CSU - Chicken State University- Large Fowl SOP

[ramirezframing]

The "hump" is called a cushion and you can find that in females of many breeds. It is something you want to gt rid of as it ruins the look of the backline. Most judges will run their hand down the back of the bird and if it stays flat for a bit they call it good. It is not correct though and in my experience fairly difficult to eliminate.

You are doing a great job with these.

Walt

Thanks, I couldn't remember the name of the "hump" at that moment. I know in some breeds its not wanted, but wasn't sure if its not a wanted trait in all breeds.

 

[OSUman]

Here is a buckeye cockerel who came as a chick from Bob Gilbert. He isn't in the best condition, but I really like his build, he has a nice wide back and thick legs.

 

[dt1958]

Could someone address the proper "under-color" for a Buckeye to have & possibly post some photos showing it. From what I have read it seems to play a big part in the overall color of the bird.

 

[buffalogal]

Could someone address the proper "under-color" for a Buckeye to have & possibly post some photos showing it. From what I have read it seems to play a big part in the overall color of the bird.

I'm supposed to drive out o town today, so no time for photos, but the slate bar in the underfluff is something Mrs Metcalf noted wild birds have and she believed produced a better red. (MOL in the same way you should use gray primer when you're going to paint a wall red) But it's not a mandatory thing and a bird with that trait doesn't necessarily indicate some special level of quality over one that doesn't, and it certainly is possible to have that lustrous, dark bay color without it.

By way of example, a few years ago, I ordered Buckeyes from Ideal hatchery down in Texas. If I remember correctly, every single bird had that slate bar, and they also had excessive black speckles, some had actual lacing, occasional solid white feathers (in the wings!) and they were all over the place in regards to type. This is why Old Chickeneers will tell you to "Build the barn before you paint it.", i.e. worry about correct size and type, then fuss about the finer points of the color.

 

[cgmccary]

Could someone address the proper "under-color" for a Buckeye to have & possibly post some photos showing it. From what I have read it seems to play a big part in the overall color of the bird.

The under-color of all sections should be red with the exception of the back which should show a bar of slate -- so just underneath the surface in ONLY the back, there should be a bar on each feather of slate. NOTE: what many ignore is that the under-color everywhere else is RED. A "bar of slate" on the feather is just that, a strip, stripe or broad line across the fluff of the feather in the back of the bird-- the remainder of each feather in the back should be red in the under-color.

You'll see some Buckeyes birds with little or no bar of slate in the back, others with more than what I would call a slate bar (slate stripe) and then you will also see birds with slate in the under-color (or fluff) in other places besides the back of the bird-- ALL are technically wrong. I find that if the slate is in lots of other sections other than the back of the bird, then it is more difficult to get rid of than it is breeding the bar to appear (or come back) in the fluff of the back. Also, it is NOT a DQ if the bird does not have a slate bar in the under-color of the back and the SOP says SHOULD SHOW A BAR OF SLATE. The only specific DQs in regards to Buckeye color is "One or more entirely white feathers showing in the outer plumage."

Surface color is an even shade of rich mahogany bay IN ALL SECTIONS with the exception of the unexposed primary and secondaries (wing) and the main tail feathers which MAY contain black. Getting rid of black appearing on the surface say on the breast feathers or wing bows or wing coverts (also called wing bars) can be problematic sometimes.

In the SOP, "RICH: "A term applied to plumage that has high saturation of pigmentation, vivid in color."
In the SOP, "MAIN TAIL FEATHERS: The straight, stiff long feathers of the tail located under and between the coverts of the females, the coverts and sickles of the male."

So a feather in the back of the bird will be a "rich mahogany bay" on "web or surface" with a bar of slate underneath that in the "fluff or undercolor" of the feather and then red the remainder of the "fluff or undercolor" (of the back feather). Slate is "a shade of gray having a bluish cast sometimes approaching black, sometimes of lighter shades," per SOP. The other feathers of all sections will be a rich mahogany bay on web or surface and red on the fluff or undercolor. Mahogany Bay is a much darker color than red.

Feather from the back of a Buckeye male:

 

[cgmccary]

I would also caution NOT to primarily concentrate on color when breeding your Buckeyes. This seems to be folks' primary object of scrutiny. A few breeders have focused so much on color that they have neglected type. From what I have seen & been shown, their Buckeyes' bodies hardly resemble the breed. One should primarily focus on TYPE, that is, the general shape and form common to a breed, its ideal shape and size per the Standard of Perfection.

Don Schrider says that color is one of the simplest things to see, he says, even an amateur can see color & Don also says, in Buckeyes, color is one of the easiest traits to correct, in a generation or two. He believes Buckeye type is much more difficult to correct & takes a lot longer to fix -- i.e. traits including, but not limited to, proper back length and width, proper front, body depth, length & spacing of legs, heart girth, head shape and size - and by all means, don't lose sight of weight.

The ALBC guidelines on their website showing how to select your Buckeyes is a good place to start. The ALBC in recovering the breed, in about 3 years, added more than a 1-2 lbs to the average Buckeye.

A well-known Buckeye breeder says that at the height of the Buckeyes' popularity in the U.S., there may have been 2-3 million of them. By 1960, there were about 10,000. At one point, the breed shrunk to about 500 breeding birds that had good genetics. The last census showed a pick-up to between 2,000-3,000 Buckeyes. ALBC is about to start a new census (this summer), and I encourage all Buckeye breeders to participate and report the number of adult Buckeyes you maintain in your flock to ALBC.

 

[thedragonlady]

Good tail angle, and looks like the back slopes to the tail? All these birds are so lovely. It would be interesting to see what the fluff color is on some of these birds too.

I don't see any "sofa stuffing" showing. I'll bet those birds have proper under color ! Nice birds!

 

[karenbrat1]

Yup. That is precisely the point of posting photos. They are educational devices or object lessons. This is not an online show thread. This is a teaching thread, 100%. Putting up a whole passel of photos without educational teaching or critique is of little to no value.

And from post #1: "The faculty will judge all submissions and will make comments about the birds' color, stance, back, head, feathering, tail, breast, wing carriage or any other area that strikes their fancy."

So... what is good and what is bad about all these Buckeye photos which have been posted?

 

[Pathfinders]

Here are two pics I took yesterday showing slate bar. This is in a cock bird:



This is in a hen:

 

[Pathfinders]

And I agree with Chris. There seems to be a misconception floating around out there that there must be good slate bar in order to have proper body color. This is not correct, in my experience. I have seen very light birds with perfectly acceptably slate bars. I have seen very dark birds with no slate bar at all. I do not find any correlation, and do not think one exists.

I like to use the analogy that breeding chickens is like working on a mobile. If you pull too hard on one end, the other will fly up in the air. The idea, IMO is to gently make changes, watching what happens over time, so as not to throw the whole thing out of whack altogether.

And I am firmly in the "build the barn then paint it camp." Always have been, always will be. Nice color on a poor frame does no one any good, especially in a bird that was designed to provide a homestead with a steady supply of meat and eggs. You can't eat color!