Winter water?

[MeepBeep]

What they are both incredibly poor at is their conversion of consumed Watts into lumens of light ironic for a product designed to produce light...

Just like duct tape is good for lots of things ... except sealing ductwork [/quote]

The history is a little more twisted... Duct tape is actually a spin of of Duck tape... The original Duck tape was designed to quickly seal ammo for the Navy in WWII, it was made from duck cloth, and was water resistant like a duck so it was nicknamed Duck tape... After the war it was sold as a general purpose repair tape much like Duct tape is today, during this time as a general purpose repair tape it was used by HAVAC guys to seal ducts, and in the 1950s it was rebranded as Duct tape... Then in the 1970s it was re-branded back to it's original name Duck tape due to many people calling it that and to stand out from the other 'duct tapes' on the market...

I found a Pelonis site with PTC heaters. I ASSUME this is a much newer technology than > 20 year old Pelonis ceramic cube heater I have which still works fine and I see can STILL be purchased on Amazon?

Pelonis was one of the first companies to really push PTC space heaters, I believe all of their ceramic heaters are PTC...

But what if you just plug it in and the ambient temp is varying from -20F to above freezing?

That is when a thermostat of some kind is handy...

Hmmm, looks like that would take a bit more skill/education to use than an off the shelf plug in the wall thing like a ThermoCube. Are there "kits" to turn these into a "consumer ready" product?

It's really not that complicated, strip two wires on a wall wart (wall adapter) screw them down to the power terminals of the device... Then there will be the relay side with a few more screw down terminals, you just cut one of the wire to the device and screw it down to the relay just like installing a switch... The first one I posted has a dual relay on it so you have to pay attention to what 2 of the 3 terminals you use...

 

[coop410silkies]

Just like duct tape is good for lots of things ... except sealing ductwork 


I found a Pelonis site with PTC heaters. I ASSUME this is a much newer technology than > 20 year old Pelonis ceramic cube heater I have which still works fine and I see can STILL be purchased on Amazon?


But what if you just plug it in and the ambient temp is varying from -20F to above freezing? 


Hmmm, looks like that would take a bit more skill/education to use than an off the shelf plug in the wall thing like a ThermoCube. Are there "kits" to turn these into a "consumer ready" product?

I think perhaps Incubator Warehouse has a kit, but the cost advantage is lost. These inexpensive thermostats are not really user friendly, and they do require wiring. I THINK the ones I purchased on eBay came with wiring diagrams, but I'm not an electrician and needed some tutoring. Rush Lane does a great job of explainsing how to wire some other models, with and without relays, and he's a good place for the neophyte to start. There are Utube directions on the Internet as well. most of the tutoring is for using these thermostats with low wattage heat sources used in incubators.

For my purpose in using PTCs to heat outdoor water buckets, I found some 70 and 135 Watt models that I will be happy to use with the the thermocubes. These PTCs cost about $5 each on eBay. I plug a heavy duty multi outlet fixture into a thermocube and run several low watt heaters from that. Worked well last year, but I was always worried about the light bulbs. These PTCs will be a big improvement if they last longer and are durable. Am also looking at resistors mounted in cement and/or lightweight cob. This is a work in progress.

For various reasons, I wish to replace the light bulbs in my incubator with a PTC, and for this instance I will be wanting to use one of the digital thermostats mentioned above. Thanks to all MeepBeep's coaching, I'm now ready to give it a go.

 

[coop410silkies]

Just like duct tape is good for lots of things ... except sealing ductwork 

The history is a little more twisted... Duct tape is actually a spin of of Duck tape... The original Duck tape was designed to quickly seal ammo for the Navy in WWII, it was made from duck cloth, and was water resistant like a duck so it was nicknamed Duck tape... After the war it was sold as a general purpose repair tape much like Duct tape is today, during this time as a general purpose repair tape it was used by HAVAC guys to seal ducts, and in the 1950s it was rebranded as Duct tape... Then in the 1970s it was re-branded back to it's original name Duck tape due to many people calling it that and to stand out from the other 'duct tapes' on the market...
Pelonis was one of the first companies to really push PTC space heaters, I believe all of their ceramic heaters are PTC...
That is when a thermostat of some kind is handy...
It's really not that complicated, strip two wires on a wall wart (wall adapter) screw them down to the power terminals of the device... Then there will be the relay side with a few more screw down terminals, you just cut one of the wire to the device and screw it down to the relay just like installing a switch... The first one I posted has a dual relay on it so you have to pay attention to what 2 of the 3 terminals you use...

[/quote]
Wow, I'm not kidding, this diagram and post is a BOON. When I bought my first Thermostat a couple years ago, there were no directions in English, ANYWHERE, and people were asking for them. (I bought the "expensive" $12 Willhi models.). This so nice for people to know. Many thanks.

The info on Duck Tape is also appreciated. Have often wondered how it got named.

 

[coop410silkies]

I use a 12v wall wart (wall adapter) to power the thermostat and then yes the relay on boards switched whatever device... Most of them have a 10A relay, so they are go to about 1200 Watts @ 120VAC...

Good to know.

 

[bruceha2000]

And here I thought people were just mispronouncing "duct"

I don't buy the silver duct tape any more, Gorilla tape is much better. For ducts, I use metal foil tape like the HVAC people do.

Ah, your picture helps, I didn't see the screw terminals on the board in the pictures on the ebay pages and figured people would have to be soldering onto the board. That is something a lot of people do not know how to do.

 

[Rebal]

I made a nipple waterer out of 3" PVC pipe, it loops down inside the coop reduced to 2" and then goes under the coop 2" providing water to the run. I wrapped it in heat tape, aluminum insulation and duct tape but the watering nipples froze so the chickens couldn't get any water. Currently I'm using a heated dog bowl but it gets dirty, I really would like to have the waterer working since the whole purpose was to provide fresh clean water.

I'm reading these feeds trying to get ideas on what I might be able to do or use. I saw something about changing the aluminum watering nipples to copper, not sure how that helps to keep them from freezing?
Someone also mentioned they shoved a submersible heater in the pipe or a de icer , not sure how those work.
My waterer holds 5 gallons of water and works great when it's not frozen

Any suggestions??

 

[wamtazlady]

I'm reading these feeds trying to get ideas on what I might be able to do or use. I saw something about changing the aluminum watering nipples to copper, not sure how that helps to keep them from freezing?
Someone also mentioned they shoved a submersible heater in the pipe or a de icer , not sure how those work.
My waterer holds 5 gallons of water and works great when it's not frozen

Any suggestions??

Someone else in another thread was asking about where to get those copper replacements. No one seemed to have any advice on where to find them or whether they would not freeze.

Vertical nipples seem to be prone to freezing. This is due to a tiny bit of water being left in the nipple at all times. You might try to change to horizontal nipples which seem to be less likely to freeze. Of course, without a source of heat water will freeze when it gets cold enough.

I use a 10 or 15 gallon tote with lid, horizontal nipples, and a submersible stock tank deicer to keep my girls in water. The stock heater is 250 watts but only comes on when the temperature gets below 35 and turns off when it raises the water temperature to 45 so it's pretty efficient. Water stays clean as the lid keeps the dirt out of it. It only needs filled once every week or so. It's easy to see when water is needed as the tote is semi transparent. The temperatures have gotten down to just below 0 and so far this system has not frozen. Next year I plan on putting the tote into a larger tote and add some insulation between the totes except on the side that has the nipples.

I will not use this system in summer. Algae grows too fast in summer so I like to change the water daily. For summer I'll be back to using a small bucket with vertical nipples.

 

[Our Roost]

Is your water source inside the coop? I hooked up pvc piping to a 55 gallon drum of collected rain water and fed the inside of the coop with attached water nipples. Did everything you mentioned. I use a heated water dish also and am experiencing dirty water and with less frequent cleaning but still have that issue. You might want to try a heated electrical line taped to your pvc piping. It comes in 15 ft. lengths sold at home depot. Trust it is completely safe. The problem still being the water in your 5 gallon bucket that feeds the pvc and nipples. A drop of water will freeze if exposed to cold air and copper wont help. By the way, my water drum froze solid! No water ever made it into the pvc lines. They sell submersible heaters for horse troughs and we have used those for the horses. Good luck!

 

[coop410silkies]

I made a nipple waterer out of 3" PVC pipe, it loops down inside the coop reduced to 2" and then goes under the coop 2" providing water to the run. I wrapped it in heat tape, aluminum insulation and duct tape but the watering nipples froze so the chickens couldn't get any water. Currently I'm using a heated dog bowl but it gets dirty, I really would like to have the waterer working since the whole purpose was to provide fresh clean water. 

I'm reading these feeds trying to get ideas on what I might be able to do or use. I saw something about changing the aluminum watering nipples to copper, not sure how that helps to keep them from freezing?
Someone also mentioned they shoved a submersible heater in the pipe or a de icer , not sure how those work.
My waterer holds 5 gallons of water and works great when it's not frozen 

Any suggestions??

Well, I don't have any idea where to get copper nipples. Copper WILL freeze, though. I have seen nipples that are mounted like verticals but modified to operate like horizontal nipples. I use the regular horizontal nipples and have little trouble with them, even in near zero temps. The regular horizontal nipples allow you to set your water vessel on some kind of a heater, but since you've probably got the holes in your PVC pipe already drilled for vertical, that won't be an option for you. Some people use an aquarium or fountain pump to keep water flowing and liquid throughout the PVC run; that might be an option for you. I use heated dog bowls, too, and I had problems with them getting dirty and with roos getting their wattles wet. What I ended up doing was finding a water vessel that could fit in the dog bowl, and I fitted horizontal nipples so that they were just above the lip of the dog bowl. This set up is still in the assessment stage, since I do not yet have an idea about how long the dog bowls will last. I can say, however, that this system works well. A 5 gallon bucket just fits in the extra large dog bowls, and the bowl really does keep the water in the bucket from freezing, and the horizontal nipples really do stay functional. The chickens get clean water, and the Roos keep their wattles dry. I also use large totes with horizontal nipples and 250 watt deicers; these work well, too, and I like them a lot.

Hope you get everything squared away. It is funny, I tell you. I get my clear flow flat hose out, attach it to the kitchen sink, run it 100 feet out to the coop waterer, stand out in zero degree weather while it fills, and after all is done, my chickens run outside to gobble up snow, their favorite wintertime drink. Go figure. I do NOT worry about water when there is snow and they can get to it.

 

[coop410silkies]

Is your water source inside the coop? I hooked up pvc piping to a 55 gallon drum of collected rain water and fed the inside of the coop with attached water nipples. Did everything you mentioned. I use a heated water dish also and am experiencing dirty water and with less frequent cleaning but still have that issue. You might want to try a heated electrical line taped to your pvc piping. It comes in 15 ft. lengths sold at home depot. Trust it is completely safe. The problem still being the water in your 5 gallon bucket that feeds the pvc and nipples. A drop of water will freeze if exposed to cold air and copper wont help. By the way, my water drum froze solid! No water ever made it into the pvc lines. They sell submersible heaters for horse troughs and we have used those for the horses. Good luck!

Roost, can you not heat your 55 gallon drum with a "birdbath" deicer? I use an API 250 watt in my 65 gallon rain barrel, and it is sufficient to keep the water liquid, even at near zero temps. After it's thawed, of course. Trouble with wrapping stuff around the PVC pipe is that the chickens might peck at it. People do have successful systems with this set up, though; I just don't remember the details on how they worked in winter. For all I know, they sprayed the pipe with an IR reflective paint and pumped the water fast enough to not freeze before it got back to the reservoir. Thank you, btw, for all your help and support in the past.