What colour eggs should our 'Copper Blue Maran / Cream LegBar cross' actually lay ??

[Cebarmlds]

I am not sure she is “pure”.

I thought the leg color might be off.

I am guessing someone “put” something in her lineage to enhance a trait. Sometimes Show people do that..


I might have done that once or twice myself,,,, maybe.

A few years ago I was forced to “tinker” with my Chanticlers. I had a great Pullet. She had taken Best of breed at a large show.

The next morning when I checked on her she had laid her first egg.... green/olive.

I asked a friend what I should do, he said toss the egg and say nothing.

@erlibrd owns her as I didn’t want the egg color coming back in future generations. She is Erlibrd’s favorite bird, a beautiful olive egg laying Chanticler. She even named her princess, because she loves her so much.

The point of this story is a bird does not always reveal its heritage by looks alone. Even Judges can be fooled. We have SOPs and not pedigrees. So a bird is what she looks like, unless egg color gives them away..

The OP’s bird, no offense meant here, is not a show quality bird, so I would keep her and never hatch an egg from her, unless she has attitude problem. You might love her as much as Erlibrd loves Princess..

I love Princess but she has never loved me, she loves her first love and that is Ralphie.

 

[duluthralphie]

I love Princess but she has never loved me, she loves her first love and that is Ralphie.

 

[BigFuzzball]

We're not bothered at all whether 'pure' bred or not as for us it's the look of the bird and her character (in this case placid, friendly & with the comical quiff) although she has taken on full size crows & wood pigeons that've ventured in the run stealing food and had to be pulled off the poor bedraggled intruders - she's fiercely loyal and protective in a way we've only seen from our (big) Light Sussex when helping me chase/catch a large rat
Admittedly felt slightly cheated when no CLB blue egg but wouldn't swap her & her creamy-pink almost indestructible little eggs !

 

[GaryDean26]

Oh @GaryDean26 could help too??

The Fenton Blue is a commercial hybrid bred by Fenton Farms in Devon, UK. It is made from Cream Legbars crossed with other breeds and depending on the cross should lay blue or green eggs. There are a bunch of Fenton Farm Hybrids that are made from other crosses and lay different colors of eggs (i.e. the Fenton Rose, Fenton Brown, etc.). It doesn't look like Fenton farms is selling hens anymore and are just focuses on selling Pink, green, and blue free-range eggs now.

As far are your legbar laying pink eggs goes. There are a few possibilities.

1) She has the pink egg gene that is seen in Auracana chickens. I am not sure exactly how that gene works but there was and Article titled "Easter Egg Chickens" in the Septemeber 1948 National Geographic on auracana chickens and the breeder that the article was on got blue, Green, and pink eggs from his line. The Awsome Auracana Chicken website also shows blue, green, and pink eggs from there line of Auracana Chickens. There line is one over the oldest closed lines in the country. I think that flock has been line breed for something like 45 years. So...the old lines of Auracans had pink eggs. I have personally seen pinks spots on the outside of the shell of the eggs from a few of our Cream Legbar hens. I assume they are carriers for the pink egg gene and that if inbreed we might be able to get eggs that had the pink coating to cover the whole egg. The inside of the egg is still blue though so unless you are seeing a blue shell with a pink outer coating that is probably not what is going on with your hen.

2) She could be lacking the Blue Egg gene. When I cross the Cream Legbar with other breeds that lay a light-colored egg they the offspring will lay a blue egg but it is much paler in color than the pure Cream Legbars. I assume this is from only having a single copy of the blue Egg Gene and not being pure breed for the blue egg gene. Some of out Cream Legbars get the same light-colored eggs (we cull them) and I think that they also are lacking a blue egg gene even though both their parents are Cream Legbars. So..I think that there are some Cream Legbars in the gene pool that are lacking a copy of the blue egg gene. I have never seen a non-blue egg from out Legbars, but know that some people have got not blue egg proving that some of the birds in the Legbar Gene Pool are lacking a copy of the blue egg gene. I think that could be what is going on with your Cream Legbar Hen. I think that both of her parents were only carrying one blue egg gene and that she ended up without a blue egg gene.

3) She also could be a cross, but that would still require her Legbar Parent to only be carrying on blue egg gene since the Blue Egg Gene is dominant.

 

[BigFuzzball]

The Fenton Blue is a commercial hybrid bred by Fenton Farms in Devon, UK. It is made from Cream Legbars crossed with other breeds and depending on the cross should lay blue or green eggs. There are a bunch of Fenton Farm Hybrids that are made from other crosses and lay different colors of eggs (i.e. the Fenton Rose, Fenton Brown, etc.). It doesn't look like Fenton farms is selling hens anymore and are just focuses on selling Pink, green, and blue free-range eggs now.

As far are your legbar laying pink eggs goes. There are a few possibilities.

1) She has the pink egg gene that is seen in Auracana chickens. I am not sure exactly how that gene works but there was and Article titled "Easter Egg Chickens" in the Septemeber 1948 National Geographic on auracana chickens and the breeder that the article was on got blue, Green, and pink eggs from his line. The Awsome Auracana Chicken website also shows blue, green, and pink eggs from there line of Auracana Chickens. There line is one over the oldest closed lines in the country. I think that flock has been line breed for something like 45 years. So...the old lines of Auracans had pink eggs. I have personally seen pinks spots on the outside of the shell of the eggs from a few of our Cream Legbar hens. I assume they are carriers for the pink egg gene and that if inbreed we might be able to get eggs that had the pink coating to cover the whole egg. The inside of the egg is still blue though so unless you are seeing a blue shell with a pink outer coating that is probably not what is going on with your hen.

2) She could be lacking the Blue Egg gene. When I cross the Cream Legbar with other breeds that lay a light-colored egg they the offspring will lay a blue egg but it is much paler in color than the pure Cream Legbars. I assume this is from only having a single copy of the blue Egg Gene and not being pure breed for the blue egg gene. Some of out Cream Legbars get the same light-colored eggs (we cull them) and I think that they also are lacking a blue egg gene even though both their parents are Cream Legbars. So..I think that there are some Cream Legbars in the gene pool that are lacking a copy of the blue egg gene. I have never seen a non-blue egg from out Legbars, but know that some people have got not blue egg proving that some of the birds in the Legbar Gene Pool are lacking a copy of the blue egg gene. I think that could be what is going on with your Cream Legbar Hen. I think that both of her parents were only carrying one blue egg gene and that she ended up without a blue egg gene.

3) She also could be a cross, but that would still require her Legbar Parent to only be carrying on blue egg gene since the Blue Egg Gene is dominant.

Hi Gary, that's very kind of you to both research, explain and type all that !
As I'd said previously, I searched back as far as I could and, with the help of the pics I found what not only looked like we believed a CLB to look like, going on the one we have, but the pics could have been taken in our garden of our chicken ! And there was the picture label saying it was a 'Fenton' which led to a small paragraph on where these came from but nothing like you've explained and which now makes a lot more sense !
The breeder gave a clue she's not just a CLB with the name 'Needwood Blue LegBar' but as in the past we've had 60% hybrids from a local supplier we knew nothing of a CLB anyway until we got home, but, the breeder & supplier were adamant, even after she'd laid her first pink-tint egg, that she should definitely be laying blue, hence the 'Needwood Blue' part of the name.....hmmmmm !!
It's definitely a pink-tint, eggs approx only 2cm long, very strong shells, but no blue colouring inside. Will try again to get better pics and send some - 4 different phones with good cameras and another 4 cameras between us I'm sure we can do at least one eh !
Once again, thanks for your help, time and effort, it really is appreciated and I've had to read it out loud to the family as Lexi our CLB / Fenton Rose ?? is a real favourite !

 

[GaryDean26]

Hi Gary, that's very kind of you to both research, explain and type all that !
As I'd said previously, I searched back as far as I could and, with the help of the pics I found what not only looked like we believed a CLB to look like, going on the one we have, but the pics could have been taken in our garden of our chicken ! And there was the picture label saying it was a 'Fenton' which led to a small paragraph on where these came from but nothing like you've explained and which now makes a lot more sense !
The breeder gave a clue she's not just a CLB with the name 'Needwood Blue LegBar' but as in the past we've had 60% hybrids from a local supplier we knew nothing of a CLB anyway until we got home, but, the breeder & supplier were adamant, even after she'd laid her first pink-tint egg, that she should definitely be laying blue, hence the 'Needwood Blue' part of the name.....hmmmmm !!
It's definitely a pink-tint, eggs approx only 2cm long, very strong shells, but no blue colouring inside. Will try again to get better pics and send some - 4 different phones with good cameras and another 4 cameras between us I'm sure we can do at least one eh !
Once again, thanks for your help, time and effort, it really is appreciated and I've had to read it out loud to the family as Lexi our CLB / Fenton Rose ?? is a real favourite !

10 years ago the Fenton Blues were a very popular blue egg hybird in the UK. I was a member of a Cream Legbar Breeders online forum based out of the UK and many people posted and talked about their Fenton Blue along with their Columbine, Skyline, Cotswold Legbar, and other commercial Hybirds. I checked on the Fenton Farm webpage yesterday and it says they are no longer selling hens. I wonder how many of the other Hybirds from 10 years ago and becomeing a thing of the past. I got a nice letter back from the creator of the Skylines. I am gussing he passed away shortly after that. He was on Hospice then he wrote me. The Creator of the Cotswold was in regular contact with me for a year or so. He developed that hybird for an egg dealer and wasn't doing much with them anymore so that he didn't interfere with the egg dealer. I don't know what he is doing now, but his website his still up. The creator of the Cotswold send me photos of his Hybirds. He have maby hens that we not "cream" in color showing that they were in deed crosses and not pure Cream Legbars. He said that he would only ever breed a cream colored male. The assumption there was that if he had a cream male it would be pure for both the blue egg gene and the Cream Plumage, but that if it were gold (non-cream) then it would have the potential of having a missing gene for the blue eggs and when breed tohis hens that were crossed and only carrying one dlue egg gene that there would be the possibility of some of the pullets not laying blue eggs. I am guessing that the Needwood farm is making similar assumptions but their source for cream Legbars is not as pure as the source used to make the Cotswold legbars and they are getting males that are not purebred for the Blue egg gene and they are producing hybirds that are not laying blue eggs.

 

[Mixed flock enthusiast]

Two years ago, we purchased several CCLs from a breeder who showed her line and was involved in getting the breed recognized. Pic is one as a pullet. As hens they all laid blue eggs. However, we wanted these hens in order to breed our own olive eggers. When we bred a CCL hen to a BCM rooster, we ended up with three pullets that all lay pinkish eggs, with no blue. So, the CCL hen must have been heterozygous for the blue egg shell gene. I’ve since wondered how common this is in US CCL lines.

 

[GaryDean26]

Two years ago, we purchased several CCLs from a breeder who showed her line and was involved in getting the breed recognized. Pic is one as a pullet. As hens they all laid blue eggs. However, we wanted these hens in order to breed our own olive eggers. When we bred a CCL hen to a BCM rooster, we ended up with three pullets that all lay pinkish eggs, with no blue. So, the CCL hen must have been heterozygous for the blue egg shell gene. I’ve since wondered how common this is in US CCL lines.

I was confused for a second. I thought that you meant that the breeder you got your stock from was claiming that the CCLs were now recognized and that they helped make it happen. No there are NOT recognized yet, but yes there are people "involved" in trying to get them recognized. It may have been lonnyandrinda. They are in the Tulsa area (currently in Coweta) and were one of the four original members of the Cream Legbar Club along with RedChicken9 from California, Chickat in Texas and me.

 

[Mixed flock enthusiast]

I was confused for a second. I thought that you meant that the breeder you got your stock from was claiming that the CCLs were now recognized and that they helped make it happen. No there are NOT recognized yet, but yes there are people "involved" in trying to get them recognized. It may have been lonnyandrinda. They are in the Tulsa area (currently in Coweta) and were one of the four original members of the Cream Legbar Club along with RedChicken9 from California, Chickat in Texas and me.

Yes, that’s what I was trying to say. I included that information to differentiate these birds from hatchery birds, where it might not be surprising to get some unexpected genetics.