When do I switch feeds?

[WhiteLeghorn2]

It can be a good idea.

Feeding them the non-medicated chick starter at any age is absolutely fine. There is nothing in that feed that would be bad for a roo or hen, young or old. Medicated would be a problem but the non-medicated is absolutely fine. I feed a non-medicated chick starter to my entire flock. People will do this for a number of different reasons based on their farming goals as it has a higher protein. I personally do it because I also feed fodder which has a lower protein so a high protein feed works great for me. I also have a mixed flock with different ages and breeds and not all lay frequently so a layer does not fit the needs of all birds. A starter > grower > layer can be great if that fits your flock but it is not the only option and is not great for all situations. I just think its good to know there are numerous right answers when it comes to feeding and to understand what each feed is. They aren't that different from one another so you do not have to stress about changing over at exactly a right time in most cases.

Medicated starter = babies ONLY and is a optional choice

Non-medicated starter = generally 20-22% protein. Generally feed to young birds but fine for all ages (layers will need an external calcium source)

Grower/All Flock/Flock raiser = generally 18-20% protein. Generally feed to teens or mixed flocks but fine for all ages (layers will need an external calcium source)

Layer = generally 16% protein plus calcium for layers. Laying birds only

Oyster shell = calcium source. If you are feeding layer feed it is not necessary as they are already getting extra calcium. If calcium is separate from feed birds will eat as needed. If it is mixed in they do not have this option which is way feeding layer to young birds for an extended period of time can lead to calcium overdoses. This is why people who have mixed flocks do oyster + grower feed. The young birds will not eat the oyster if it is kept separate

I understand what you're saying, but 20% protein is way too much for an adult hen when she isn't molting. I encourage layer feed for adult hens.

 

[jeds chickens]

You have eggs at 20 weeks? What breed? My 4 girls are RIR from the feed store and 14 weeks. I wasn't hoping to get eggs until March. Could I see eggs mid February?

My breed is red stars or red sexed link. The first hen started laying at 18 and half weeks. Red stars are bred with rir I think. Depending on how much light you have you could but the red star is bred to lay early.

 

[ChickenCanoe]

Yes, grit and oyster shell are very different. However, it all depends of personal preference. Some keepers like to feed only grit to avoid calcium overdose, but on the other hand, some people prefer to give oyster shells to assist their hens need for calcium for laying eggs.

We personally use oyster shells for our hens, but we only have 6 of them, and they are all laying. If we had roosters, we would feed them all regular grit. We used grit while they were growing pullets, but once they all were about 22 weeks old we switched the whole flock to oyster shells. As I said, depends of preference, we just like the oyster shells. Thanks for your input, God bless!

It depends on personal preference how one chooses to manage their flock. However, I don't think you still quite understand how they are different.

Shell and "regular" grit are two completely different things, are for 2 completely different purposes and in no way are they interchangeable.

Grit is small particle size, insoluble, sharp stone; usually granite or flint. The sole purpose of grit is to become lodged in the gizzard so that its contractions, aided by the grit, will grind up foodstuffs like grains and vegetation. It stays in there a long time till the hydrochloric acid eventually breaks it down enough to be passed in feces. Other than it aiding in breaking down harder food items, grit contributes nothing to nutrition - yet is essential for all avian species to consume - especially ground dwelling and swimming birds. The rocks, also called gastroliths, grind against each other as well as food particles and are also broken down in this way. Free range birds on proper pasture can pick up appropriate size stones. However, grit is cheap so there is no reason not to provide appropriately sized grit for the age of the birds to insure they are able to glean maximum nutrition from the food they eat.

On the other hand, oyster shell is not stone. It is the protective covering of a bivalve and is made up almost entirely of calcium carbonate, which coincidentally, is the main component of egg shells. Unlike insoluble grit, oyster shell is soluble and breaks down rapidly in a chickens digestive tract and by the time it reaches the gizzard is much too soft to aid in breaking down other foodstuffs. Unlike grit, oyster shell contributes calcium to the diet.

I suppose the reason some people become confused on the issue is because feed store employees and others sometimes apply the misnomer 'oysters shell grit'. This is a potentially dangerous confusion for one's flock.

My chickens are 20 weeks and I still give them chick starter non medicated. I do give them oyster shells. We are switching to layer feed in a week or two. My four chickens all lay four eggs a day without layer feed.

Layer feed in no way promotes egg laying. It merely contains 4% calcium to replenish the calcium in the medullary bone extracted when the egg is in the shell gland.

Layer feed is absolutely appropriate for a flock like your that are all laying.

I read that layer feed has enough calcium so I don't need oyster shells or else they get calcium overdose. Have you had experience?

They won't get an overdose because the oyster shell is provided in a separate container and the hens won't consume it if they don't feel the need.

Some breeds and strains have different needs and tolerance for calcium. 4 % is the approximate calcium content of layer feed. Some birds need more, some less. Providing oyster shell on the side can satisfy any that desire it.

Yes the feed does have enough calcium, however I haven't had a problem with oysters. Grit is just as good.

How is grit going to provide calcium?

You have eggs at 20 weeks? What breed? My 4 girls are RIR from the feed store and 14 weeks. I wasn't hoping to get eggs until March. Could I see eggs mid February?

You could since days will be lengthening but there are no guarantees.

It can be a good idea.

Feeding them the non-medicated chick starter at any age is absolutely fine. There is nothing in that feed that would be bad for a roo or hen, young or old. Medicated would be a problem but the non-medicated is absolutely fine. I feed a non-medicated chick starter to my entire flock. People will do this for a number of different reasons based on their farming goals as it has a higher protein. I personally do it because I also feed fodder which has a lower protein so a high protein feed works great for me. I also have a mixed flock with different ages and breeds and not all lay frequently so a layer does not fit the needs of all birds. A starter > grower > layer can be great if that fits your flock but it is not the only option and is not great for all situations. I just think its good to know there are numerous right answers when it comes to feeding and to understand what each feed is. They aren't that different from one another so you do not have to stress about changing over at exactly a right time in most cases.

Medicated starter = babies ONLY and is a optional choice

Non-medicated starter = generally 20-22% protein. Generally feed to young birds but fine for all ages (layers will need an external calcium source)

Grower/All Flock/Flock raiser = generally 18-20% protein. Generally feed to teens or mixed flocks but fine for all ages (layers will need an external calcium source)

Layer = generally 16% protein plus calcium for layers. Laying birds only

Oyster shell = calcium source. If you are feeding layer feed it is not necessary as they are already getting extra calcium. If calcium is separate from feed birds will eat as needed. If it is mixed in they do not have this option which is way feeding layer to young birds for an extended period of time can lead to calcium overdoses. This is why people who have mixed flocks do oyster + grower feed. The young birds will not eat the oyster if it is kept separate

X2

Aside from protein and calcium/phosphorus, all ages and purposes of chickens have very similar nutrient needs.

I came across the same situation. I live in a very NON-agricultural area. My lone feed store has chick starter that says feed up to 8 weeks. But then there is not "grower" feed for in between. I asked everywhere on this forum what I should be feeding. I was told to keep on the starter until they start to lay. My girls are 14 weeks and they are still on the chick starter as that is all I can get other than layer. I do ferment so they are getting optimum nutrition but I have always wondered why there wasn't a grower in the brand my store carries.

That's tough. Perhaps you could ask the owner if they would be willing to order some grower or flock raiser for you. Their supplier undoubted carries it. The feed store would understandably not want to warehouse something that has such a short shelf life unless they knew they had a customer for it.

Each manufacturer will formulate feed for certain ages of birds. Some break it down into the categories of starter, grower and finisher. Some just do starter/grower.

I understand that. But grit has no added calcium. For a mixed flock of hens and roosters, I think grit is best, but for a flock of all hens, oyster shell is better. Oyster shell breaks up food in the gizzard but also gives calcium to help the laying hens.

For a mixed flock of hens and roosters, they need grit AND oyster shell. The roosters won't eat the shell. Oyster shell can't break up food because by the time it gets through the proventriculus, it is mush.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9181

http://www2.ca.uky.edu/poultryprofi.../Chapter3_Anatomy_and_Physiology/Chapter3.pdf

I understand what you're saying, but 20% protein is way too much for an adult hen when she isn't molting. I encourage layer feed for adult hens.

That's true. It is too much.
One can cut the amount of protein by adding grains to the diet.
One of the layer feeds I used to buy was 20% protein and was intended to be fed 50/50 with scratch grains which brought the total protein intake to around 16%.

 

[ChickensRDinos]

I understand what you're saying, but 20% protein is way too much for an adult hen when she isn't molting. I encourage layer feed for adult hens.

It is more protein than they need but not so much that it will hurt them and like I said previously there are reasons for wanting a higher protein feed in some cases. It is personal preference.

I think it is better to understand the different kinds of feed and make choices based on your own personal needs. Telling someone that something is or is not a good idea for their birds without enough info startles them needlessly. That is why I like to explain the different foods rather than recommend a course of action.

A layer with 16% protein and added calcium is designed as a basic catch all as a feed that is the ONLY thing a commercial laying hen only is eating. If that fits your needs, goals and flock then great! There is nothing wrong with feeding it -- it is the most common feed and made exactly for that. But there is nothing wrong with a variety of alternatives as well--that is really the point I was trying to make. Don't stress, it's not an exact right and wrong thing with an exact critical week that you have to switch feeds--there is leeway.

I don't want to confuse people who are just starting out with too much info but you can get as into nutrition and feeding as you want to. If birds are eating a variety of things that start to make up a notable percentage of their diet, like you are feeding lots of scraps or supplemental grains, or they are free ranging and not eating a lot of feed, or feeding fodder or more than a handful of scratch, then a higher protein feed might be better for their overall total protein intake. It's all about balance.

Mixed flocks are common and you have to make choices based on what is going to be best for a variety of birds, not just laying hens. Layer feed is not going to be good for the other non-laying birds in your flock but a higher protein grower is not bad for your layers. Birds in very hot weather tend to eat less food overall and a higher protein feed can be better for them. From what I have read, heritage and some breeder birds tend to need more protein than commercially bred hatchery birds.

There are many reasons to pick one feed or another in either direction....

 

[ChickensRDinos]

I understand that. But grit has no added calcium. For a mixed flock of hens and roosters, I think grit is best, but for a flock of all hens, oyster shell is better. Oyster shell breaks up food in the gizzard but also gives calcium to help the laying hens.

Grit is what breaks up food in the gizzard. It does not have calcium. Grit is just hard little rocks.

Oyster shell is calcium. It is much more brittle than rock and does not make an effective grit.

Two different things.

 

[WhiteLeghorn2]

Grit is what breaks up food in the gizzard. It does not have calcium. Grit is just hard little rocks.

Oyster shell is calcium. It is much more brittle than rock and does not make an effective grit.

Two different things.

I want to apologize and clear up to everyone that I was giving false information about Oyster shells. I have been taught from people that Oyster Shell works the same way as grit, but has extra calcium. I now believe that I was receiving false information. I've had chickens for only one year and the information I give is all from things I've learned and have used succesfully for my chickens. Thank you ChickensrDinos and ChickenCanoes for clearing this up to me.

 

[pdirt]

We have 11 layers and one silly rooster. We feed a 17% grower feed and have both grit and oyster shell (or egg shell) in separate side dishes. Only once have I seen the rooster eat oyster shell but otherwise he leaves it alone. The girls lay good eggs with strong shells. Since they've been cooped up for the winter they are really starting to go through the oyster shell as well as the grit. We have supplemental light to make for 14 hours of light, which keeps most of them laying.

 

[pdirt]

I want to apologize and clear up to everyone that I was giving false information about Oyster shells. I have been taught from people that Oyster Shell works the same way as grit, but has extra calcium. I now believe that I was receiving false information. I've had chickens for only one year and the information I give is all from things I've learned and have used succesfully for my chickens. Thank you ChickensrDinos and ChickenCanoes for clearing this up to me. 

I know it can be confusing. We're also pretty new to chickens. A lot of the info here on BYC has been spot on and useful and some has been misleading, though I don't think anyone intended to mislead.

BYC really is an amazing community...so many good folks here willing to share.

 

[jlholm]

I was told the same thing by people who have had chickens forever, so I guess we do learn something new everyday and that's the reason I love this site!

 

[WhiteLeghorn2]

I was told the same thing by people who have had chickens forever, so I guess we do learn something new everyday and that's the reason I love this site!

Thank you, it's sometimes hard to know who to trust.

My grandpa who owned chickens for 30 years was one of the people who told me oyster shell is basically the same thing as grit. But then again, his chickens were free ranged and pretty much took care of themselves, besides that they had a coop with a bowl of corn and water. Back then, they did what worked for them, there wasn't books and lots of information on chickens. Happy New Year!