Wenger Feeds

[Sefirothe]

Has anyone used Wenger’s feeds? Or from the bag tag does this look like an OK feed?

I work just down the road from Stromberg’s Wilkes Barre location so I had been buying feed from ADM (Pen Pal’s line) there. When I went this week they were out of layer and only had grower or gamebird.

I went to the next closest to me small local feed store and they only had Wenger’s in stock. There’s a lot number but no mill date that I can find on the tag. I'm not sure if the lot number is supposed to translate into a mill date? Tag is pictured below.

I haven’t opened the bag yet since I still have about couple days left of their last bag of ADM feed.

Just wondering what anyone else’s experience is with it. I tried searching here but didn’t turn up much about Wenger’s, seems to be a mostly Pennsylvanian company.

 

[SmiYa0126]

https://www.wengerfeeds.com/products/feeds/layer-feed/
Maybe you could teach out to them? The site looks legit.

I'm in PA as well. I buy my feed from panorama feed in oley.

 

[Sally PB]

@U_Stormcrow, this is right up your alley.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

So.... No complaints about the crude protein level, though the AA profile is off, so some will be wasted. Lysine is good, high for a layer formulation. In theory (and supported by studies), increased lysine is associated with improvements (small) in rate of lay, and overall egg weight, but almost no effect on the contents of the individual eggs. However, its a matter of diminishing returns. Definitely beneficial. Economically worthwhile??? Probably not. Methionine is low (remember I said the AA profile is off?) While Lys is above the most recent minimum recondations for HyLine layers (0.8 or 0.85 depending on source), Met level is below recent recommends (0.35, 0.38, 0.40, again, source dependent). Met is needed for protein formation and is particularly associated with connective tissues.

Fat and Fiber both look good. Calcium is at a level appropriate for production hens in their prime, high for non-production breeds, particularly older non-production breeds, but not likely to be damaging unless you have a very low production bird 0 and even then, it will take time. Phos is good -and will help buffer excess Ca concerns in less than prolific layers. Salt/Sodium is a BIG range. That's concerning, but not critical. You want to see sodium about 0.15 to maybe 0.25, which equates to salt of 0.3 to 0.5. In all likelilhood, chickens will compensate by increasing water intake.

The bottom 75% of the ingredient list, likely starting witht he moncalcium phosphate (another calcium source not as damaging long term as calcium carbonate) is almost certainly a commercial vitamin premix. I admit I couldn't tell you whose brand of pre-mix it is.

tl,dr? Would I use it? Yes. Would I look for a product that had more Met at the expense of a little less Lys (and even CP) if I could find it at superior price point? Also yes.

My opinion only, for what its worth.

 

[Kiki]

The feed tag looks just fine to me. Nice price too.

 

[Sefirothe]

So.... No complaints about the crude protein level, though the AA profile is off, so some will be wasted. Lysine is good, high for a layer formulation. In theory (and supported by studies), increased lysine is associated with improvements (small) in rate of lay, and overall egg weight, but almost no effect on the contents of the individual eggs. However, its a matter of diminishing returns. Definitely beneficial. Economically worthwhile??? Probably not. Methionine is low (remember I said the AA profile is off?) While Lys is above the most recent minimum recondations for HyLine layers (0.8 or 0.85 depending on source), Met level is below recent recommends (0.35, 0.38, 0.40, again, source dependent). Met is needed for protein formation and is particularly associated with connective tissues.

Fat and Fiber both look good. Calcium is at a level appropriate for production hens in their prime, high for non-production breeds, particularly older non-production breeds, but not likely to be damaging unless you have a very low production bird 0 and even then, it will take time. Phos is good -and will help buffer excess Ca concerns in less than prolific layers. Salt/Sodium is a BIG range. That's concerning, but not critical. You want to see sodium about 0.15 to maybe 0.25, which equates to salt of 0.3 to 0.5. In all likelilhood, chickens will compensate by increasing water intake.

The bottom 75% of the ingredient list, likely starting witht he moncalcium phosphate (another calcium source not as damaging long term as calcium carbonate) is almost certainly a commercial vitamin premix. I admit I couldn't tell you whose brand of pre-mix it is.

tl,dr? Would I use it? Yes. Would I look for a product that had more Met at the expense of a little less Lys (and even CP) if I could find it at superior price point? Also yes.

My opinion only, for what its worth.

Thanks for the in depth review! If the chickens like it I will probably stick with it, as long as the feed store keeps it in stock. I like supporting local business, both the feed store and the mill.

I think the lot number breaks down to the first three digits are the Julian date and the last three digits are the year. So that'd make the mill date August 28, 2023 which is also not bad at all. I sent the mill an email to ask if that's how to get the mill date for sure.

Would it be worth looking for a methionine supplement to add if such a thing even exists for chickens?

 

[Kiki]

Would it be worth looking for a methionine supplement to add if such a thing even exists for chickens?

No.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

Thanks for the in depth review! If the chickens like it I will probably stick with it, as long as the feed store keeps it in stock. I like supporting local business, both the feed store and the mill.

I think the lot number breaks down to the first three digits are the Julian date and the last three digits are the year. So that'd make the mill date August 28, 2023 which is also not bad at all. I sent the mill an email to ask if that's how to get the mill date for sure.

Would it be worth looking for a methionine supplement to add if such a thing even exists for chickens?

As Kiki said, NO.

The difference between what is there, and what iss probably optimal is VERY small. How small? an additional 0.05% would be my target in a layer formulation. That's less than 1 oz in 100# of feed - no way you could effectively mix that thoroughly. Even if you could, while you can by L-Lysine over the counter at any large grocer or health food store, you can't buy DL-Methionine that way.

I am NOT a proponent of trying to make your own feeds, or to "fix" feeds by at home additions. That's why, knowing what I know, I'd use the feed you linked above, but would keep my eye out for a superior product at or below that price point.

Theory is good, but a healthy dose of pragmatism is superior. "Good enough" is, indeed, good enough. Until something better comes along.

 

[Sefirothe]

As Kiki said, NO.

The difference between what is there, and what iss probably optimal is VERY small. How small? an additional 0.05% would be my target in a layer formulation. That's less than 1 oz in 100# of feed - no way you could effectively mix that thoroughly. Even if you could, while you can by L-Lysine over the counter at any large grocer or health food store, you can't buy DL-Methionine that way.

I am NOT a proponent of trying to make your own feeds, or to "fix" feeds by at home additions. That's why, knowing what I know, I'd use the feed you linked above, but would keep my eye out for a superior product at or below that price point.

Theory is good, but a healthy dose of pragmatism is superior. "Good enough" is, indeed, good enough. Until something better comes along.

True enough. If it aint broke (badly at least) dont fix it.

 

[U_Stormcrow]

True enough. If it aint broke (badly at least) dont fix it.

Welcome to BYC, btw. You're going to do well here