I agree that you will need to do some work on your fence! However, keeping goats in doesn't have to be quite as difficult as it may sound! LOL A lot will depend on the breed you select. For instance, the dairy breeds like the Nubian, are quite tall (especially the boys!) and very athletic!! They would be a lot harder to keep in a shorter fence. Then on the other end of the spectrum, the Pygmy is small and is able to get out of places that the bigger breeds can not. I personally have 3 Boer wethers (neutered males). The Boers are large meat goats and while the wethers do not get as big as a buck, they are still about 175-225 lbs. This is a breed with shorter legs and a longer back and a lot of muscle. While they are quite athletic in their own right, their body build dictates that they can only get that bulk up and over so much! Mine love to jump on top of their Igloo style dog houses and the metal feed tub that is turned on its side for them. However, they are unable to pull themselves up and over a cattle panel.
About the cattle panels...My boys have their horns. Two of the boys have nicely turned out horns and now that they have grown out, they can not get their heads through a cattle panel. However, one of them is still able to and he will put his head through because the WEEDS ARE ALWAYS GREENER ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE FENCE!!! He always gets his head stuck too! For this reason, the area with the cattle panels is one that I only use when I am home and will be checking on them frequently!
As far as the horns go, I like my boys having horns. It gives me something to grab onto when I need it, It keeps them from putting their head through the fence. When their horns are smaller, some people will take a stick and some baling twine and tie it between their horns when they put them in where they use cattle panels so they can't put their heads through and then just take it off when they take them out. My boys were handled a lot as kids and would never even think of butting a person, especially me! So I have no reason to want a goat de-horned.
If money isn't too, too much of a concern, there are goat panels that you can put up instead of cattle panels that are much better suited for them because the holes are 4x4 and then there are no problems with getting their heads stuck. However, with any fence you put up, I would always recommend putting at least 2 lines of electric fence up. One of them about 6 inches up from the ground , and the other about waist high. There are websites that will give better information on placement than "waist high"! LOL The reason I suggest this three-fold. First, goats will stand on the fence to reach whatever is on the other side or try to reach through for the same reason. That will weaken your fence posts and bow your fencing unless you do one heck of a bang up job putting those fence posts in the ground! Second, when the goats are shedding their winter coats, they will rub on ANYTHING that is handy, be it the fence, a tree or you! They can flat lay a fence down if you don't put posts up every 5-6 feet or so or, if you use the panels, you put long posts down you can spread them out a little more than that. Third, it will help you to keep predators out. If you are able, you could also run a hot wire on the outside about 6 inches off the ground. You will have to use a weedeater under the fence line to keep the weeds from shorting out the hot wire though. The idea is to not let the goats touch the fence, thus keeping it intact and them inside!
As far as which make better pets, I think that while it is a personal choice, most people would recommend a wether simply because you don't have to worry about the hormonal times of the does, nor do you have the messy urine soaked beard and front legs, musky smell and ramminess of a buck during rut.
If you stick with grass hay on the wethers, NO GRAIN, and maybe goat pellets if you want to supplement during the winter, you should be ok with most of their feeding considering they have all the weeds to choose from. Remember that goats are browsers and not grazers so they will continually be moving as they eat and just eat a bite or two here and there. They won't put their head down like a cow and eat. They do prefer to eat at a higher lever than the grass and that is why you will often see horses and goats together in the same pastures. The goats eat the tops off and the horses eat the grasses. This is a good thing for the goats. As long as they can eat several inches off the ground, eat helps to prevent them from getting their lips against their poo and contracting worms. (They always carry a small worm load but during times of stress or if they have to eat off the ground, the worm load can over take them quickly.) If you do decide to go with a wether, I would try very hard to find one is 3-4 months old and not wethered yet. I would actually pay the extra to take them to the vet to wether them (cost about the same as a dog) because if they are done too young, you will really have to be careful about feeding them. The reason for the grass hay and no grain is simple...you want to prevent urinary calculi. Corn is your worst enemy. And when the boys are neutered at a very young age (a week or two) their urethra does not grow out as it would if they were older and even smaller stones will stop them from urinating. Make no mistake. This is a killer if it isn't caught immediately and remedied! As careful as I have been, I still had one have a stone so big that even the usual surgery to flush them out and change their plumbing to urinate like a female (this is done more frequently with cows and even cats!). My boy had to have all of his plumbing removed and his bladder sewn to his belly with a hole left to the outside world!!! As far as the pellets go, I use Meat Goat pellets mixed with Black Oil Sunflower Seeds and Cotton Seeds and they only get 1 cup each of this mixture once a day. I'm not trying to scare you off of goats!! I love my boys and I would not take ANYTHING for them!! However, if I can give you some information to help you to avoid the same pitfalls....
My boys came from friend who owns a meat goat ranch and she didn't want them to breed any of her girls and she knew she would have to keep them for me for a little bit, so we neutered them (yes, she does all that!!) at a pretty young age.
If you think you might want to have kids in the future, I would still start with a couple of wethers or just a couple of does. Until you KNOW you have all the kinks worked out with your fencing (yes, you will have kinks! goats are smart and will show you where they are) I wouldn't get a buck. Also, I would get some experience under your belt with handling them before you get a buck. They are herd animals and they will have to respect you. That doesn't mean you have to be mean, please don't misunderstand me, but if were to get a buck and you felt at all unsure of yourself, he would sense it and he WOULD try to push you around a bit, especially during breeding season or feeding time. If the only way he tried to push you around was sticking his head in the food bucket, you could still get hurt. You need to be able to feel sure of yourself and be firm with all the them when you to tell them to get back, for instance, when you are feeding. Just like a kid (human) they will test you from time to time to see if you still mean it. They need to respect you, especially a buck, to keep your time with them fun and safe!! My boys daddy was a 375 lb sweetheart of a boy who NEVER got mean with us even during breeding season. He did, however, try to put his head in the feed bucket and that giant head with those huge horns would inadvertently bang your fingers and arms and hips trying to get into the feed!! He would have to be reminded that that was not acceptable.
I know this is pretty long and I am not an expert by ANY means!! I have had my boys for 6 years and my girlfriend has raised goats for 25 years so what I know I have mostly learned from working with her!! I hope some of this helps you while you make your decisions. I thought that if you had some different ideas about the goats, it would give you some thoughts about what would and wouldn't work for you! Good luck and let us know what you decide!!
Here are a couple pictures of my boys this past summer...
Itty Bitty is in the first picture with one of his four dogs, Kong Chung, and the second picture is of Prince and Brat. Brat is the white goat and the one who had the operation. You can see how his belly and back legs are stained blackish/brown.
About the cattle panels...My boys have their horns. Two of the boys have nicely turned out horns and now that they have grown out, they can not get their heads through a cattle panel. However, one of them is still able to and he will put his head through because the WEEDS ARE ALWAYS GREENER ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE FENCE!!! He always gets his head stuck too! For this reason, the area with the cattle panels is one that I only use when I am home and will be checking on them frequently!
As far as the horns go, I like my boys having horns. It gives me something to grab onto when I need it, It keeps them from putting their head through the fence. When their horns are smaller, some people will take a stick and some baling twine and tie it between their horns when they put them in where they use cattle panels so they can't put their heads through and then just take it off when they take them out. My boys were handled a lot as kids and would never even think of butting a person, especially me! So I have no reason to want a goat de-horned.
If money isn't too, too much of a concern, there are goat panels that you can put up instead of cattle panels that are much better suited for them because the holes are 4x4 and then there are no problems with getting their heads stuck. However, with any fence you put up, I would always recommend putting at least 2 lines of electric fence up. One of them about 6 inches up from the ground , and the other about waist high. There are websites that will give better information on placement than "waist high"! LOL The reason I suggest this three-fold. First, goats will stand on the fence to reach whatever is on the other side or try to reach through for the same reason. That will weaken your fence posts and bow your fencing unless you do one heck of a bang up job putting those fence posts in the ground! Second, when the goats are shedding their winter coats, they will rub on ANYTHING that is handy, be it the fence, a tree or you! They can flat lay a fence down if you don't put posts up every 5-6 feet or so or, if you use the panels, you put long posts down you can spread them out a little more than that. Third, it will help you to keep predators out. If you are able, you could also run a hot wire on the outside about 6 inches off the ground. You will have to use a weedeater under the fence line to keep the weeds from shorting out the hot wire though. The idea is to not let the goats touch the fence, thus keeping it intact and them inside!
As far as which make better pets, I think that while it is a personal choice, most people would recommend a wether simply because you don't have to worry about the hormonal times of the does, nor do you have the messy urine soaked beard and front legs, musky smell and ramminess of a buck during rut.
If you stick with grass hay on the wethers, NO GRAIN, and maybe goat pellets if you want to supplement during the winter, you should be ok with most of their feeding considering they have all the weeds to choose from. Remember that goats are browsers and not grazers so they will continually be moving as they eat and just eat a bite or two here and there. They won't put their head down like a cow and eat. They do prefer to eat at a higher lever than the grass and that is why you will often see horses and goats together in the same pastures. The goats eat the tops off and the horses eat the grasses. This is a good thing for the goats. As long as they can eat several inches off the ground, eat helps to prevent them from getting their lips against their poo and contracting worms. (They always carry a small worm load but during times of stress or if they have to eat off the ground, the worm load can over take them quickly.) If you do decide to go with a wether, I would try very hard to find one is 3-4 months old and not wethered yet. I would actually pay the extra to take them to the vet to wether them (cost about the same as a dog) because if they are done too young, you will really have to be careful about feeding them. The reason for the grass hay and no grain is simple...you want to prevent urinary calculi. Corn is your worst enemy. And when the boys are neutered at a very young age (a week or two) their urethra does not grow out as it would if they were older and even smaller stones will stop them from urinating. Make no mistake. This is a killer if it isn't caught immediately and remedied! As careful as I have been, I still had one have a stone so big that even the usual surgery to flush them out and change their plumbing to urinate like a female (this is done more frequently with cows and even cats!). My boy had to have all of his plumbing removed and his bladder sewn to his belly with a hole left to the outside world!!! As far as the pellets go, I use Meat Goat pellets mixed with Black Oil Sunflower Seeds and Cotton Seeds and they only get 1 cup each of this mixture once a day. I'm not trying to scare you off of goats!! I love my boys and I would not take ANYTHING for them!! However, if I can give you some information to help you to avoid the same pitfalls....
My boys came from friend who owns a meat goat ranch and she didn't want them to breed any of her girls and she knew she would have to keep them for me for a little bit, so we neutered them (yes, she does all that!!) at a pretty young age.
If you think you might want to have kids in the future, I would still start with a couple of wethers or just a couple of does. Until you KNOW you have all the kinks worked out with your fencing (yes, you will have kinks! goats are smart and will show you where they are) I wouldn't get a buck. Also, I would get some experience under your belt with handling them before you get a buck. They are herd animals and they will have to respect you. That doesn't mean you have to be mean, please don't misunderstand me, but if were to get a buck and you felt at all unsure of yourself, he would sense it and he WOULD try to push you around a bit, especially during breeding season or feeding time. If the only way he tried to push you around was sticking his head in the food bucket, you could still get hurt. You need to be able to feel sure of yourself and be firm with all the them when you to tell them to get back, for instance, when you are feeding. Just like a kid (human) they will test you from time to time to see if you still mean it. They need to respect you, especially a buck, to keep your time with them fun and safe!! My boys daddy was a 375 lb sweetheart of a boy who NEVER got mean with us even during breeding season. He did, however, try to put his head in the feed bucket and that giant head with those huge horns would inadvertently bang your fingers and arms and hips trying to get into the feed!! He would have to be reminded that that was not acceptable.
I know this is pretty long and I am not an expert by ANY means!! I have had my boys for 6 years and my girlfriend has raised goats for 25 years so what I know I have mostly learned from working with her!! I hope some of this helps you while you make your decisions. I thought that if you had some different ideas about the goats, it would give you some thoughts about what would and wouldn't work for you! Good luck and let us know what you decide!!
Here are a couple pictures of my boys this past summer...
Itty Bitty is in the first picture with one of his four dogs, Kong Chung, and the second picture is of Prince and Brat. Brat is the white goat and the one who had the operation. You can see how his belly and back legs are stained blackish/brown.
