DNA test done to confirm his sex. Male indeed. We also discussed hormonal implants and castrating ('caponizing') him. Here is what the dr told me:

• Cost of surgery: probably between $3000-4000.
• Chemical hormonal implants in chickens are illegal, so that is not a possibility for Velvet. Chickens, even pet chickens, are considered food animals by the USDA - even though I know Velvet will never be eaten! Placing chemical hormonal implants are a safety issue for humans in food animals in case the animal is ever eaten.
• We do not perform de-crowing surgery - it is not a medically necessary procedure and is similar to de-barking a dog which is not in the best interest of the pet. <I know you are not concerned about crowing>
• As we discussed the other day, the surgery itself does have very high risk (50-80%) of fatal bleeding (hemorrhage) and it doesn't guarantee stopping the crowing behavior. Because of this, some veterinarians will not perform the procedure as an elective procedure. Unfortunately, I do not have statistics or percentages on how many roosters stop crowing after the procedure.

That all being said, I had to dig deep and understand my motivations. Was I trying to provide him a better life or was I just trying to protect myself from heartache. I knew I could not risk the surgery, not to mention the obscene price-tag. The success rate is so slim even if done by a professional. So it was a no-go option. And implants were not available either.
I ended up finding him a good home with his own flock of hens not far out of town in another suburban backyard. Unfortunately they did not provide the most secure coop at night and 4 months later he was killed by a raccoon.
My point is that only you know the right decision for yourself. But I would say that a medical procedure is likely not the best option.
Others above have suggested some options if you can't find him a good home. Good luck

This is exactly what i needed to hear. Thank you so much ThreeChicks. He (April O'Neil ) deserves to be himself and culling will never be on the table with me. I did not have a "rooster plan" in place and this was my own fault. I will make sure to find a home that is prepared to offer him the same home that I would have had that baby been a hen.

Thank you again for your reply.

 

[JacinLarkwell]

Unfortunately, I do not have statistics or percentages on how many roosters stop crowing after the procedure

Based off of the threads I've read on here, it seems like if they start crowing before, they'll continue afterwards because they know how to do it and it's just on reflex

 

[Dinosaur Village Keeper]

Did you find him a home? I too am looking to find someone to caponize my little roo. I already have two roosters and a third is going to be a problem. I already learned that they will fight to the death.

I’m not sure why caponizing is so heavily frowned upon, and yet chopping off a Roos head and eating it is not. Rehoming them to a place with poor security and allowing them to be viciously killed and eating by a predator is not frowned upon. Newborn infants are circumcised without anesthesia. It takes the same amount of time as caponizing does. The entire argument AGAINST caponizing is truly insane. My little roo will be able to live an amazing and happy life in my flock for many, many years if he is caponized and yet I would be criticized for even suggesting it. I’m trying to find a butcher that sells capons. Whoever sells them must certainly know someone that knows how to create them!

I hope things turned out well for you and your roo!

 

[BelovedBirds]

Did you find him a home? I too am looking to find someone to caponize my little roo. I already have two roosters and a third is going to be a problem. I already learned that they will fight to the death.

I’m not sure why caponizing is so heavily frowned upon, and yet chopping off a Roos head and eating it is not. Rehoming them to a place with poor security and allowing them to be viciously killed and eating by a predator is not frowned upon. Newborn infants are circumcised without anesthesia. It takes the same amount of time as caponizing does. The entire argument AGAINST caponizing is truly insane. My little roo will be able to live an amazing and happy life in my flock for many, many years if he is caponized and yet I would be criticized for even suggesting it. I’m trying to find a butcher that sells capons. Whoever sells them must certainly know someone that knows how to create them!

I hope things turned out well for you and your roo!

Chopping off a roos head and eating them means instant death, no pain.
Castrating them would be pain they have to be awake and fully conscious for. And then the pain of that recovery.

That's the difference.

 

[Holdthechicken]

Did you find him a home? I too am looking to find someone to caponize my little roo. I already have two roosters and a third is going to be a problem. I already learned that they will fight to the death.

I’m not sure why caponizing is so heavily frowned upon, and yet chopping off a Roos head and eating it is not. Rehoming them to a place with poor security and allowing them to be viciously killed and eating by a predator is not frowned upon. Newborn infants are circumcised without anesthesia. It takes the same amount of time as caponizing does. The entire argument AGAINST caponizing is truly insane. My little roo will be able to live an amazing and happy life in my flock for many, many years if he is caponized and yet I would be criticized for even suggesting it. I’m trying to find a butcher that sells capons. Whoever sells them must certainly know someone that knows how to create them!

I hope things turned out well for you and your roo!

I’m not here to argue, like you I was curious why this wasn’t done more, so I asked my SIL who is a practicing veterinarian and she said that it’s generally agreed upon in the animal care world that it’s not what’s best for the animal, so they won’t perform the procedure. It’s been decided that a castrated rooster (if they survive the procedure) is less desirable of an outcome for the animal than a swift and painful death from the animals perspective. I’m sure this opinion was formed with chickens being classified as a food animal over pet, but if the surgery for dogs entailed what it does for roosters, I would have an in tact dog.

 

[Smokerbill]

Just for informative reasons, here's a link to an old Sear's store flyer showing instructions for caponizing. It looks like quite an involved surgery.

http://www.afn.org/~poultry/capon.htm

And a BYC thread on how to caponize a rooster...

https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/how-to-caponize-a-rooster-warning-graphic-pics.210041/

 

[JacinLarkwell]

Chopping off a roos head and eating them means instant death, no pain.
Castrating them would be pain they have to be awake and fully conscious for. And then the pain of that recovery.

That's the difference.

Plus there is a high risk of death from blood loss and shock when first figuring out what to do inside the bird. It takes practice learning how to do it since the bird's sex organs are either very small when done young, or larger and more breakable when done older. If you don't get all of them out, then it won't work

 

[Dinosaur Village Keeper]

Chopping off a roos head and eating them means instant death, no pain.
Castrating them would be pain they have to be awake and fully conscious for. And then the pain of that recovery.

That's the difference.

So what happens with pigs and cows and such being castrated? Does that seem like a walk in the park for them? Ouch! And newborn human babies given nothing for circumcision? Wow, talk about ouch! I heard my sons screams and I will never forget them. I’ve heard that those experienced in caponizing perform this is less than one minute. Then a happy roo for 10 years if this is done for pet reasons. I held my dying chicken at the vets office, tears streaming down my face, begging for them to give her something for the pain and the vet says “We have no approved pain meds for chickens because we eat them.” The medical profession as a whole is a joke, whether for animals or people.

 

[JacinLarkwell]

So what happens with pigs and cows and such being castrated? Does that seem like a walk in the park for them? Ouch! And newborn human babies given nothing for circumcision? Wow, talk about ouch! I heard my sons screams and I will never forget them. I’ve heard that those experienced in caponizing perform this is less than one minute. Then a happy roo for 10 years if this is done for pet reasons. I held my dying chicken at the vets office, tears streaming down my face, begging for them to give her something for the pain and the vet says “We have no approved pain meds for chickens because we eat them.” The medical profession as a whole is a joke, whether for animals or people.

Those animals have their testicles on the outside of their body cavity. Poultry do not. You have to go into their abdomen, and underneath organs to get them.

 

[Dinosaur Village Keeper]

Plus there is a high risk of death from blood loss and shock when first figuring out what to do inside the bird. It takes practice learning how to do it since the bird's sex organs are either very small when done young, or larger and more breakable when done older. If you don't get all of them out, then it won't work

Exactly, which is why it wouldn’t be a big deal for an experienced person to offer a clinic once a month where little Roos can be brought in for a super quick procedure without charging owners an arm and a leg. So you sign a paper of understanding that there is a 10% chance the little guy won’t survive. That is about the survival rate from people with experience. They do a much more advanced and expensive procedure on feral cats (TNR) and then toss them back out in the wild where they have a rough life with a life expectancy of 2 years. They continue to dig up and crap in peoples yards. They continue to kill innocent birds and rabbits every day. They continue to carry and spread diseases. But our pet Roos do not even deserve that much care, decency, and respect. It’s truly sick. And those who argue it are just as sick.