What exactly does breed for resistance mean?

[fowlman01]

Quote:
I would consider any bird coughing or sneezing a serious problem. I don't have any recommendations other than watch the flock and be sure that you don't get around other birds until you find out what is going on with your birds. Keep the sick birds away from the birds that are OK. You can try antibiotics, but be sure that you give them for the recommended amount of time. They will not help the birds if it is a virus.

It is very difficult to diagnose poultry illnesses.

Walt

Walt

 

[cybercat]

Hello all interesting thread. Vaccination has been a hot topic in many species of animals including humans. Many years ago when I bred dogs and went to shows this was truley talked about and some research done. Just for the record I have a vet teck degree so have read med reports on this. Now here is something that was discovered. Vaccinating for a few times Can last many years so that yearly does not need to be done. Say you vaccinate for 3 years running, the next year you test too see if you need too. Because said animal might have all the immunity it needs at that point. So if it has it vaccinating again would not do anything but cost you money.

Now this study has never been done with poultry that I know of. If it has please correct me. But I would imagine that like many other animals this truth might be a good case for not too vaccinate every year if you have to vaccinate. Vaccinations are one reason that many diseases are so wide spread too but lets not get into that here. Fact is not many can test for whatever reason be it too many and cost or no good avain vet near.

So for those that show they will vaccinate, just to be safe. They have way to much at stake not too. If it is a good idea or not that is there choise. Now for someone not showing they make there decission based on fear. Remember most here have only owned domestic house pets (cats & dogs) which get vaccinated every year. Chickens are a whole nother animal. Many here think since they do that to thier 4 legged pets they need to do it with their chickens. Fact is only in certain circumstanses does it need to be done. Overcrowding would be one and unclean quarters another or tight sealed quaters. In some cases these would overlap.

Now if you have chickens that are not in tight over crowed quarters that get outside. Then I would not over worry about it. Culling sick takes care of most problems that way. If it happens. Resistance to sickness is just that and nothing more. One does not get sick, therfor they are resistant. Why vaccinate when that would give them the disease that you might not have on your place to start. I would test first before going that route.

BTW one can have a resistant flock to worms and cocci. If you free range your chickens at least part of the day that will help them be resistant to these. Over wet conditions are the main cause for cocci and it is not a killer unless it is an exstreme case. It pass with time. Free ranging helps for the chickens get a little at a time and build up immunity to it. Same with worms if they can get at plants that are known to work for controlling worms. Fact is chickens eat worms all the time they tend to be more resistant to them than cats and dogs and goats.

 

[RareBreedFancier]

Quote:
If you want to know just how badly Quarantine can stuff up look up EI (Equine Influenza) in Australia. Horses are considerably larger and harder to hide and people were still taking them out of quarantine zones and spreading it. Lets face it, you can't shove a horse in the car boot/trunk like a chicken and drive out but people got them out!

You also have migratory birds to think about. No one is stopping their movement.

We did get rid of EI but it caused massive inconvenience for most horse owners. It shut down the racing and breeding industry, canceled shows and some people got locked down in quarantine for extended periods at showgrounds.

Horses don't migrate like birds and they are almost never found in people's backyards. Horses also can't be posted. I don't know if AI can be spread on eggs but I wouldn't assume it can't.

Horses are also considered MUCH more valuable that chickens (it was brought in by uber expensive shuttle stallions) and EI doesn't harm humans.

Unfortunately I think if AI was found the results would be devastating. I think there would most likely be mass culling. If it's a strain dangerous to humans I think they would have no qualms culling any birds in the area.

Personally I plan to cull anything showing signs of illness and cross my fingers we don't get anything nasty here. We don't have most of the nasty things you do in this country and I sincerely hope it stays that way.

 

[WallTenters]

http://www.vetmed.wsu.edu/depts_waddl/poultry/2010/Cherian.pdf

A veterinary perspective on disease control using immune system response.

 

[WallTenters]

I guess I'm a bit confused by all of this ... some of the previous posts have kind of thrown me for a loop.

What I was told growing up is...

Non-Exposure = null
Exposure + No Illness = resistance (happy days)
Exposure + Illness = the ax
Exposure + Illness, then recovery = the ax

Is this not correct?

I think we will be vaccinating for Marek's, NC and IB... not sure yet on anything else. We'd love to not vaccinate for anything, but my business partner's sons have their 4H birds on the same property, even though they're in different coops, and we'd hate to see them get sick from something brought home from them showing or us showing.

I guess we're hoping that with those three covered, that's two shots (NC/IB combined). All of our birds are in generally good health, and we hope that if we do catch something else at a show that we will have enough surviving (uninfected birds) to at least maintain genetics if those three diseases are vaccinated against.

Perhaps once we have better established breeding flocks and have vaccinated for these three for some time, we can start weaning out the vaccinations over the years. Meaning we might keep up the Marek's and stop the NC/IB vaccine. Any birds that show signs of these will go. Then eventually stop the Marek's vaccine as well.

Any thoughts on this? And no we won't be doing a million booster vaccines either. Once, possibly one booster, then that bird's done.

We would/do treat for cocci as needed, but so far have had zero problems. We have very sandy soil here in Central Oregon and I think that helps. We do use medicated chick starter.

 

[RareBreedFancier]

Quote:
That is correct to me.

Out of curiosity, what is the lowest dose you can buy the Marek's vaccine in over there? Here it's a thousand dose pack and since it goes off so fast it's not affordable to hobby breeders wanting to vaccinate only a small number of birds at a time. I had heard something about trying to import 100 dose packs but it didn't take off as far as I know.

I'll be breeding for natural resistance because I want a naturally healthy flock. I don't want to use drugs on them and vaccination is cost prohibitive.

 

[WallTenters]

It's 14.99 for 1000 doses.. so even though we'd be wasting a lot, really $15 isn't going to set us back too far in each hatch, we figure.

Sorry, corrected my numbers

 

[kathyinmo]

Quote:
Where do you shop? I usually see it for between $15. and $20.

 

[RareBreedFancier]

Quote:

Well someone is making a lot of money selling it here!

I shall have to hunt up the current price but I'm sure I was told well over $100 when I last inquired.

EDIT to add: If I could get it that cheap it would be worth my while to import it direct.

 

[WallTenters]

Sorry Kathy you're right, I just was being a ditz for a moment. I missed the 1 on the first part and then my brain just went with it lol.