Topic of the Week - Let's talk about euthanasia

[CertifiedChaser]

I feel like we are back on track here! This is after all a very heated topic and was no doubt bound to cause some conflict but I think we can all agree that euthanasia may be the right choice in some situations even if it's a very hard thing to do.

 

[ChocolateMouse]

I seriously disagree with you, but I am sure typing up several long paragraphs for you is not going to convince you no matter what kind of tone or information I use.
But I will point out that the diseases you mentioned have been bred in a domestic setting, largely by commercial operations, and killing infected birds is not going to make it go away. Even if it was eradicated, we would likely just recreate it because if anything the places that are causing these diseases are only getting worse.
I did not mean to offend anyone.

What? No, almost all of these diseases came from indo-china where chickens are native wildfowl and CAFOs are few and far between. Many of the outbreaks in the US come from small scale flocks of less than 50 birds in an outdoor setting. I wasn't just making that up to sound smart or something. I take this seriously. It's my job, my livlihood and my life. It's not just a hobby and my customers purchase from me only because I care about the welfare of my animals. Look;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newcastle_disease
http://www.usda.gov/wps/portal/usda/usdahome?contentidonly=true&contentid=avian_influenza.html
https://www.cdfa.ca.gov/ahfss/Animal_Health/newcastle_disease_info.html (Excuse me, it was in 2003 for this one.)
https://www.aphis.usda.gov/aphis/ou...ation/avian-influenza-disease/birdbiosecurity

And there's also evidence suggesting that trying to treat many of these conditions instead of immediately culling them makes the disease worse;
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/tthis-chicken-vaccine-makes-virus-dangerous/

In any case, you might be singing a different tune if your birds ever come down with AI and you are getting court orders to eradicate your flock and keep your property poultry free for years to help prevent the spread of disease. Oh, they'll pay you for it... But only if you can prove that you're using proper biosecurity including the immediate removal of sick birds from your flock.
(https://www.aphis.usda.gov/aphis/ou...l-disease-information/avian-influenza-disease)

But I digress. It certainly did sound like you were advocating letting birds waste away when they are suffering. I'm glad that's not the case. Especially since we also have to remember that chickens do everything in their power to hide their suffering because if they express it they are prone to being attacked by predators or even their healthier flock mates. It's genetically ingrained in them to keep on trucking even if it is awful for them. They are much like cats in that by the time we see an obvious symptom it's usually a problem that's causing a lot of suffering and would justify a humane end.
http://www.okawvetclinic.com/why-cats-hide-pain.pml
http://www.raising-chickens.org/sick-chickens.html
http://www.cathospitalofchicago.com...brary/pain-recognition-and-management-in-cats

Quoting the last of these pages;
"
Samantha is an eight-year-old female. She isn’t eating as much as usual and isn’t playing with her toys like she typically does.
Tiger is a two-year-old male who just had a cyst surgically removed. The incision is fairly small, but he spends a lot of time sitting hunched over in his cage, and he hisses when people come too close to him.
Mocha is a 12-year-old male with abdominal cancer. He’s eating and sleeping as much as usual, and he doesn’t cry out or flinch when his tummy is touched.
Question: Which of these cats is in pain?
Answer: All of them. Samantha has an abscessed tooth, Tiger’s incision is sore and Mocha’s cancer is terribly painful."
The same is true in chickens. I feel bad for animals having to put up with this just because they CAN keep going and the owner thinks they should. I think it's appropriate to put a bird down if they're showing signs of significant illness for this reason.

 

[MissSister]

I read the links. I just want to point out that I never mentioned treating the birds, or letting them run around with the rest of the flock with a contagious illness. I know illnesses are made more aggressive and even created when people mix in antibiotics, vaccines, and other treatments and chemicals.
I just care for the birds like they are people, or creatures with as much importance as people. So what I think should be done is naturally going to be different than what you think should be done.

 

[ChocolateMouse]

MissSister, I'm glad you read the links. However, they were there to emphasize that ANY bird with a contagious illness that is outdoors is a national food security risk and should be taken seriously. Heck, the CDC quarantined dying people from even their friends and family during the Ebola outbreak. It's not responsible to not euthanize chickens who carry contagions because they seem to be carrying on despite it, unless you have extremely strict indoor quarantine procedures... Which most people don't have the resources for.

Hence my concern with your post suggesting that's wrong to do and that the chickens should be allowed to live as long as they could carry on. The implication I was getting from your posts was that you felt that people were incorrect for suggesting euthanasia for animals that were sick and dying, but not yet physically unable to function (IE, hadn't given up the will to live or physical ability to eat yet), regardless of the condition including fatal contageous diseases. Frankly, I don't think that's an appropriate attitude for humans either. I actually wish we offered people the same mercy we give animals.
I spent a depressingly long time with a family member in a hospice facility last year, for months and months of "being able to function", so I still hold to my guns on this, euthanasia is appropriate under those circumstances even if you want to treat your chickens as your own family members. People deserve to have a humane end to their suffering as well as chickens if their lives are coming to a slow, painful end anyhow and they no longer want to experience that. I heard a lot of people who were physically able to carry on, sometimes for many months, but were in end of life situations wishing they could end it sooner. Unfortunately we have no right-to-death or death-with-dignity laws in my state so it's illegal. What a terrible experience. I know which sort of end I would choose. And so I know which end I will choose for my birds, dogs, or any animals in my care as a result.

Please don't make the mistake of thinking that people who farm animals for food haven't thought these things through, or view animals as wholely less valuable or are somehow ignorant or distanced. I already choose an end for my birds (and encourage an end for other pets and animals) that is the same end that I see as being most merciful for humans, even for my own family. I also know that a chicken can't tell us when it's in severe pain, nor will it necessarily ever show signs of pain or depression, it will just keep on carrying on no matter how difficult that life is. So by the time they have an untreatable illness like cancer, Mareks, avian flu, etc. I think it's time to put them down, especially if that illness is contagious or they are expressing obvious symptoms.

Some people will disagree. And that is their prerogative. But I can't see it as a responsible choice ever and will advocate against it.
I also advocate for following procedures layed down by the USDA, APHIS, the AMVA and other professional accredited scientific organizations. including their recommendations on when and how to euthanize.

 

[ochochicas]

For chicks or young cockerels/pullets (under 2 months) you can use starter fluid. It has ether in it, which just puts them to sleep. A side note here is this is starter fluid you'd use in a carburetor, not lighter fluid that you'd use to start a fire in a BBQ.

Put the chicks in a bucket that has an air tight lid. I use a 5 gallon (or smaller) paint bucket. Spray some starter fluid on a paper towel, put it in a small bowl or cup, place it in the bucket with the chicks, and then seat the top with the lid. They will literally just fall asleep and not wake up. Wait at least 5 minutes before opening the lid, and do it outside since the fumes will fill up your house.

The "gas method" using dry ice or carbon dioxide does not put the birds to sleep so simply. They actually suffocate as they run out of oxygen to breathe. I'm not sure that is so humane.

For bigger birds, I have a block of wood and a hatched. Carry the sick bird to the block, lay it on its side with the head on the block, and chop the neck with the hatchet. If the bird is very sick, it will probably lay still without any problem. For other birds, I do it at dawn or dusk. In darkness, they will be more still and you won't have to try to restrain them.

 

[AnneInTheBurbs]

Euthanasia is one of the cons of this wonderful hobby called chicken keeping and most, if not all of us, dread having that decision placed in our hands. When to euthanise a bird and how to go about it? On this thread I would like to ask you all's thoughts and methods on euthanasia. Specifically:

- When should it be done?
- What is the most humane and the quickest method, especially for people who have never done it before and for a much loved flock member?
- How do you handle the situation when you have children and other family involved with the flock?

I haven't read through all the posts, but I just had my first euthanasia experience this morning. Been keeping chickens about 3 years, and we just moved about a month ago. I had to start over with a new flock because the woman watching my flock of 8 had a huge predator attack. Sad, but it happens to most of us.

The other night, I finally put my younger pullets in with the older girls and turkeys in my temporary setup. It is a heavy duty carport that I have completed enclosed with welded wire fencing. Some of the younger pullets snuggled on a cinder block along the edge that night. Although nothing got into the coop, a raccoon (I suspect) grabbed them and ate the heads off of two and took one completely. In the morning, I found one more little pullet who had survived, but her leg was almost detached at the the thigh. I considered amputating, but it was such a bad injury I couldn't see how it could be done. She seemed to be fairly perky considering, so I tied a tourniquet on the leg and put her in a critter crate in a dark, warm place. She did eat and drink a little yesterday, so I thought she might pull through. But last night, I thought and considered the options. It was not fair to her, she had a terrible injury, and probably would struggle for the rest of her life to keep up with the others and avoid hawk attacks, as we have lots of forest around us. Also, she ran the probability of infection and a long healing and learning process. I knew it would be kinder to euthanize.

1. When should it be done?

When it is kinder to the animal to not suffer. My chicken was not good this morning, and I knew trying to keep her in that state with my limited medical understanding would be easier on me, but harder for her.

2. What is the most human and quickest method?

I don't know the answer to this, but I used a makeshift killing cone and a new, very sharp blade to the jugular. It was pretty quick, and I know she didn't suffer.

3. How do you handle the situation when you have children and other family involved with the flock?

I don't have children yet, so I can't say what I have done. I suspect I would shelter children from watching the act until they are a bit older, and try to explain it in the kindest and simplest way possible.


This was my first euthanasia experience, and although not pleasant, I do feel it was the kindest thing to do. I do hope to process meat chickens next year, so hopefully this has prepared me a bit for it. Thanks for reading. This is a touch topic.

 

[azjustin]

I'd like to add a few things I didn't see in this thread so far.

- When should it be done?
When you get the twinge of "maybe we should end it's life". Not two weeks later, also not at the earliest onset of a problem. It seems like people always want to either let things fester till almost death, or cull at the immediate moment of uncertainty. There has to be an in-between.

- What is the most humane and the quickest method, especially for people who have never done it before and for a much loved flock member?
Cervical dislocation, or just removal of the brain from the spinal column, always. We are within city limits so shooting is illegal, but there are many .177 and .22 air rifles that are legal and are far more potent than a .22 rifle. Put the afflicted into a cardboard box, line up the back of the skull to the eyes, pull the trigger and close the box.

NOT ASPHYXIATION!! Please stop with the CO2 killing!

I have almost died twice in my life from asphyxiation: once drowning, once lack of oxygen under snow. It is a horrible, painful, agonizing, miserable experience and I would never wish it upon any living being.

Yes, WATCHING something die from a lack of oxygen is a "peaceful" process as there is no major thrashing around and the animal closes it's eyes and appears to go to sleep. However, if my experiences are even remotely close, it is only a peaceful death for the watcher, not the animal.

- How do you handle the situation when you have children and other family involved with the flock?
We just tell them what it is. Young children have no idea what real death is and are probably more curious than afraid, and that is a good time to educate them on the circle of life. Chicken does not grow on a styrofoam plate in the supermarket and our children understand that. The son wants to help process and the daughter is hell bent on being there for the processing; I'm very proud of them, but would never force it on them.

Hopefully some of this helps.

 

[Beekissed]

Euthanasia is one of the cons of this wonderful hobby called chicken keeping and most, if not all of us, dread having that decision placed in our hands. When to euthanise a bird and how to go about it? On this thread I would like to ask you all's thoughts and methods on euthanasia. Specifically:

- When should it be done?
- What is the most humane and the quickest method, especially for people who have never done it before and for a much loved flock member?
- How do you handle the situation when you have children and other family involved with the flock?



For a complete list of our Topic of the Week threads, see here: https://www.backyardchickens.com/a/topic-of-the-week-thread-archive

When should it be done?

When their quality of life is diminished to a degree that they cannot normally perform all the things a chicken can normally perform~roosting, walking normally, flocking with the rest of the birds, escape/hide effectively from predators, keep themselves adequately warm, fed and watered. When they are obviously ill~hunkered down, dull in appearance and action, fluffed up, easily caught in the daytime, not flocking normally with the rest of the birds~I'll give such birds a day or so to possibly rectify the situation on their own, if possible, but if they worsen in those 2 days, I'll go ahead and give them mercy.

I don't use the criteria "they are eating, drinking and walking around" as a gauge of quality of life....a chicken can do all those things and still be unable to roost, run from a predator, flock along with the rest of them as they forage over the land, and keep themselves adequately fed, watered and warm in cold weather due to any number of things~injury, lameness, illness, etc.

The most humane and quickest death?

Dislocation of the cervical spine, if the bird is not going to be eaten...if to be eaten, it's quick and easy to slit the vessels in the neck and let it bleed out. This can be done in various ways, each as effective as the other.

How to handle it when kids are involved?

I think it's important that children of all ages to be aware that death is a part of life and, when someone takes an animal in their care, being able to give it a quick and merciful death is a HUGE part of that responsibility. They should know what to look for in making the decision to kill the animal and they need to know how to kill it effectively so as to give it a good end. In short, they should be a part of every step of putting an animal down if they are to grow up strong and practical in their view of life and the life of the animals in their care. My boys have been a part of every aspect of animal care and have taken part in putting animals down.

All people need to understand the full scope of stewardship of another creature and all the responsibilities that come along with that, no matter one's sex or age. If you are old enough to care for an animal, you are old enough and should be responsible enough to carry that responsibility unto death. If more people understood that, an incredible number of animals would not be suffering like they do each day due to the lack of fortitude on the part of their owners. Caring about their life also means caring about their death and making it a quick and merciful one.