Hi, I am new to this site but not new to chickens, but I do have a question concerning a certain breed which I am not familiar with and that is Silver Penciled Rocks. I was interested in buying some eggs or chicks from a good breeder ( not a hatchery) I live in West Virginia and would need to find a source not so far away that shipping would be a problem. i currently have some that are eleven weeks old that I got as chicks . I wasn't wanting any more than one rooster but ended up with nine, ( one with a deformed foot, possibly from shipping ?) one big yellow hen with gray specks, ( she is bigger than the roosters) and two barred looking hens that I assume are going to turn into Silver Penciled rocks? Also is the big yellow hen common in this line as some type of throw-back that occurs from time to time? I understand about the straight run aspect and all, and things happen. but I am looking for a better experience than the last. I understand with eggs that it is what it is, but from what I have heard this particular breed can be sexed by coloration with a fairy decent success rate ??? I am looking for someone that may sell all female chicks instead of straight run. I would be willing to pay twice the price for hen chicks and they can keep my roosters. Any help?
Silver Penciled Rocks,
- Thread starter Hackle
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Can you post pictures of your birds? Nothing of what your describing is Silver Penciled. The barred birds are likely Barred Rocks but with a yellow hen in there it begs the question how "pure" the birds are.
Even in a good flock of Silver Rocks offspring can have blotchy pattern and males far too much black and females be brown. One of the biggest problems with this variety is red showing up. Red on shoulders of males and brassy backs. Females can have brown hue instead of silver. It's this tendency of brown hue that makes some say the chicks are sexable. To some extent this is true as a poor quality flock will throw a lot of brown and the pullets are most likely to be the brown ones. The problem with all this is the brown is not wanted at all. Not to say a brown bird has no redeeming quality and should automatically be tossed from a breeding program but I am saying to sex and sell all pullets by brown chick coloring is not doing the buyer any favors for sure. The black pencil on silver color is what the birds should look like. The birds that grow into this coloration start as silver not brown. I've sourced eggs of this variety from two sources. One had 70% brown chicks and the other source 90% silver chicks hatch. Right there at hatch I knew the better quality of the second source of birds. And in both cases there were not 70% pullets from first source nor was there only 10% pullets from the second. They hatched 50/50 sex as it should be.
I'll post some pics in a minute of a few of my 10-11? week birds. These I'll photo are a cross of both lines. There were problems with both lines and felt there was a shot as pulling out the best of both. This crossing of lines is the reason for such variation in cockerel color. Try and get some photos of your birds too.
Even in a good flock of Silver Rocks offspring can have blotchy pattern and males far too much black and females be brown. One of the biggest problems with this variety is red showing up. Red on shoulders of males and brassy backs. Females can have brown hue instead of silver. It's this tendency of brown hue that makes some say the chicks are sexable. To some extent this is true as a poor quality flock will throw a lot of brown and the pullets are most likely to be the brown ones. The problem with all this is the brown is not wanted at all. Not to say a brown bird has no redeeming quality and should automatically be tossed from a breeding program but I am saying to sex and sell all pullets by brown chick coloring is not doing the buyer any favors for sure. The black pencil on silver color is what the birds should look like. The birds that grow into this coloration start as silver not brown. I've sourced eggs of this variety from two sources. One had 70% brown chicks and the other source 90% silver chicks hatch. Right there at hatch I knew the better quality of the second source of birds. And in both cases there were not 70% pullets from first source nor was there only 10% pullets from the second. They hatched 50/50 sex as it should be.
I'll post some pics in a minute of a few of my 10-11? week birds. These I'll photo are a cross of both lines. There were problems with both lines and felt there was a shot as pulling out the best of both. This crossing of lines is the reason for such variation in cockerel color. Try and get some photos of your birds too.
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- #3
Egghead-Jr, Thanks for the reply . When I got them I had five that were brown, a big red like one, ( which turned out to be the big yellow hen) and six silver like ones. I had heard that the silver ones were roosters and the brown ones were hens, didn't work out that way though. If my grandson was here he could probably post some pictures. When my wife gets home I am sure she can post some pictures, sorry, I am not smart enough to do it.
Note the two K's at water dish. One has very poor hackle striping and is very black, lacking wing band of white etc. Many of the K's have more white splashing on chest than would be wanted for show but this tends to throw females with crisper pattern so desired in breeding pullets. They are still young and believe almost all will grow in black chests. Must say this coloration is challenging. There is a browner pullet I believe in one of those photos. Trust me I've a few but not so bad. Biggest thing with this batch was lack of full penciling in throat area. The last photo is the best look I could get at a K with red showing. There's others and one I was trying to find with a full red feather in wing but this will have to do. If you look close you'll see mahogany in those primary and secondary wing feathers. At 11? weeks now there will surely be much more red showing in this bird later, yet another cull from breeding.
Never got around to answer about source for this variety of Plymouth Rock breed. @Wynette has a nice line and a person you should contact. None of these birds are hers but she is a definite source I'll be seeking if I really run into trouble with my bunch and want good genetics to kick it back in gear.
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Posting pictures is not as easy as it use to be...think I"m getting the knack of it now. Method I'm using is "upload file" then navigate your computer files to photo then "open" that file to load it, continue to "upload file" and open for all photos you want posted. They will stack up as thumbnails bottom of screen. At the end click the option at top of all those thumbnails to "post all" as full image or thumbnails in your post.
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- #6
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- #7
Wow, no idea what or how that orange bird is. Maybe they threw in a male of something else like an Easter Egger. Does it have a pea comb?
Looking closely at second to last photo of mine that pullet shows some barring also. Yes, I do think that will grow out and be replaced with better pencil next mini molt. The red in males is hard to get rid of but good strides can be made in one and two generations. Good in all other attributes but has red can be used. Your boys will likely show brass in saddle feathers when older. Pick the best body form with least red. Hatch a lot of his chicks and cull hard against the red in next generation. That will help. The cock bird used for my batch shown still had traces of red but a long way from his sire and first batch of birds that were brassy in silver.
Looking closely at second to last photo of mine that pullet shows some barring also. Yes, I do think that will grow out and be replaced with better pencil next mini molt. The red in males is hard to get rid of but good strides can be made in one and two generations. Good in all other attributes but has red can be used. Your boys will likely show brass in saddle feathers when older. Pick the best body form with least red. Hatch a lot of his chicks and cull hard against the red in next generation. That will help. The cock bird used for my batch shown still had traces of red but a long way from his sire and first batch of birds that were brassy in silver.
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- #9
No, it doesn't have a pea comb just a small hen comb, I am sure it is a hen but is bigger than the roosters, puts me in mind of a capon. Maybe a naturally occurring capon? All of my roosters have brown/ red in their wing feathers but one, and he has a bad comb! I don't have any with a nice white band on the back like yours. Just thinking of culling the whole bunch! Cost me $115 to get the twelve of them here and it isn't so much the money but the wasted time and care. Maybe the two hens will turn out o.k. Hate starting over again. I will say one thing for them they are the friendliest chickens I ever saw, follow you around like puppies, stick your hand out and they will fly up onto it. I am going to look at the site you recommended.
Wynette is a member here at BYC. Think if you click this @Wynette it will send you to her profile/mail link to contact her. I know she has a nice line of birds, like the rest of us with this variety it's on the smaller side of standard. Pretty sure you can get eggs from her, don't believe she ships live birds. That's where the expense comes in is shipping live.
Let your birds grow out some more to really evaluate them. They could surprise you. Take the two lines I had/have for example. Was very impressed with the second line obtained then after 20 weeks of age all the side sprigs started to show in combs. Even noted it in a pullet. That was the big problem with that line and not noticed until late in growth. In the end the size and body type of what I'd originally thought a horrible line (my first) was the better choice to use over the second line's pullets. Even though the second generation cock chosen still had slight red in few feathers, no brass in saddle, he was superior to the best cock of the second line with good comb. You really don't know until you grow them out so always keep back a few of the best just in case. Not to mention their is nothing like a side by side comparison of two lines. You really see all the faults of both lines then. Gives you information to then decide where to go from there.
This is an extremely friendly and docile variety. It's amazing how well they get along with all ages and makes for housing them at different ages easy. Not worrying about little kids around the cock birds is great too. Breeding them is a challenge but hatching them won't be. Just wait until next spring and summer....hope you like birds with tendency to brood! Currently trying to bust six hens from brooding to get back egg production. Both lines were the same in this regard, it's inherent to the variety.
Let your birds grow out some more to really evaluate them. They could surprise you. Take the two lines I had/have for example. Was very impressed with the second line obtained then after 20 weeks of age all the side sprigs started to show in combs. Even noted it in a pullet. That was the big problem with that line and not noticed until late in growth. In the end the size and body type of what I'd originally thought a horrible line (my first) was the better choice to use over the second line's pullets. Even though the second generation cock chosen still had slight red in few feathers, no brass in saddle, he was superior to the best cock of the second line with good comb. You really don't know until you grow them out so always keep back a few of the best just in case. Not to mention their is nothing like a side by side comparison of two lines. You really see all the faults of both lines then. Gives you information to then decide where to go from there.
This is an extremely friendly and docile variety. It's amazing how well they get along with all ages and makes for housing them at different ages easy. Not worrying about little kids around the cock birds is great too. Breeding them is a challenge but hatching them won't be. Just wait until next spring and summer....hope you like birds with tendency to brood! Currently trying to bust six hens from brooding to get back egg production. Both lines were the same in this regard, it's inherent to the variety.
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