Zoning Conundrum in Oswego County NY

[HISIRISHGEM]

I understand your dilemma and feel sad for your current situation with your birds. And I also have great respect for your grandparents patriotic contributions having had my father and six uncles fight in WWII. Please do continue the fight and accept my apology for my comment.

Thank you so much!

 

[HISIRISHGEM]

I'm really sorry you are having this issue. Do you live within city limits or a nearby town within the county? Usually every township has their own ordinances.

The best thing you can do is look up all the ordinances for every township in your county (and surrounding counties / cities that are similar), and make a list of every one that has more lenient rules, so you can use this to demonstrate a kind of precedence. If these are all quite restrictive, then you might have to just go state wide or country wide, and use examples to show how most similar areas do allow a small amount of livestock. If you can find sources that demonstrate how this is good for an area like yours, increasing food independence for the local area, increase the farming presence and historical nature of the area etc.

Ag laws won't apply to you unless you own a lot of acreage. The Ag dept will be unlikely to help you. Best thing to do is remain very calm, not argumentative or emotional, but firm in your convictions, and present this information to your township board meeting. Agree to inspections, but know the rules first so that you can have everything complying during their inspection. Get involved in the board, and have as many family and friends and fellow livestock owners also get involved to show support for the values you want in your area.

Secondly, yes you could appeal to grandfather in your existing flock based on the time you bought your home and the rules at the time. However, this really isn't set in stone. I would lodge a formal "application of non-conforming use" (grandfathering) at the same time as your appeal. You may also want to set a period of time that is reasonable for this to be amortized. For example, 10 years to recoup the costs and outlay you have in your chicken coops, new flock purchases and other areas where you can demonstrate a significant financial and time investment that will otherwise be lost because of this new rule. Be really organized and prepare, and if you can afford it really do get legal advice before making any big decisions. Most honest lawyers will give you a free phone consult to discuss if this is their area of expertise, whether you have a chance of winning, and also will give you names of other lawyers who specialize in this area of law in your local area. Good luck!

Ty, the only concern I have, is that he’s given me less than a week to prepare. I’m hoping he’ll reschedule me for the second meeting. I need more time to get my information together, however, we may be stuck to that date. I’m going to do my best to try.

 

[HISIRISHGEM]

I think ordinances in regard to raising poultry all over this country should be looked at differently. There is something to be said for food security. If these pets provide that for your family, then by all means you should be left alone. Think to the neighbors behind you. This is where I had problems with my dog years ago.

We have woods directly behind me. Our backyard is half an acre all fenced in. While one neighbor has three aggressive dogs that my chickens stay far away from, the neighbor in question has never had any contact other than looking at the from over the fence. They’ve never been over the fence nor in their yard.

We use our eggs as food along with our gardens. To think they thrust a law during Covid shutdown when there wasn’t any to begin with because this is an old farm town, and then expects people to pay 25.00 licensure fee to even HAVE chickens on top of paying an extra 5.00 per chicken on top of what people pay to buy them seems like infringing on Constitutional to be able to as you’ve said, feed my family (food security).

It’s just really a governmental overreach and in my opinion giving them more money. I’d like to know why they implimented it. It sounds to me like this wasn’t a law for responsible chicken owners, rather for unresponsible chicken owners.

 

[HISIRISHGEM]

You are correct, this is basically what I was trying to say. No direct power, just influence to change the minds of the people in the board. I don't know about this particular board, but mine is very small and practically just a popularity contest in terms of influence in the community. Very difficult if the board is focused on cultivating a certain type of community and you are a lone voice in opposition though!

This gives me hope. There are lots of people other than myself who own chickens here. This law was put in AFTER we all were given permission to have them. I’m just hoping they will come to the meeting. This WILL affect them as well as me. Nobody sticks their neck out for their neighbors anymore it seems.

Thank you for posting,

 

[CAFinNY]

Have you checked with your Cornell Co Operative extension? Don't know if they cover anything like that, but it won't hurt to ask.

 

[Iluveggers]

However, NY isn’t as Democrat as everyone says. It was created to look like that and people’s liberties have been stolen.

This is true. Carried by NYC and other metro areas. In between the cities is mostly rural farmland & small towns. Big divide up here in NY. But the land & housing is affordable outside the urban areas & definitely pretty land.

 

[MildlyOffensiveChicken]

I would look into any farms/foodrights type organizations. They can fall all over the spectrum politically. (Far left, far right, moderate)

NY must have some groups like this. There might be $ for litigation/lobbying. They may also have suggestions on how to skirt the rules or something we don’t even know about.

Calling your federal and state reps/congressman may not help, but all the ones I’ve worked for before I settled into my career job, track constituent inquires by type and number. If they get 10,000 inquiries about backyard chickens, you might see some action. Or if the city council gets inquiry letters from a few congressman, they may compromise with you.

I don’t know what the laws are in NY...but record every interaction you have with any figure of authority.

Or you could do what I did a few times as a young man, when someone tried to bully me under cover of authority.....bully them back. Show up at their house. Show up at their job or office. Show up at their kids soccer game. Call their parents - this one actually worked the best.

Luckily it worked out and I am a much more mellow middle aged man. And you look like a nicer person than me .

 

[MildlyOffensiveChicken]

I should clearly note on that call the parent part. It wasn’t me calling to threaten. Rather to tell them what their Son did and was trying to do. And they, knowing who their son is, took care of business and I never heard about it again. Son is a Deputy.

 

[HISIRISHGEM]

I would look into any farms/foodrights type organizations. They can fall all over the spectrum politically. (Far left, far right, moderate)

NY must have some groups like this. There might be $ for litigation/lobbying. They may also have suggestions on how to skirt the rules or something we don’t even know about.

Calling your federal and state reps/congressman may not help, but all the ones I’ve worked for before I settled into my career job, track constituent inquires by type and number. If they get 10,000 inquiries about backyard chickens, you might see some action. Or if the city council gets inquiry letters from a few congressman, they may compromise with you.

I don’t know what the laws are in NY...but record every interaction you have with any figure of authority.

Or you could do what I did a few times as a young man, when someone tried to bully me under cover of authority.....bully them back. Show up at their house. Show up at their job or office. Show up at their kids soccer game. Call their parents - this one actually worked the best.

Luckily it worked out and I am a much more mellow middle aged man. And you look like a nicer person than me .

Actually, the code enforcement doesn't seem to like women. He keeps threatening me with a fine! lol Latest was that the idiot neighbor called 911 for a fire we were having with our little girl. We were roast marshmallows when the code enforcement came by means of HER side of the fence, since I have No Trespassing signs. He told me our fire was too big. it needed to be 3 x 3 and ours was...4 x 4. He told me the idiot neighbor knows the codes and that he has to investigate every one of them. More happened, leading to a drunk village board member colluding with a visitor living upstairs from them. At any rate. I told the code enforcer that my fire was NOT going out! He told my husband to "calm me down or we'd get a fine" Second time he's threatened this. My voice was raised, but I wasn't hollering. I was FIRM. He didn't like it. I haven't had men treat me like this. At least most "men".

What I'm starting to see is a whole lot of corruption here. Drunk board member accused us of things that weren't true. I.E. dumping on my neighbors property, etc. NOT even CLOSE! Lawyer runs the show for the village and he's not elected. Mayor delegates to everyone else so he won't get in trouble and the Clerk is threatening like Mafia and she's not even elected nor is the code enforcer. It's crazy, but I tell you, if I do anything you have done. I'll be thrown behind bars for harassment or following them, yet that is exactly what my neighbor is doing, but they're all saying we can't do anything (mind you we have a little girl) unless THEY hurt us!. It's awful. Never been through this before. Ever! My husband put up security cameras. We are in a dark place at the moment. It's hard to have courage fighting so many battles.

Thank you so much for your kind response. You gave me a chuckle and a bit of encouragement.

 

[HISIRISHGEM]

I should clearly note on that call the parent part. It wasn’t me calling to threaten. Rather to tell them what their Son did and was trying to do. And they, knowing who their son is, took care of business and I never heard about it again. Son is a Deputy.

Hahaha, I kind of got what you were talking about. You don't seem mean, just firm. I'm starting to lose my patients with FIRM. They aren't getting it. The threats of fines because I express my disproval of them are starting to tick me off. lol Wish I knew their parents!!! lol