a bit of a dog problem

[Shellz]

Yep! Neighborhood dogs get escorted off my property by my dogs. They don't get the chance to chase my birds. Coyotes & foxes, same deal. I do have firearms & legally prepared & willing to use them when necessary. Chickens taken by ANYTHING, is taking food out of my family's mouths! Only exceptions are protected birds of prey. Thankfully haven't lost any to those yet in 4 years.

 

[QuirkySue]

Just to clarify, my dogs never hurt any of his animals. His own dogs have all been roamers but he doesn't value them as anything other than doorbells as he calls them. So he wouldn't care much if his dog got shot and likewise wouldn't have thought twice about killing ours. He is also a dirty farmer, leaving beef offal out in the yard overnight which attracts predators of all kinds and is irresistible even to my trained dogs. That's not playing fair. I shouldn't have to pen or fence my porch pet when stuff like that is going on. I hope those of you who would shoot on a second chance after a warning have better farm practices.

I had a 35lb mutt and still have a 45lb Australian shepherd. The Aussie herding drive is strong but after dragging her back across the road a few times she leaves his cattle alone. Occasionally she will still bark at our own 2 steers and chase them away from the fence line.

 

[Sonia]

refusing to pen or fence your porch pet exposes it to the risk of being shot if it goes on someone elses property. sorry but thats the way it ism especially in rural areas.

 

[redneck farmer]

I have found that paint ball guns work great - If you hit the dog in the side it makes the impression that if he goes near your flock Agian,,,, it will get hit with a paint ball gun.
Before I had chickens my iresponceable neighbors let there dogs roam an they would fight my dog- I got a paint ball gun an told my dog to back off an when those two dogs where confused why my dog fell back I shot them with the paint ball gun like twice each an them dogs come NOWHERE near my dog or even my property

 

[WalkingOnSunshine]

Wow I'm shocked and saddened by some of these responses. My dog is my baby! I'd gladly and happily pay any amount to replace chickens and freak right out if she was filled with birdshot or worse, killed, over a chicken. I'm appalled that many would just shoot because you have the right to. A feral dog, coyote, wild cat...no problem. But someone's PET?

When we moved from the city to the country we asked the old timer next door to PLEASE not shoot our dogs, we would gladly reimburse him any losses if we could not break them of chasing calves or bothering his chickens. I hope you can work it out with the owners and it doesn't end in such an ugly way.

Let me put the loss of a calf in perspective for you. So you think you could reimburse a farmer for the loss of a calf? Well, let's see. An average Holstein dairy heifer at our farm will have her first calf at two years old. That first year she will give around 30,000 pounds of milk. As of today, milk is worth $19.00/hundredweight. That's a gross income of $57,000 dollars in the first year with that animal, PLUS a 50% chance of another heifer calf. The second lactation, besides another calf that has a 50% chance of being female, the cow will do better. So let's say 35,000 pounds of milk a year at $19/hundredweight, for a gross income of $66,500. Now, a useful life of a dairy cow is about eight years. So let's say that she brings in a gross income of $389,500 over her lifetime, PLUS six calves, 50% of whom will also bring in similar amounts of income once they reach two years old. Of course, there are a LOT of inputs in dairy farming, and that $389,000 is certainly MOSTLY taken up by costs, but still, a dairy cow will net thousands of dollars worth of income over her lifetime PLUS calves which also bring in thousands of dollars of income over each of their lifetimes. Furthermore, each generation of calves tends to be genetically superior to the generation before, so you're not just losing that calf, you're losing her bloodlines as well, which is an even bigger blow than the loss of the calf itself.

So your dog kills a calf. You offer the farmer market price for what your predator did. That's about $90 at a livestock auction. To compensate the farmer for THOUSANDS in lost income, plus all the calves she would have had, plus her genetics.

You moved from the city. Great. You clearly know nothing about farming. LEARN something instead of blithely assuming that money fixes everything.

I read your reply that he's not a good farmer. Poor managers do cause a LOT of problems, and you certainly have the right to tell him that you can't keep your dogs away from the offal. But if you can't, it's not his responsibility to clean up, it's yours to figure out a way to keep your dogs home. Even if that means that they only go out on a leash or you put up a stout fence. This is fair. You keep your dogs on your property no matter what, or they are at risk. If his dogs roam, then call animal control or shoot them if they chase your chickens. This is also fair. What's not fair is making him change what he does because you can't keep your dogs on your own property.

 

[CedarAcres]

I feel like I just have to comment on what QuirkySue said. My dogs are my babies too. I would never, ever want anything to happen to them. Which is why they do not wander. I keep an eye on them at all times, simply because I treasure them. If you let your dogs wander away, you have no power over what happens to them. They could get hit by a car, attacked by a rabid animal, shot by someone, or even stolen. Responsible dog owners do not let their dogs run free. If you cannot train your dog to stay on your property, then they should not be loose. Some dogs have no issue being trained to stay. We've had great dogs that would never leave our side and we never had a worry. Our current dog is not that way. I would never allow him to be outside unattended.

And people also must understand that one type of animal is not better than another. Just because you love your dog does not make it more valuable than someone else's animal (who they probably love too). One of our neighbors dogs does wander. I don't like it. Personally, I would not shoot him, but I would report him to animal control. I've heard of people's entire flocks being lost to a dog. You cannot compensate for that in my opinion.

 

[Shellz]

I have found that paint ball guns work great - If you hit the dog in the side it makes the impression that if he goes near your flock Agian,,,, it will get hit with a paint ball gun.
Before I had chickens my iresponceable neighbors let there dogs roam an they would fight my dog- I got a paint ball gun an told my dog to back off an when those two dogs where confused why my dog fell back I shot them with the paint ball gun like twice each an them dogs come NOWHERE near my dog or even my property

That's awesome!!!

 

[QuirkySue]

Well his animals are beefers, not dairy and so the numbers are not as extreme 200$ calf, $2000+ grown,butchered and sold as quarters less costs and his chickens are hatchery layers not expensive breeding stock etc but yes I can see your point. No dog is worth 400k and money can't fix everything. In that situation i suppose I'd be lucky to only lose my dog. Not my house and everything else too.

I don't agree with you that it's fair to expect me to try harder and not his to change his ways of doing things or clean up. No one but us being right next to him would ever know what a disgusting pig he is so he has gotten away with it for 20 yrs. We will never be real farmers on this small chunk of land but we are also not ridiculous city people complaining about farm smells, tractor noise or a rooster crowing at 4am. I'm glad our dogs were good, he didn't shoot, and you're not my neighbour! (Lol) Maybe I don't know anything, I guess I just hope farmers pause before pulling that trigger and only do so as a LAST resort, rights and all.

If my dog comes to his property due to blood and guts spread out everywhere and kills a ranging chicken and ends up shot for it, I won't be the tolerant good neighbour and you can bet he will have his hands full with health inspectors, bylaw enforcement, police, fines and any other wrath we could rain down on him. But that's another thread and going slightly OT.

 

[QuirkySue]

My dog almost always is on the porch, or at the end of the driveway when outside and not right by our side. She does not wander and when we are not home she is kept inside. I just had to add that so it's fully understood that I am not an irresponsible pet owner.

 

[Shellz]

Let me put the loss of a calf in perspective for you. So you think you could reimburse a farmer for the loss of a calf? Well, let's see. An average Holstein dairy heifer at our farm will have her first calf at two years old. That first year she will give around 30,000 pounds of milk. As of today, milk is worth $19.00/hundredweight. That's a gross income of $57,000 dollars in the first year with that animal, PLUS a 50% chance of another heifer calf. The second lactation, besides another calf that has a 50% chance of being female, the cow will do better. So let's say 35,000 pounds of milk a year at $19/hundredweight, for a gross income of $66,500. Now, a useful life of a dairy cow is about eight years. So let's say that she brings in a gross income of $389,500 over her lifetime, PLUS six calves, 50% of whom will also bring in similar amounts of income once they reach two years old. Of course, there are a LOT of inputs in dairy farming, and that $389,000 is certainly MOSTLY taken up by costs, but still, a dairy cow will net thousands of dollars worth of income over her lifetime PLUS calves which also bring in thousands of dollars of income over each of their lifetimes. Furthermore, each generation of calves tends to be genetically superior to the generation before, so you're not just losing that calf, you're losing her bloodlines as well, which is an even bigger blow than the loss of the calf itself.

So your dog kills a calf. You offer the farmer market price for what your predator did. That's about $90 at a livestock auction.  To compensate the farmer for THOUSANDS in lost income, plus all the calves she would have had, plus her genetics.

You moved from the city. Great. You clearly know nothing about farming. LEARN something instead of blithely assuming that money fixes everything.

I read your reply that he's not a good farmer. Poor managers do cause a LOT of problems, and you certainly have the right to tell him that you can't keep your dogs away from the offal. But if you can't, it's not his responsibility to clean up, it's yours to figure out a way to keep your dogs home. Even if that means that they only go out on a leash or you put up a stout fence. This is fair. You keep your dogs on your property no matter what, or they are at risk. If his dogs roam, then call animal control or shoot them if they chase your chickens. This is also fair. What's not fair is making him change what he does because you can't keep your dogs on your own property.

Well said! I moved 4 years ago from the city to the country. I also have 2 dogs, no fence & lots of chickens. I accepted the risk initially, then learned it would be in our best interest & dogs as well, to train them where the property lines are. They are excellent at keeping preds (other dogs included) off our property & our dogs stay off of everyone else's. No chicken losses since I got my s*** together!