Steel wool pieces in oyster shell

[NancyNurseCxMama]

If they are still on chick feed, I wouldn't offer them OS, depending on their age, their kidneys are still developing and you don't want additional calcium until they lay their first egg.

I understand your concern but the ones who are taking it are getting very close to laying---redder combs and wattles, squatting when I touch their backs, and their pelvic bones are now two fingers apart. They are also the ones kicking around the ceramic eggs in the nesting boxes. They are going on twenty weeks old.
The others that appear to be further from POL aren't touching the stuff.
Even the three that are showing interest are only picking occasionally.
I wish they would all start laying and then I'd switch to layer feed and be done with it but I do not want to give the increased calcium to all my girls, for the reasons you brought up. But the starter feed is woefully deficient in calcium for a laying bird.

 

[lazy gardener]

Nancy, your birds are fine to have OS offered now.

 

[NancyNurseCxMama]

Nancy, your birds are fine to have OS offered now.

Thank you! As you probably know, I'm a newbie and I really do appreciate all the great ideas, advice, and input here on these forums.
There's probably several thousand years of chicken-raising experience on BYC---I too am addicted to checking in several times a day! Learning so much from people who have so much knowledge to offer.
A question: Looking at the back of my feed bag I see that they advise chick starter until 20 weeks and then going to layer feed. I will need a new bag of feed soon---what are your thoughts about going to the layer feed? Okay for all the girls, even if no one has started laying? They will be 20 weeks by the time I need a new bag. Do you think I should get one more small bag of starter and mix it with the layer to introduce it gradually?
TIA for any help here!

 

[rjohns39]

Personally, I don't move them to layer until they are all laying. I do transition them and use a different paradigm. Mine start on a 22-24% starter for 3 weeks, then move to an 18-19% grower until they start laying and then move to a 16% layer, except when its really hot, I move them to a 19% layer.

 

[lazy gardener]

Thank you! As you probably know, I'm a newbie and I really do appreciate all the great ideas, advice, and input here on these forums.
There's probably several thousand years of chicken-raising experience on BYC---I too am addicted to checking in several times a day! Learning so much from people who have so much knowledge to offer.
A question: Looking at the back of my feed bag I see that they advise chick starter until 20 weeks and then going to layer feed. I will need a new bag of feed soon---what are your thoughts about going to the layer feed? Okay for all the girls, even if no one has started laying? They will be 20 weeks by the time I need a new bag. Do you think I should get one more small bag of starter and mix it with the layer to introduce it gradually?
TIA for any help here!

Nancy, ask 4 different folks on BYC, and you will get at least 5 different answers! I can tell you what I do: I keep my entire flock on unmedicated starter when I have youngsters. Any time after the pullets loose their peep (meaning they are starting to enter puberty, their voice is changing) I switch the entire flock over to layer. The only reason I use layer at all is b/c it is easier on my wallet. While I do recycle my used egg shells from my own flock, and offer OS as a supplement, I do not have to provide OS all the time, as I would if they were on the more expensive MF or starter feed full time. My justification for this approach:

1. I have within the last year or so changed my thought process regarding the benefit of higher protein feed (MF or starter can be 18 - 22%, compared to layer at 16%). I ferment my feed anyways, and the microbial action actually increases the Methionine and Lysine, increasing the total protein content, and making it a more balanced protein (closer to the quality of animal protein) I do not often give scratch grains, so am not diluting the 16% of their FF.

2. "They say" that young or not laying birds are more at risk of gout and renal failure if kept on the high Ca++ content of a layer feed. True, that. However many folks will tell you that they keep their whole adult flock on layer feed year round, and their birds live to a ripe old age. This includes birds in molt, as well as roosters, and broody hens. In most flocks, the rooster is the healthiest bird in the flock, never succumbs to disease, and he lives to a ripe old age with good renal function and healthy joints. IMO, most roos succumb to un-natural causes. (predation or axe.) When a hen takes a break from laying, she will actually benefit from the extra Ca++ provided by the layer ration, as she needs to build her reserves for that next laying cycle. My friend Beekissed allows her youngsters to belly up to the layer feed (FF) trough any time after the age of 2 weeks. Her flock also free ranges, and does not display any of the ailments that should be caused by ingesting layer, especially at such a young age. She has a medical background, and every bird that she processes gets a thorough inspection both inside and out. Never notes any abnormalities in the kidneys.

3. Consider free range birds, whether they are on Layer or MF or Starter. The calcium content of their forage is quite high. Especially if it is a mixed bag containing many weeds. (dandelion and clover being only 2 examples) Free range birds maintain excellent health and vigor through their entire lives.

4. Layer is simply cheaper. I pay $9.99 for bare bones Back Yards Basics layer at Blue Seal. Mill date is always recent, and the Basics formulation is identical to their pricier store brand which is $2 more per bag. (You pay more for the advertising hype, and the prettier bag)

Nancy, by now, you've noticed that I did not answer your ? ! If you read a few articles pertaining to cause of gout in birds, and cause of renal failure in birds, THEN you will be in position to make your own informed choice. After doing your homework, you will be in position to state what you do, and WHY you do it, instead of being at the mercy of every differing opinion you run across.

 

[NancyNurseCxMama]

@lazy gardener---Yes, I definitely have noticed that there are as many opinions as there are people on this forum. I tend to do searches and read them all and boil them down to the ones that have had the most chickens, most experience, and most long-term successes and lean towards that advice and those opinions.
I'll be going with the layer feed, next bag. These are pets, btw, and will never see the inside of a stock pot. My concerns are long and healthy lives for them. Eggs will be a welcome benefit, of course!
I am a bit of a science nerd (retired ICU nurse who had to know WHY everything was happening, down to the cellular level) and avid seeker of scientific cause-and-effect info. Love the poultry industry site articles as they tend to focus on science and not anecdotal experiences.
Not that those anecdotal experiences are not valuable, as they so often are from those who have had many years of successful chicken raising!
Since my girls are approaching 20 weeks now I feel, after reading quite a few science-based poultry articles and sifting through posts here, that I can go with the layer feed. OS? As I previously stated only the girls who seem close to POL are showing any interest in it so again, I think I am safe there.
Thank you again, @lazy gardener ---I truly value your input!!

 

[lazy gardener]

Nancy, you would be surprised how very many chicken keepers have a back ground in the medical field. Very well represented! I myself am a PTA, and a science geek/nerd. For entertainment, as a kid, I'd grab an Encyclopedia off the shelf, and simply sit and read the many articles pertaining to the animal kingdom in each volume! Poultry keeping is right up my alley b/c it allows me to feed the need to explore, experiment, observe, and learn.

 

[GinaNew York]

I'm no expert in the vitamin/calcium dept, however, since our 13 were all a few weeks apart in age, when one laid, all got the layer formula and within three weeks, all had started, even the Brahmas - keeping a group makes it more challenging to feed and vet which we're just learning - I so value all the years of experience everyone here offers - it's real life and consequences training!

 

[GinaNew York]

I suspect that several brands use the same packer/source. I've been trying to confirm but simply have been unable. I also suspect the "machine" in question is on the 50# bagging line as they often use different lines for different size packaging. My suspicion is based on your call to mannapro who offered 5# bags as a replacement.

it seems manna pro and coastal are from the same manufacturer

 

[GinaNew York]

it seems manna pro and coastal are from the same manufacturer

update: I haven't heard from the State, but Coastal called and said that the pieces are naturally occurring and found on oysters in their beds - but so many aren't normal - I did try the magnet, and they are NOT magnetics. Wonder if it's something else used to clean equipment,