What might be causing LOTS of WHITE URATES?

[PoultryPedia]

LATER NOTE: Please see post # 12 for summary of what's going on currently. - - - - - - - - -
I've given my 3 chickens some significant dosing with Baytril over the last couple weeks, which has amazingly alleviated their long-standing cases of Mycoplasma Galliseptum. My hens' combs are now red again & they are laying for the first time in more than a year.
(I've posted info on that on another thread-- https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/618049/hens-laying-again-after-a-year-of-no-eggs-keep-up-baytril )
However, they are still sneezing.

Does anyone know of a second condition they might have that could be causing the sneezing? It'd be one that Baytril doesn't cure, or the Baytril would have already fought it off.

One hen also showed Coryza a few months ago, too, but Tetracyclines cleared that up.

The last few days they've had white urates stuck on their hind end feathers from diarrhea. I'm hoping that's just from too much antibiotics being put in them lately.
A few month's ago I successfully treated the roo for a case of enteritis that had him caked with white poo a long time before I diagnosed it & treated with Penicillin injections.
I hope the 3 now have a different cause for their current diarrhea...

I am giving Oxine in their drinking water as an anti-fungal to help ward off any internal yeast infection that might try to start up in the wake of so much antibiotics. I'll keep it going another 3 days, probly.

I'll also start probiotics soon.
Unless I have to start another antibiotic

 

[dawg53]

Baytril is a very powerful antibiotic as you know. However mycoplasma gallisepticum (MG) eventually builds resistance to baytril like many other antibiotics. All mycoplasma diseases can be treated with denagard. There is no egg withdrawal, 2-4 day slaughter withdrawal and most importantly, no resistance. There is an initial treatment dose of 16cc's per gallon of water for 3-5 days, then a monthly preventative dose of 8cc's per gallon of water for 3-5 days. Here's a link:
http://www.denagard.com/pig-poultry-public/en/index.shtml
Denagard can be purchased from QC Supply. It's not cheap, but will last a long time. You can use it in conjunction with oxine in case it's fungal as you mentioned. You can use a spray bottle with a very fine mist, mist above the heads of your chickens with the oxine/water mixture. Do this 3 times a day for 10 days straight.
Denagard will not treat coryza. Coryza can be treated with sulmet in conjunction with baytril. Keep in mind that with both diseases, birds will be carriers. You'll risk spreading it with any new birds that are introduced to you flock. For very sick birds, you might have to use an eyedropper to dose birds individually as they wont drink treated water on their own. Here's another link to respiratory diseases, scroll dowm to Infectious Coryza and Mycoplasma Gallisepticum (MG) and read about them and treatments if you wish. Good luck.
http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/ps044
A link specifically about MG:
http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/ps034

 

[PoultryPedia]

Update:
I think the sneezing was the Coryza acting up.

Oxytetracycline helped with their Coryza before, so I did 3 days of .5 cc of Liquamycin LA-200, and have been putting Terramycin in distilled water for their drinking water a few days.

The roo & 1 hen seem to have pretty much quit sneezing & the other hen seems to only have a light sneeze. The hens shake their heads a little still, to clear a small amount of mucus that must still show up in their throats sometimes.

Something else I found that often can cause sneezing after another respiratory infection is Colibacillosis / Coli-septicaemia (E. coli infection).
http://www.thepoultrysite.com/diseaseinfo/39/colibacillosis-colisepticemia

Coli-septicaemia is the commonest infectious disease of farmed poultry. It is most commonly seen following upper respiratory disease (such as Infectious Bronchitis) or Mycoplasmosis... It is caused by the bacterium Escherichia coli and is seen worldwide in chickens, turkeys, etc.
Signs

• Respiratory signs, coughing, sneezing.
• Snick.
• Dejection.
• Reduced appetite.
• Poor growth.

I'm thinking my chickens don't have that, though.

However, they are still pooping LOTS of white urates on top of normal-looking poops.

I'm concerned that it may be Ulcerative Enteritis. I think that's what my roo had before, which cured with Penicillin.

However, I REALLY don't want their bodies to have more antibiotics, unless it's absolutely necessary. Tetracyclines are supposed to treat Ulcerative Enteritis (plus some kinds of Collibacillosis) so I'm hoping the problem will resolve with that. I'm also starting to give them Oxine in their water again, so maybe that could kill off a bacteria that might cause enteritis.

I think it would be useless to use probiotics until they're off meds, especially since with Oxine it kills lactobacillus. However, hopefully soon I can add probiotics into their food.

Any other ideas of what may cause the excessive urates would be welcome!

 

[welasharon]

Have you tried some probiotics or yogurt to kind of reboot their digestive systems? I imagine all those antibiotics have played havoc with the good bacteria in them.
sharon

 

[PoultryPedia]

I think you're right & I hope I can give probiotics after another few days. I'm going to wait until after they've had Oxine a little while, so the Oxine doesn't just neutralize the probiotics.

 

[PoultryPedia]

I'm concerned about possible ulcers particularly because I'm soon moving them into a coop with a sand floor. If they get any sand on their food & eat it, I'm afraid it will aggravate their ulcers.

That's why I REALLY want to figure out & solve the problems ASAP.

When I checked earlier today, they still had lots of white on their dropping. So the tetracycline isn't curing whatever the problem is...

 

[welasharon]

You can put them up a small board raised on bricks and feed them on that to help keep the food out of the sand and the sand out of the food. Just watch for one wedging itself under it....don't know how small your birds are. Good luck. Sounds like you have had a time of it.

 

[PoultryPedia]

Quote:

You can put them up a small board raised on bricks and feed them on that to help keep the food out of the sand and the sand out of the food. Just watch for one wedging itself under it....don't know how small your birds are. Good luck. Sounds like you have had a time of it.

Thanks for your practical advice! You made me a little less anxious about their upcoming move.

Thanks for caring. I have had such a time working for these birds. Thank you.

 

[PoultryPedia]

To try to rule out possibility of Ulcerative Enteritis because I've been concerned about sand damaging any ulcers, I started Penicillin injections yesterday.

There has been no improvement (The roo's urates cleared up quickly when I used Penicillin before when he did have UE), so I do not think they have UE. One of the hens' poops are more green now, also. They also very occasionally still have a very slight sneeze, but I'm not going to worry about that.

I am going to give a last injection tomorrow (their 3rd)--at a somewhat reduced dose--just to have given the Penicillin somewhat long enough that if there were any bad bugs it was killing, it has time to finish them off so they can't build up resistance for future.

I got thinking that the kidneys would have to do with the urates, and I'm betting the kidneys are having a hard time with filtering out all the medications they've had, so that's the reason for them having excessive urates right now. Ack!!!

Cranberry juice is supposed to be good for flushing out kidneys, so I'll get that. Plus start probiotics, garlic & other healthy things I can think of.

Any other suggestions are welcome.

Thank you!

 

[PoultryPedia]

Tough. Very tough.

I just started learning about Avian Tuberculosis, and wondering if that may be the cause. It has respiratory symptoms & causes lots of white urates.