Urgent help with puppy guarding geese and chickens

[ZeebaK]

Hi there,
So I´m volunteering on a farm and work in the vegetable garden. Next to this is an enclosure for adult non laying chickens and geese and goslings. There is a 3 month old large guardian dog puppy chained in with them. He is on the chain 24 hours a day. The farm staff come in for 5 minutes a day to check on water, food and the birds. When I am in the garden I always cross over and let the puppy off the chain and try and be with him for at least half an hour a day. He´s a very relaxed and obedient puppy even though he has had not training. The man who is in charge of the animals on the farm says that the puppy is supposed to guard the birds from aerial raptors and that this is the way to teach them. He will then put a shock collar on the dog a couple of times and shock him if he goes for the birds. I found a couple of dead goslings the past mornings. Even though the dog is on the chain, the birds need to go past him to get to the water. If the farm staff find out that he has killed a couple of birds, then he will get beaten. I removed them. I spoke to a local dog trainer who told me that - of course it is illegal to chain up a dog in this way and that - the dog needs the electric collar training to start as soon as possible. And that it may take a long time and to be patient. I don´t want the dog to get beaten. He´s a good puppy, but tied up like this with no training is not going to work.
Is the only answer the electric collar? How do I use this? He´s in there all day, do I have to watch him from a distance all day? How do you know how much to shock them? Does it hurt them a lot?
Any advice is much appreciated.

 

[orloffer]

@chickentrains ?

 

[chickentrains]

Electric collars are abusive, and so is the way they are training. All they are going to get out of this "training" is an extremely fearful, and possibly human reactive and or aggressive dog. Call Animal control and try and get the dog removed. That is NO way to treat a dog.

 

[HollyOakFarm]

My opinion: what they are doing isn't that unusual but.... I would never chain a dog out long term. A young LGD can be penned near the animals that they are supposed to eventually watch. It can be out loose *supervised* with the animals they are supposed to watch. It's asking too much of a puppy under 1-1/2 to 2 years old to watch birds, especially solo. Killing a few at this age, unsupervised, isn't the end of the world, they can grow out of it with guidance. A shock collar is humane if used correctly. I have one 7 year old LGD (Pyrenees x Maremma) and one 4 month old LGD (Pyrenees x Kangal) - and the 4 month old is not allowed out with the livestock without someone around to keep tabs on her. I haven't had to use a shock collar on any of my dogs, but they are all individuals.

The tough part is, it isn't your dog. Maybe suggest a pen, not chained, in with the birds - being sure it has adequate shelter, food, water. Then if you are around, let it out supervised regularly. I'm sorry you are in this situation.

 

[ZeebaK]

I have just ordered a vibration/sound collar. I can at least see if we can start with that. Thanks so much for the advice. It´s all v sad and unfortunate and I am due to leave next week, which makes it even more difficult. I´d take him with me, but I´ve seen the father dog and he´s 80 kilos..
I can try and find someone on the farm to take the training on.

 

[danceswithronin]

It's quite common for livestock guardian dogs to be trained in a "hands-off" way, as they're supposed to bond/imprint with their flock or herd rather than humans. I think the shock collars are a little extreme but it wouldn't surprise me if something like that is actually recommended to people who are training a young LGD as a strong deterrent to train them quickly not to go after livestock if they're inclined to it.

 

[cassie]

The people on the farm know nothing whatever about guardian dogs, and maybe nothing about dogs in general. In my humble opinion they shouldn't have one. The dogs protect what they are bonded to. The chances of this dog bonding to the poultry are slim and none. Beating the dog is a terrible idea. The only thing beating the dog is going to teach him is to fear the handler, and, if pushed, he may even retaliate. This is a no win situation for all involved.