Ameraucana thread for posting pictures and discussing our birds

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I think this is a dilemma that probably all of us who got into breeding and hatching chicks have encountered. The joy of newborn babies all the time and seeing the little potlickers grow is something that one can never get enough of. That usually leads to an ongoing hatching process. Which then leads to chicks congregating together at different ages. Not to mention possible overcrowding that comes with its own set of issues.

Having gone thru this and wearing myself thin in the process of not only moving birds around but the constant necessity of cleaning various brooders, pens, coops, etc.; I am now limiting myself on my hatches. I have also found thru review of my records that chicks hatched during some months simply don't seem to do as well as other months. So why bother hatching then?

I would recommend looking at what you have or plan to have in the way of facilities. Then plan out your hatches accordingly. Perhaps larger hatches at one time would make more sense than ongoing hatches.

God Bless,

Thank you for the input. I agree, maybe two or three larger hatches per year would be more practical than a bunch of little ones.
Right now I have everything drawn out on paper (I am visual learner..lol) with all my future breeding pens, layer pens, tractors, grow out pens, etc. that I have all there. I am adding names to each pen and planning who is gonna go where in the next couple months. And I think I still have two empty pens. Woohoo! ok I will resist urge to fill them right away
lol.png
Just trying to get my brain around how this actually is gonna work. I have never had to get rid of a rooster before so I am contemplating what I am gonna do with all my extra dudes. Getting rid of those boys does free up space too.
For instance I have a totally cute frizzle naked neck that was included in an order of eggs just for fun. He is a crack up and I love him but...just don't need him in anyway at all. I will keep his two sisters cuz they lay green eggs but...don't need him.
Ok this is off ameraucana topic but check out this cute video... He is 4 months old.
lau.gif
cracks me up.
http://christiesnails.com/movies/newyear.mov
 
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Very wise advise and one that I will put more into practice....

I do not mean to speak for TF, but I think it would depend on your geography rather than particular months. I would say to go with your environments natural cycle (early spring versus late summer)... the more time the chicks have to grow out the better decisions one can make on culls, etc.

TF has much more experience than I do so I am sure he will elaborate. I just know from the small hatches I have produces that my early spring chicks develope better, fuller and quicker. And, I live in San Diego, Ca.
 
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I'd have to go back and check again to be sure but I think Feb/Mar was my best early months and July/Aug was my best late months. Both these periods provide optimum weather conditions for growth and prevention for disease as well as providing enough time for them to be in fairly good condition for the Mar/April and Oct-Dec shows.

How many chicks I have to sort thru to get those I'm keeping is a number that can vary although last year I hatched about 150 Ameraucana chicks which is about what I've been hatching out per year. That being said, the actual number of lines I've been carrying is slowly but surely being reduced so I am getting more birds from fewer lines. I think I had 6-7 lines in last year's breeding program - maybe a couple more - but while I haven't put my breeding program together for this year yet (so I don't know exactly what birds I actually have left at present), I know I won't have as many lines this year as last. Eventually, I will get down to just an A & B line for the Wheatens and an A & B line for the BW's.

That being said, I still plan to hatch about 150 or so. It's all part of my plan. As I decrease the # of lines, I'll increase the # of chicks which should help me determine which of the lines is the strongest and most consistent. Then I shouldn't have to keep as many for quite as long which allows me to sell more sooner and not have to wait as long to cull.
I hope that makes sense.

Also, keep in mind that I breed and show four breeds. My facilities and ability to make time/effort commitments only allows me to work with two breeds per year. Sometimes I can get a little work done with a third breed but nonetheless I am forced to rotate the breeds I work with. This year just happens to be one that I am devoting more time to the Ameraucanas and Welsummers. I hope to be able to work some on the Barnevelders and doubt I'll touch the Buckeyes at all. Last year the Ameraucanas got a very late start. I didn't start on them until after I had worked with my Barnies and Buckeyes. So many of my pullets haven't even laid yet.

Because of the late start I did also hatch late - I believe all the way into October - and those late hatches just did not do well. Many of those October hatchings died, some got CRD, and many of the others exhibited poor growth. This is why I won't hatch that late again. I'm convinced the birds just do a lot better the faster one can get them into the outdoors and especially sunshine.

Hope all that helps.

God Bless,
 
That helps alot. I especially like the fact that you rotate the birds you focus on each year. That has been one of my biggest concerns. I want to have five main breeds but was at a loss in how to really make progress and give them the attention they deserve.

Another question I thought of after I posted. The general rule of thumb posted on various boards is that it takes 10 chicks to find one. It seems to me that the better the flock that (right now) I am purchasing from, the better my odds... thus the extra money to get better birds. Right?? When you spoke of getting down to two lines and then learning their consistency, I was reading that to mean that you will expect to get better than 1 out of 10. Am I right?

Also, are you crossing those lines to get fewer overall or just culling out the weaker lines as you go?

Thanks!! You guys on this board have been SO SO helpful!!
 
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Five breeds would really be pushing it for me. It all depends on just how much time/effort you wish to put into a breed and how quick you want to see results as well as what type of breeding program you choose. The breeding program coupled with your facilities probably dictates more than any other what you can do. If you are just starting out, personally I would recommend starting with just one or two breeds at the most. Sure, have the others but don't worry too much about working on them until you've started with the others.

Again, whether or not the ratio is 10:1, I would say is dictated by a number of different factors. You are correct, first off, when you say it all depends on what you start with. Second, much will depend on your initial breeding program and desired goals. I recommend starting with just one or two traits and getting them set before moving on to others. But you could, say for example, start with one breed and have two different lines from the same birds. One line focuses on one or two traits and the other one or two different traits. Or perhaps you will need to breed separately for males and females of a particular breed/variety. The better quality of birds you start with the less time/effort you will have to put in to get to where you want to be.

For example, let's say you were going to start from scratch to make a Wheaten Ameraucana. Don't know why one would but for the sake of example let's say you do - just because. Initially you're going to wind up with a bunch of trash and you may have to go thru 50 or 100 chicks to get one good one. Which I imagine is what the Old Timers orignally did. Now we have established Wheatens and Blue Wheatens. However, the LF in particular, still need a lot of work. So now the 1:10 really depends on what your desired end results are. For me, as the birds get better and better, my requirements get more and more narrow.

None of my birds are anywhere's close to where I want them to be but my hope is that if I continue long enough, eventually I will get to a place where 8 or 9 birds out of 10 look identical and they're all keepers. Then I will say that I've got my birds set.

No, yes and no on the crossing lines. Right now I'm still trying to get down to an A & B line (each) for Wheatens and Blue Wheatens. Once I get there I will Line Breed inside of each line until a crossbreed is necessary. In other words, once I get to an A line and a B line, I'll breed A to A and B to B until I encounter a need to crossbreed A over to B for hybrid vigor. At the rate I'm going however, it will be several more years I think before I get down to just an A & B line for each variety.

The purpose for my crossing lines at this point is to some extent to get down to just the two lines for each variety. That being said, I am also still trying to figure out what each of the original lines I got contain genetically. For example, I originally started with four males from four different lines from my breeder and four females from three different lines from the same breeder. One of my females was from the same line as one of the males so I did not breed them together. This gave me a total of 15 different breeding lines of my own to start with.

As you might well imagine, I started out with a host of variables to work from. When you look at just the various traits from the SOP to be concerned about you can get a pretty good idea what I'm talking about. Never mind just general type but how about comb shape, eye color, leg color, clean-faced birds, general overall variations in color but then add in egg color! Boy howdy! But eventually thru methodical breeding practices and meticulous records, I was able to identify certain lines from certain birds that I could just get rid of altogether.

Keep in mind that I'm not even close to being any kind of a geneticist nor would I say I'm even an average breeder. Everything I learn I learn from my mistakes. If it works I do it again. If it don't work, I don't do it again. I see no sense in repeating a mistake - even once. I also learn by being a sponge. I try to soak up everything I can from the more experienced breeders.

On that note, I would end by saying that if you don't subscribe to the Poultry Press, I would recommend doing so. Kenny Troiano has been putting excerpts of his book in the PP and I have learned much from those. It was interesting to see that some of what I was already doing is a good way to go but I've also learned more about the pro's and con's of other various practices.

You can always feel free to email me if you have any questions and I'm happy to take phone calls as well.

God Bless,
 
Quote:
Five breeds would really be pushing it for me. It all depends on just how much time/effort you wish to put into a breed and how quick you want to see results as well as what type of breeding program you choose. The breeding program coupled with your facilities probably dictates more than any other what you can do. If you are just starting out, personally I would recommend starting with just one or two breeds at the most. Sure, have the others but don't worry too much about working on them until you've started with the others.

Again, whether or not the ratio is 10:1, I would say is dictated by a number of different factors. You are correct, first off, when you say it all depends on what you start with. Second, much will depend on your initial breeding program and desired goals. I recommend starting with just one or two traits and getting them set before moving on to others. But you could, say for example, start with one breed and have two different lines from the same birds. One line focuses on one or two traits and the other one or two different traits. Or perhaps you will need to breed separately for males and females of a particular breed/variety. The better quality of birds you start with the less time/effort you will have to put in to get to where you want to be.

For example, let's say you were going to start from scratch to make a Wheaten Ameraucana. Don't know why one would but for the sake of example let's say you do - just because. Initially you're going to wind up with a bunch of trash and you may have to go thru 50 or 100 chicks to get one good one. Which I imagine is what the Old Timers orignally did. Now we have established Wheatens and Blue Wheatens. However, the LF in particular, still need a lot of work. So now the 1:10 really depends on what your desired end results are. For me, as the birds get better and better, my requirements get more and more narrow.

None of my birds are anywhere's close to where I want them to be but my hope is that if I continue long enough, eventually I will get to a place where 8 or 9 birds out of 10 look identical and they're all keepers. Then I will say that I've got my birds set.

No, yes and no on the crossing lines. Right now I'm still trying to get down to an A & B line (each) for Wheatens and Blue Wheatens. Once I get there I will Line Breed inside of each line until a crossbreed is necessary. In other words, once I get to an A line and a B line, I'll breed A to A and B to B until I encounter a need to crossbreed A over to B for hybrid vigor. At the rate I'm going however, it will be several more years I think before I get down to just an A & B line for each variety.

The purpose for my crossing lines at this point is to some extent to get down to just the two lines for each variety. That being said, I am also still trying to figure out what each of the original lines I got contain genetically. For example, I originally started with four males from four different lines from my breeder and four females from three different lines from the same breeder. One of my females was from the same line as one of the males so I did not breed them together. This gave me a total of 15 different breeding lines of my own to start with.

As you might well imagine, I started out with a host of variables to work from. When you look at just the various traits from the SOP to be concerned about you can get a pretty good idea what I'm talking about. Never mind just general type but how about comb shape, eye color, leg color, clean-faced birds, general overall variations in color but then add in egg color! Boy howdy! But eventually thru methodical breeding practices and meticulous records, I was able to identify certain lines from certain birds that I could just get rid of altogether.

Keep in mind that I'm not even close to being any kind of a geneticist nor would I say I'm even an average breeder. Everything I learn I learn from my mistakes. If it works I do it again. If it don't work, I don't do it again. I see no sense in repeating a mistake - even once. I also learn by being a sponge. I try to soak up everything I can from the more experienced breeders.

On that note, I would end by saying that if you don't subscribe to the Poultry Press, I would recommend doing so. Kenny Troiano has been putting excerpts of his book in the PP and I have learned much from those. It was interesting to see that some of what I was already doing is a good way to go but I've also learned more about the pro's and con's of other various practices.

You can always feel free to email me if you have any questions and I'm happy to take phone calls as well.

God Bless,

WOW....you know when you finally learn enough to realize that you know nothing? Yeah I am there......
 

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