Sulmtalers Thread

[Extra Java]

Oh oooh.  This is going to turn into another "cream" debate just like what happened with the Cream Legbars.

No debate - just brainstorming...

 

[DCchicken]

No debate - just brainstorming...

No worries. I think the "Cream Wars" (as I am going to label them), caused people to start talking about Cream Legbars. So discussion/debate can be a good debate. Those of with Cream Legbars are still debating the color.

I just know people are going to start posting paint splotches any second now.

 

[Extra Java]

Pictures?!

 

[Extra Java]

Y'all do know that they aren't Silver Duckwing, but actually Silver (and Golden) Wheaten, right?

So technically, you can keep Wheaten, BW and Silver Wheaten together with no harm done. You'll just have to separate the varieties when you're hoping to hatch specific colors.

Thanks Jeremy, we really appreciate your input. We are trying to figure out what colors to officially call these birds and have come up with Silver Wheaten or perhaps Salmon, Gold Wheaten or perhaps Red Gold Wheaten, and the obvious Blue Wheaten & Silver Blue Wheaten. HOWEVER...Silver Wheaten is red enhanced...Mh. So, Salmon seems like a more appropriate name like the Faverolle.

The thing that is stumbling us is the BBR or the term "Red Wheaten" Is this still considered a "Gold Wheaten?" --is it enhanced with Mh like the "Silvers?" Is this a dumb question? Is it a confusing question? I see you used the term Silver Wheaten above... Also "Golden Wheaten".

I totally "get" Silver Wheatens I just am unable (at this point) to differentiate the term "red" and I don't know where it should be used. Game fowl? What IS a Red Wheaten? Should Sulmtaler be referred to a "Red-Gold Wheaten" ??? Does this bird have any autosomal red or it or is it only mahogany that makes this bird "red". It's not the same as a mahogany Faverole or a RIR.

Many of the males have a fiery gold in their hackles however, some have a solid "red" hackle. How are these different genetically?... What types of females do these very different males produce? From what I've read - the gold hackled males create a more "red" backed smoothly blended female but I haven't tested this. I need to know how the genes will act in my breeding program. I personally don't want to mix a bunch of colors together, I want to focus my efforts on one color but that's just me.

One can't understand how genes perform if one doesn't know what they are...after all, desired results are attained much faster.

 

[Arielle]

has anyone thought of asking walt leonard for help--he is on the breeds commiittee APA and might be able to suggest term to avoid confusion . . . I could pm him and ask . . . .


I see colors listed on javas page if i recall-- wouln't we or rather shouldn't we be using the same term as the country of origin??

the marans has problems because SOP differs from other coutries; the australian sussex if different than the US bird . . . if we want to keep the same type, imo we should keep the same language . . .

 

[Extra Java]

Yes, discussions are currently underway with the country of origin.
I'll keep the thread posted and update websites etc...

In the mean time, enjoy your birds!

 

[Extra Java]

Since this is a fairly new breed & club we are pretty happy with the growing interest and rapid progress we have been making! More to come...

Current standard:
http://www.sulmtalerusa.com/breed.html

 

[Arielle]

Is the club working with the APA breeds committee???

 

[Extra Java]

http://www.sulmtalerusa.com

 

[Arielle]

Nice!!!

I"m writing this, not to be argumentative, but to enlighten and bring up the possible perils of showing and the need to be diligent about production traits.

Walt has publicly said, and I am paraphrasing, that future inclusions to the APA will be more heavily vetted. IMO when the popularity of a breed grows too fast the quality can decrease. I also have concerns when a breeds needs to meet a physical requirement only , as in an SOP for APA, that other characteristics can be modified by either neglect or failure to actively select FOR the traits. THere is a sheep breed here in the US that is NOT allowed to show because the breed organization wants to preserve the production charcteristics.


Walt always says type first over comb, coloring, etc. When conversations get deeper, that list of one gets extended to production traits which become a list almost as long as the traits lists for the SOP.

At a show last January. Walt was kind enough to show me a few birds and share his knowledge with real live birds. My takeaway is that the important traist that make a bird a meat or egg producer funatamentally can be quickly lost.

I love the enthusism for this breed, and continue to look forward to producing some good birds with the help of the club!