What do you think about medicated Chick crumbles?

[Back2Roots]

Very true. There are tons of people that don't give medicated starter and don't need it. But they take other measures, starting with what you said. There is a lot of value also in giving yogurt, buttermilk, Kefir, or clabbered milk in preventing cocci. Either way is good as far as I'm concerned. In my last post, I just wanted to try to clear up what the "medication" in medicated food is. It's not a drug like you'd think of such as antibiotic. It won't cause super germs to develop or anything. It just inhibits a protien or something (forget now exactly which but you can google it and find out) of the cocci itself to slow them down.

Thanks for the clarification, much appreciated. I guess it boils down to personal choice, really, like you said. Maybe doing both (yogurt, etc., AND medicated starter) would be like extra insurance.

 

[ClareScifi]

I give my chooks yogurt. They love it.

If any of them had died of coccidiosis and I had not given them the medicated food, I would blame myself for not having done everything I could to try to prevent it.

Luckily, none did. If any die of it anyway, at least I'll know I did what I could...

That's how I look at it, anyway.

It's Marek's I worry about. Not having vaccinated my little Bantie on day one. I didn't know about it until it was too late. But so far, she's beaten the odds, unvaccinated. So that is wonderful!

Clare

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

From what I've read, it is probably over-kill for the average backyard flock. It may do more harm than good. Backyard chickens don't have the same crowded living conditions and stresses that commercial flocks do, so they are far less likely to get infections of any kind. Plus, you are killing off the good bacteria. Most bacteria are not harmful and the chicks, like humans, need their good bacteria. Think about what happens when humans take antibiotics and they end up with diarrhea (because the normal gut bacteria are killed off) or yeast infections (because the normal vaginal bacteria get killed off, letting the normal yeast go crazy).

Quote:
Amprolium, which is what is in most medicated starters is a coccidiastat, not an antibiotic. Coccidia are protozoa, not bacteria. http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/200800.htm

Some medicated starters used to contain BMD--and some brands may still use it--which IS an antibiotic. Studies have shown that it is quite effective at promoting weight growth of the chicks, and at preventing necrotic enteritis, which can reach fatal levels before symptoms are seen. http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/201200.htm

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

Quote: It blocks thiamine, which coccidia need in large quantity to reproduce.

There are many who believe, and studies that back it up, that products containing lactose do more harm than good to chickens. Their bodies do not have the ability to digest lactose. Personally I am pretty much a believer in moderation--and I do give mine live-culture yogurt on occasion, and have not seen problems. I think you can go overboard on just about anything, including absolute avoidance.

 

[ClareScifi]

I wonder about the dairy products, too. I have read about the supposed lactose intolerance. But the chickens enjoy it so much. I give them only about a tablespoon of it once a week. I just buy the cheapest plain yogurt at the store, not a fancy brand. I'm not sure it's as good, but since I'm not sure it's wise to give them, anyway, I don't worry too much about it. I just buy regular ACV for them, too, not the kind with Mother in it. A middle-of-the-road approach here.

I did buy them organic food last summer, but they sure didn't like it. It mostly went to waste. Even the wild birds wouldn't eat it. So I'm back to nonorganic.

This morning I gave them some of their own hard-boiled eggs. They love those! And they are big on greens. I buy a spring mix at the store.

 

[galanie]

Sonoran Silkies said:

There are many who believe, and studies that back it up, that products containing lactose do more harm than good to chickens. Their bodies do not have the ability to digest lactose. Personally I am pretty much a believer in moderation--and I do give mine live-culture yogurt on occasion, and have not seen problems.


What products containing lactose? In the studies I mean. And was it pasteurized milk? Did they use yogurt or just one lactose containing thing and draw the conclusion that all milks cause problems? And how old are the studies? Because it's already been shown, but only in the last couple of years, that Raw Milk causes chickens and even "lactose intolerant" people no problems because the enzymes needed to digest it is right there in the milk itself. These enzymes are destroyed in the process of pasteurization. Also the type of milks I've listed are all cultured milks, except the clabbered, which you really can only make with raw milk. Cultured milks don't' have lactose, it's been changed to a digestible form. Why else would the lactose intolerant be told to eat yogurt and buttermilk?

There's more than one reference around to using cultured milk products to prevent cocci. It's said to be quite effective.

PS - I give mine some kefir at least once a week. Not a tablespoon but around 2 cups for 8 chickens. They love it and never have had a problem with it. I make my own so that's how I can afford to do that. I've given them yogurt and buttermilk too.

 

[Sonoran Silkies]

Sonoran Silkies said:

There are many who believe, and studies that back it up, that products containing lactose do more harm than good to chickens. Their bodies do not have the ability to digest lactose. Personally I am pretty much a believer in moderation--and I do give mine live-culture yogurt on occasion, and have not seen problems.


What products containing lactose? In the studies I mean. And was it pasteurized milk? Did they use yogurt or just one lactose containing thing and draw the conclusion that all milks cause problems? And how old are the studies? Because it's already been shown, but only in the last couple of years, that Raw Milk causes chickens and even "lactose intolerant" people no problems because the enzymes needed to digest it is right there in the milk itself. These enzymes are destroyed in the process of pasteurization. Also the type of milks I've listed are all cultured milks, except the clabbered, which you really can only make with raw milk. Cultured milks don't' have lactose, it's been changed to a digestible form. Why else would the lactose intolerant be told to eat yogurt and buttermilk?

There's more than one reference around to using cultured milk products to prevent cocci. It's said to be quite effective.

PS - I give mine some kefir at least once a week. Not a tablespoon but around 2 cups for 8 chickens. They love it and never have had a problem with it. I make my own so that's how I can afford to do that. I've given them yogurt and buttermilk too.

http://dlhunicorn.conforums.com/index.cgi?board=feednutrition&action=display&num=1161162360 You may need to register to access.

 

[galanie]

Well, the link doesn't contain any scientific tests at all, but it does state that "Some milk products contain little or no lactose, and these may be safely fed to birds. And actually, these products (cheese and yogurt) are a good source of calcium for birds."

 

[ClareScifi]

I worry about my rooster getting too much calcium. Maybe I should not feed him dairy products. I don't mind the hens getting plenty of calcium, but too much calcium can cause roosters kidney problems.