17%? 18% 20%? I'm so confused!!

[chickened]

I tend to agree to get more than 16% from organic is tough, I have tried that. Something to consider is the type of protein, fish meal is a very good source of protein that will absolutely improve your egg production and still remain at 16%. Animal protein is very under rated but consider how many bugs a chicken eats during the warmer months.

 

[NYREDS]

I feed only one feed throughout the life span of the birds I raise. It's a 22% protein Gane Bird Grower Finisher. I've fed this way for years & it works out well for me. I find that the young birds feather out faster & maintain better feather quality throughout their lives than they did when I followed a more traditional starter, grower, layer feeding program. They also hold condition better & lay well on this feeding program.
Another bonus is only having to have one feed on hand & since I usually have birds of different ages at any give time there's no remembering who gets fed what. My wife especially appreciates this if I'm away at a show & she feeds for me.

 

[Speceider]

"one black beetle is said to have all the protein a hen needs all day"

I'd like to see the reference for that.

Clint

 

[kuntrygirl]

Quote:
If that is true, then my hens are set for the rest of the year. Those little annoying beetles come out when it starts getting dark in the evening and party all night long until the wee hours of the morning. I may set up camp and go beetle hunting at night and start canning them for my hens. (just joking

)

 

[chickened]

I have at least a dozen books on chickens and cannot/will not go try to find it but do remember reading it. Beetle are very high in protein though and that info is out there.
Quote:

 

[Country Parson]

I use 16% year round, and my hens lay extremely well. Last year I used scratch during the growing season (since I free ranged), but now at my local feed store scratch is actually 10cents higher than 16% layer feed, so I'll stick with the layer feed year round. I would never feed higher than this for layers, and personally think 18% and higher is a waste. But I do supplement in the winter with table scraps, and they get daily scraps from the garden in the growing season.

I would recommend supplementing with extra calcium, as I've found the layer feed doesn't contain enough.

 

[Speceider]

Chickened wrote "I have at least a dozen books on chickens and cannot/will not go try to find it but do remember reading it. Beetle are very high in protein though and that info is out there"

I work with avian nutrition. I question whether a bettle could support dailly protein maintence needs for a hen and am certain it wouldn't support egg production. I have dozens of papers with the crude protein content of beetles, but most of the protein is chitin which cannot be digested by a chicken, making it biologically unavailable. Because you are unwilling to provide your source so I can evaluate it, I have to question your statement.

Clint

 

[chickened]

I believe I read that in the Chicken Health Handbook but not really sure as I said earlier. I don't think it was meant as scientific data and implied that it is all you need for daily protein but as an observation and general statement that beetles (must be thousands of them) were a food source of high protein now whether or not a chicken actually benefits from them is another story. I do know mine eat them and they don't come out whole.

I removed my statement on the original post. The beetle statement was meant as a advocate for free ranging nothing more.

Chitin is actually a polysaccharide not a keratin protein. I am no expert on this by no means but I did read that the red flour beetle has 29 different proteins in addition to 13 chitin metabolic enzymes.I think chitin from my understanding is the exoskeleton shell of bugs among other critters and is a result of protein binding in layman's terms of course. Again I am no expert but it seems the "guts" of a bug is where the available nutrition is.

Just out of curiosity how much protein does a chicken need on a daily basis for a non-layer ordinary chicken? My research says 16% which is not hard to come by free ranging. And of course egg laying you would need more protein but the original jungle fowl only laid 50 or less eggs per year, usually much less.

 

[Chris09]

Quote:

They may be High in Protein but, what type Amino Acids are there make up, are the proteins able to be used by poultry.
The amount of Protein that a feed (or Bug) has isn't everything. it is the type of proteins.
As you may or may not know, Protein is essential to the structure of red blood cells, for the proper functioning of antibodies resisting infection, for the regulation of enzymes and hormones, for growth, and for the repair of body tissue. Protein can be naturally produced in the body from processing Amino Acids, but can be supplemented as raw protein also.
Amino acids play central roles both as building blocks of proteins and as intermediates in metabolism. The 21 amino acids that are found within proteins convey a vast array of chemical versatility. The precise amino acid content, and the sequence of those amino acids, of a specific protein, is determined by the sequence of the bases in the gene that encodes that protein. The chemical properties of the amino acids of proteins determine the biological activity of the protein. Proteins not only catalyze all (or most) of the reactions in living cells, they control virtually all cellular process. In addition, proteins contain within their amino acid sequences the necessary information to determine how that protein will fold into a three dimensional structure, and the stability of the resulting structure.

Chris

 

[chickened]

This is all interesting but does a chicken benefit by eating a beetle? I think so or they most likely would not eat it. A vegetative diet will sustain a chicken for a while but they must consume larger amounts compared to what one beetle provides regardless of what happens to it once it is eaten.