Show Off Your American Gamefowl and Chat Thread!!!

[Poultry Friend]

We will be building a pen for the Dominiques where the sides will be high enough for the Game to not see him and with metal dug down so predators and the game cock cannot dig in.

We plan on letting them free-range when we are home and building a large screened enclosure for them the rest of the time. Within that pen we plan on building two breeding pens. This will have a larger attached indoor coop as well. The other coop will be similar.

My neighobor is allowing us to keep them on his place with leg bands until we can build ours. I swung by this morning to give them a tomato the ants got into and some other veggies. They really likes that breakfast! I also got to see the hens he picked out for me, and Wow! Stunning hens!

One is lighter in color with a darker head and one is the spangle. The other 3 are a medium brown. The cock looks just like his dad with a little more white. Very pretty! I decided to name him Holiday, after Doc Holiday. His ladies are Clemintine, Rosemary, Norma Jane, Betty Sue, and Mae West.

I am so happy today!

 

[centrarchid]

We will be building a pen for the Dominiques where the sides will be high enough for the Game to not see him and with metal dug down so predators and the game cock cannot dig in.

We plan on letting them free-range when we are home and building a large screened enclosure for them the rest of the time. Within that pen we plan on building two breeding pens. This will have a larger attached indoor coop as well. The other coop will be similar.

My neighobor is allowing us to keep them on his place with leg bands until we can build ours. I swung by this morning to give them a tomato the ants got into and some other veggies. They really likes that breakfast! I also got to see the hens he picked out for me, and Wow! Stunning hens!

One is lighter in color with a darker head and one is the spangle. The other 3 are a medium brown. The cock looks just like his dad with a little more white. Very pretty! I decided to name him Holiday, after Doc Holiday. His ladies are Clemintine, Rosemary, Norma Jane, Betty Sue, and Mae West.

I am so happy today!

Please post pics!

 

[Poultry Friend]

I wish I could! I don't have a camera, but I am going to get one simply to show off Holiday!

I got two tomatoes that were being eaten on the vine by ants and some yougurt and took it to him and his ladies for dinner. Afterward I got him and gentled him some. This morning he was not too interested in being held and pecked at me, but tonight (since he was tired) he let me hold him and stroke him.

Centrachid: Where is MO is Holt Summit? I was thinking, if you had some Kelsos once I got a good brood we could trade. I am near Saint Louis.

I also got to hold the spangle (Norma Jean) and Basil the Dominique Roo.

I was beaming from ear to ear today at work, telling all my co-workers about my amazing new chickens....they looked at me as if I was bonkers!

 

[centrarchid]

I wish I could! I don't have a camera, but I am going to get one simply to show off Holiday!

I got two tomatoes that were being eaten on the vine by ants and some yougurt and took it to him and his ladies for dinner. Afterward I got him and gentled him some. This morning he was not too interested in being held and pecked at me, but tonight (since he was tired) he let me hold him and stroke him.

Centrachid: Where is MO is Holt Summit? I was thinking, if you had some Kelsos once I got a good brood we could trade. I am near Saint Louis.

I also got to hold the spangle (Norma Jean) and Basil the Dominique Roo.

I was beaming from ear to ear today at work, telling all my co-workers about my amazing new chickens....they looked at me as if I was bonkers!

I leave near Holts Summit, across river from State Capital. I can see capital building when up in tree in backyard and smell the mighty Missouri River most days since it is within walking distance.

I have only one strain of games that was inherited. They are "Hatch" looking and 5.5 to 6.0 lbs with a few outliers. They are not pretty like Kelsos but as I remember my birds have feathers that hold up a lot better and mine can also do the free-range thing with predator pressure better.


I do not have resources to tackle multiple game strains with my breeding methodolgy.

 

[Poultry Friend]

I leave near Holts Summit, across river from State Capital.  I can see capital building when up in tree in backyard and smell the mighty Missouri River most days since it is within walking distance.

I have only one strain of games that was inherited. They are "Hatch" looking and 5.5 to 6.0 lbs with a few outliers.  They are not pretty like Kelsos but as I remember my birds have feathers that hold up a lot better and mine can also do the free-range thing with predator pressure better.


I do not have resources to tackle multiple game strains with my breeding methodolgy.

I don't know. I saw the pictures you posted, and they are not what I would call ugly!

I was reading up about breeding and the dangers of adding to many new lines. Would I need to seek out more Archie Kehr Kelsos, or can I just look for more Kelsos?

 

[centrarchid]

I don't know. I saw the pictures you posted, and they are not what I would call ugly!
I was reading up about breeding and the dangers of adding to many new lines. Would I need to seek out more Archie Kehr Kelsos, or can I just look for more Kelsos?

To truely preserve the quality of the Archie Kehr Kelso line more numbers of actual broodfowl would be required and the sex ratio would not favor hens. Records concerning how individual birds in line are related to each other would also need to be kept. Ideally the birds, roosters in particular would need to be selected under the same pressures used to develope the line which is not legal. When not maintaining the same type of selection pressure, about the best thing you can do to slow degrading of line is use of linebreeding. For a linebreeding-only system to work you need to start off with quality birds. Assessing pit-quality is again not doable. At some point birds used to found your line(s) will need to be replaced owing to loss (age, disease, predations, etc.). Each time you have to retire a bird being bred back in linebreeding you will loose genes that make the line special so over time you will have something that is not only an incomplete repressentation of the Archie Kehr Kelso line but also even the subline you started with. The more broodfowl you start ands carray through each generation, slower changes will be. As changes take place in your breeding hands, you will be justified in calling the birds the Poultry Friend - Archie Kehr - Kelso line. Since selection will not be carried out in manner of how original line was developed, ultimately the game qualities will be degraded. I will argue the free-ranging qualities developed for many game lines, even the working pit fowl types, has already been lost since walk breeding and rearing has largely been dropped for what is now almost entirely the breeding systems employing pens in cockyards where medications, complete diets and much more effective predator control measures have enabled a deadening of the extra-pit survival qualities of many gamefowl lines. It is those extra-pit survival qualities I think you value as much as appearance. Selection for such could still be maintained but ultimately it requires a lot of birds and allowing some to be lost (actually most) to disease, predators, and even extremes in weather.


More quality Kelsos but problem is quality and purity almost certainly to be unknowns and their will be issue of cost in most intances with birds reputated to be quality. It is a high risk game for being took.


Somewhere I went on tangent, sorry.

My birds are ugly thankyou!

 

[Poultry Friend]

I swung by to see the birds today and chatted some more about the line. Here is what I found out:

He had known Archie Kehr since 1960 when he got his first birds from his line. This early blood is still in this flock. A few years back (not sure how many) he got a bird from his brother in MI. This bird was from a line that had a broodcock from AR. He had been breeding this line for about 20 years and out of this line (All Kelso's) he got one bird whom was a multiple derby winner. They called him Arkansas. His brother gave him this bird. This is the only non-Archie Kehr in the line, but he was a pure Kelso.

The last Archie Kehr infusion was 8 years ago with two banded birds from his flock: One Cock (AWK36) and one hen (AWK4?) <----I don't remember which number he said on the hen, I think it was 46, but I will have to double check.

My stag (he is 1 year old) Holiday is either pure kelso, 1/2 Kelso 1/2 Hatch, or 3/4 Kelso 1/4 Hatch. Either way, his sire is above cock (AWK36) He has three hens in with this bird- the banded hen and two others.

There is a small chance that there is some white hatch blood in this line, but he feels it is remote. A few years ago he got a white hatch with green legs from (forgot the name he said, but someone well known) He placed this hen in with AWK36. So there is a chance of some of that in this flock.

He said he use to be better about tracking the line, banding all the birds to know who was out of who, but I think his declining health made this harder for him. It does make it kinda hard for me to know how my flock is related, but I do have some idea, and for sure I know who the father is, since they only really breed that cock from Archie's flock.

He also said that Archie got his birds directly from Walter Kelso, and (at least from what I understood) that cock he has (AWK36) is the son of a bird directly from Walter Kelso, so that would make Holiday the grandson of Walter Kelso's bird, and more Archie Kehr on his dam's side. (I might have misunderstood completely, not sure. It can be hard to follow what my neighbor is saying and I have to ask questions a few time to figure out the answer)

I did see what you had wrote about the difficulty of keeping the line pure with only one Cock, so I asked him about the chance of keeping a second game on his property if I took care of him. He agreed and I asked him to select the bird he would choose. He said that although the cock I picked was good, that the one on the end (pure kelso) was the best body. His color was good, but not great, but his body and personality was perfect.

So now I have a second boy! His name is Wyatt. His father is the same as Holiday (AWK36) and his mother is either the AWK4? or the daughter of AWK36.

Hope that makes sense....LOL

 

[centrarchid]

Sadly, yes, makes sense.

For starters, assume each bird bird you just required is unique by ignoring how they are related to each other. These are your founders. Give founders ID's you can track. I recommend making marks redundant as in one unique leg-band and one unique wing-band per bird. Occasionally bands are lossed. Those founders are gold! House them in critter proof coops / pens that are also protected from extremes particularly of heat. Start looking into nutrition. You want quality for maintenance but not too much. Overfeeding shortens life expectancy.

Then decide how many lines you can support. Each line will be based on one of the founders. This ultimately means how many birds can you rear and house as adults.

Got any ideas? I think you will find you are getting into a costly although potentially rewarding endeavor.


Look into line-breeding. I can explain theory behind as it relates to genetic conservation. The bulk of explanations as used by most fowl folks tends to be lacking in that area.

Do not ignore contacts with your source. Knowing geneologies of founders can aid with making choices about within your line matings since not all possible matings are practical. Also ask around and find others with similar fowl. Many such folks are generous with their knowledge and some will also be very well versed in what qualities a quality Kelso has.

 

[Poultry Friend]

Another question:

BBR hens- can they look different then each other? When I search for the pattern I get two images- one is almost all brown, the other has a paler body with a darker head and tail. I have three of the even brown hens and one with the lighter body with darker tail and head. I am trying to figure out what color they are.

Any ideas?

Also, would a female duckwing also have white on the bottom of her wing? He has one hen that shows this pattern, and if she is a duckwing I want to get her as well, but I was not sure if a duckwing hen would have this.

 

[Greybear23]

Another question:

BBR hens- can they look different then each other? When I search for the pattern I get two images- one is almost all brown, the other has a paler body with a darker head and tail. I have three of the even brown hens and one with the lighter body with darker tail and head. I am trying to figure out what color they are.

Any ideas?

Also, would a female duckwing also have white on the bottom of her wing? He has one hen that shows this pattern, and if she is a duckwing I want to get her as well, but I was not sure if a duckwing hen would have this.

I am not sure about the Duckwing female, but I do not think it has white in the wings, as for the BBR the ones you describe are, Darker with a lighter breast is the BBR hen, the lighter with darker tail and head is the hen for the Partridge Pattern, the Cocks look very similar in the BBR and Partridge if you don't know what to look for, I have found there are more of the Partridge pattern than the BBR in most of the Reds that come from sporting birds, JMO!!! Lynn in Okla.