trapping and disposing

[usbr]

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This is so untrue. Once a pecking order and territories are created, they are pretty set. The alpha animal is usually in that place for many years. Dump a strange/new animal in the mix and it will be picked on by every animal of it species till it gets tired and dies. This has been proven over and over. Just because you didnt physically put a bullet in the animals head, doesnt mean you didnt just kill it when you drove it far away and released it, you just didnt see it because the suffering went on after you left. Of course, we cant forget the spreading of disease, a major problem with some animals. Why do you think its illegal in some states to "relocate" them? You think the state DNR is just some version on the opposite spectrum of PETA? No, it has been proven time and again that moving animals causes more problems (disease spread, slow death due to other animal aggression, lack of adiquite food, animal being dropped off where it is a problem for other humains, ect.) than just humainly ending the nuisance animals life.

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Please cite your source (city and state at least), this goes against the majority of data I have seen. I have, of course, seen data from some pretty fringe groups that twist data so it lines up as much as possable with thier political desires but I am hoping you are refering to a reasonable study and not one of those.

Quote:
I think I understand now. You have no clue how a person drowns an animal yet you are saying a person shouldnt do it. Got it. Its pretty apparent from that statement alone that you have the belief that no animal needs to be killed and coupled with your argument that animals should be "relocated" (IE. die a slow painful death) tells where you stand on the issue.

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Anybody who thinks you can just reach in a trap, grab the animal and pull it out, then pop it in the head with a hammer, clearly, has not trapped much. Anybody that thinks they can is welcome to my next coon. I will even make it more safe, I will stand in the back of the truck will a cell phone at the ready for 911. Only drawback is, I am a half hour drive for the EMTs to get here and I will probally be video taping the folly and laughing my butt off so that could even delay the EMTs a little more. You could probally prevent the EMT dispatch by just bashing your hand 50 times because thats where the coons teeth will be and the teeth are right near the brain so it will be easy to aim (just hit the excrutiating pain in your hand). You will get a cool nickname out of the deal too, everybody will call you "lefty" and making these funny hammer motions with thier hands when they see you in public so its not all bad.


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You are not the first person to mention calling and asking to have a conservation officer come out to take care of a trapped animal but for the vast majority of the states, they will just tell you to take care of the nusiance animal yourself. Thats why the states allow a landowner or occupant to legally take care of it. I live in the 10th or 11th highest taxed state and our conservation officers frequiently have to not drive thier trucks a few days of the week so they will have money in the budgets to drive come hunting season (gas prices have skyrocketed around here).
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Where do you live anyway? I am betting you are not following the law by your "relocating" (slow death). (BTW, there are ways to approch a skunk and release them from a trap but I am sure you are gonna start moving them around if I tell you, so www.google.com)

 

[Yonaton]

usbr wrote (in quotes):

I think I understand now. You have no clue how a person drowns an animal yet you are saying a person shouldnt do it. Got it. Its pretty apparent from that statement alone that you have the belief that no animal needs to be killed and coupled with your argument that animals should be "relocated" (IE. die a slow painful death) tells where you stand on the issue.

It's extremely apparent that you *don't* "understand now". I asked out of curiosity how the people on here who posted that they drown the critters they trap *how* they do it. If your reading comprehension were any better, you'd have seen that I do put down animals when I cannot relocate. I also hunt for much of my food to fill my freezer as much as I can. Tell me....if drowning is such a painless, humane death, why don't we use drowning in death sentences on criminals? It'd be cheap, right? I'll tell you why it's not used. Because it's inhumane and painful! Many countries know that it *IS* a good form of torture though. Is it 'humane' that someone takes a bunch of kittens they don't want, puts them in a tow sack and tosses it in the river? What if someone did that with a clutch of chicks they didn't need or want?

Reading that lame statement of yours I quoted was proof enough I didn't need to read anything more in your post, since ignorance (make sure you look that word up, it does *NOT* mean 'stupid') seemed to be the rule in most of it up to and including that paragraph .

Oh, by the way, the cites can be found on the internet, but much of it isn't online yet. I know it's been done *here*, in my neck of the woods, because I was always talking with our wildlife management crew in this county and know the game warden personally (the old one, the new one that's been here for the past two years is hard to get a hold of, since 3 counties around mine decided they didn't need a game warden and the state said this new one needed to cover all four counties by himself. Yes...it seems most governments (local, state, country, etc) are run by morons), and was always asking them to let me know when they were going to do things like this, which they most of the time did. Look up relocation of 'bad' animals, like trouble bears. Yes, sometimes it just doesn't work, but just as often it does, because...TADA...the animals actually work things out! They may fight and/or squabble, but things get worked out. And yes, territories get challenged and changed *ALL THE TIME* in the wild. What...you actually think a coon on its deathbed from old age can fight off a new, young coon that's moving out of its old territory into the old coon's territory? You think the old coon has a line drawing of his territory in a safe place and the young coon will know exactly what territory it now needs to defend once it kills/usurps the old coon?​

 

[Carole AM]

MODERATORS! Please lock this before anyone gets hurt.

No need to get upset because someone asked a question.

 

[silkiechicken]

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I second this motion. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but please, keep calm.

Maybe we should make a debate section of the fourm for contriversial arguments so they do not need to be in the main section of the forum.

 

[usbr]

Well Lefty, I bet you work for the goverment then...

I dont think anybody but you ever mention an animal such as a bear, just you and thats a classic strawman argument and it just dont fly. Yes coons do make challanges to the pecking order and it does result in death as a old coon aint going to move to a new area and survive. If he cant make it in an area where a younger animal challanges his possision, he sure anit going to make it if he moves to a new area and has to fight everybody in order to find his place. The same effect can be made by dumping a coon in a new area. Sorry, thats just the way it is. (Slick how you glossed over the whole desease thing too)

I know you read my whole post, even though you said you didnt. I have no other option to think that you cant reasonably argue my statements, but I am still courious where you live and where I can find the sourses that "relocating" (slow death) animals near you has worked. Again, we are not talking bears here, not even wolves, both of those are not fair compairsons as they are such low populations to not have the same pressures as other animals.

Carole AM, nobody is getting hurt, no need for moderators. Threads sometimes shift a little from how they origionally start and its important that people get to see things to the conclution. If you dont like where this is going, maybe you dont need to read anymore of it. It seems clear to me that the origional poster could use some of the information that is comming out of this thread. Ending threads early just puts a gag on that information and I am hoping this is a helpful website. Clearly, the help is needed at times.

HTH

 

[Alleyoops25]

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I second this motion. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but please, keep calm.

Maybe we should make a debate section of the fourm for contriversial arguments so they do not need to be in the main section of the forum.

I third the motion. usbr and yonaton you both need to stop trolling each other. Niether one of you are making any point you guiys are just slinging mudd at each other . I am suprised thet this thread is still open. CAlm down everyone, take some deep breathes and then button it and go somewhere else here and talk about you wonderful birds.

 

[usbr]

Alleyoops25, please stop trolling this thread and please stop with the personal attacks towards me (IE. saying I am slinging mud). The OP asked questions and I answered them as well as engaged follow up discussion regaurding specifics. That is not trolling or mudslinging.

I would however, say you may be considered trolling by bringing up this thread after it sits for 3 days with no replies as an attempt to re-open it. I also find it highly ironic that you tell me to take a deep breath and button it but you feel the need to revive a thread that was off the first page...

peace all...

 

[allen wranch]

The end...