Ameraucana thread for posting pictures and discussing our birds

[DMRippy]

If someone can get that sticky made, please provide links to the EE threads there are several, the ABC FAQ page.... I am sure there is something else I am forgetting.

EE Braggers thread and EE sexing tips and tricks maybe even the Olive Egger thread, since they are kinda an EE too. Maybe include some of Jean's comments on what make and EE vs Ameraucanas. It would make the thread move smoother if we could just refer people to the stick for the most common questions.

OOOOOHHHHH some pictures of EE chicks and birds since the colors are pretty common.

 

[NYREDS]

There is no one in the Club to my knowledge that says a splash ameraucana is an ee. There are exceptions to the rule such as splash and the project colors that I have referred to.

Again:

I don't think I referenced the Ameraucana Breeders Club in any way, rather I was referring to some who have posted here who firmly state that all non-recognized varietiesare EEs. That position prohibits the development of any new varieties of Ameraucana as the development of new varieties obviously involves non-recognized varieties. Or does an EE transform into an Ameraucana once a qualifying meet is held?
Someone recently posted "you can't show non sstandard Ameraucanas". Well of course you can. Non-standard varieties in many breeds are shown regularly, there's just a limit to what award they're eligable for. Showing non-standard varieties is the first step toward them becoming standard varieties.

 

[heatherscooby77]

I have been reading through this thread for awhile and find the standard for this breed very confusing. I may be opening up a can of worms with this post, but I would like to hear some other opinions on the matter. This system of classifying Ameraucana offspring as an entirely different breed because they don't meet the standards definition of feather coloring baffles me. I have only encountered this in the chicken world.

If you breed two colorful, spotted Appaloosa horses together and get a solid colored foal with no spots or any other Appaloosa color characteristics the foal is still an Appaloosa and can be registered and shown as such. When the foal is registered with the breed registry it can only acquire limited registration because of its lack of color and/or spots. But the foal would never be considered an entirely different breed based exclusively on the color of it's coat.

So if you breed two Ameraucana's together and produce a chick that hatches with coloring that does not fit into the standard but has slate colored legs and still lays a blue egg, in my opinion, genetically it is still an Ameraucana. They may need to come up with some criteria to split the breed into two categories, like they have with Appaloosa horses. Maybe they should merely classify them as Non-Standard Ameraucanas. I'm sure every once in awhile, even top breeders produce chicks that do not meet the standard and technically would not be considered Ameraucanas. Is it right consider those chicks to be EE's, an entirely different breed?

I have not gotten to read all the posts after this one post. This is what I will say to you to help you not be confused. Easter Eggers are a mix of different breeds. A lot of the characteristics of Ameraucanas are dominate. So if you breed them to other breeds of chickens you get a chicken that resembles an Ameraucana, but isn't an Ameraucana.

People/hatcheries have taken advantage of people who want colorful eggs. They are taking mixes and trying to pass them off as "purebred". I understand your horse breed analogy. Something you must understand is the variety or chickens color is part of the breeds standard. That is just how it is. If you have a color that is non standard you can show it in the any other variety class.

You would also find color is part of the standard for rabbits also.

 

[ChickNmamma]

If someone can get that sticky made, please provide links to the EE threads there are several, the ABC FAQ page.... I am sure there is something else I am forgetting.

EE Braggers thread and EE sexing tips and tricks maybe even the Olive Egger thread, since they are kinda an EE too. Maybe include some of Jean's comments on what make and EE vs Ameraucanas. It would make the thread move smoother if we could just refer people to the stick for the most common questions.

OOOOOHHHHH some pictures of EE chicks and birds since the colors are pretty common.

Another really good resource is an article written by John Blem for Backyard Poultry : Ameraucanas by John W. Blehm from the June/July, 2007 issue of Backyard Poultry

It explains very well why there is this confusion, and where Auracana, Ameraucanas and the feed store/hatcheires Americauna/EEs all came from - and how they became different.

 

[heatherscooby77]

Oh my goodness! This thread is for discussing everything about Ameraucanas. Maybe there needs to be a thread specifically aimed at APA birds and people who want to discuss only them. I'm pretty sure I asked a breed specific question, that is relevant to this thread. On every other breed specific thread I am subscribed to people welcome discussing the SOP and non-APA birds and why they are considered such. I don't even breed Ameraucanas, so you can stop all of the finger pointing and exasperated emoticons! I have never felt so unwelcome for simply bringing up an apparently controversial topic. I have been nothing but civil to other subscribers on this thread. It seems like there is a lot of confusion over this topic. While I am fairly new to chickens I am quite proficient when it come to genetic principles and have taken many college courses on the subject, just pertaining to different production animals. I was thinking about purchasing some of these birds, but now I think I may steer clear of them. The one opinion I voiced was that in other SOP's for other breeds of chickens, when you breed a hen to a cockerel of the same breed the resulting offspring is considered said breed. Quality as it pertains to the SOP of that breed can be debatable based on the physical characteristics it displays. Some will be show quality, some won't. I wanted to know why this doesn't apply to Ameraucanas as well. I never said anything about trying to make a quick buck, or unethical breeders that raise poor quality birds. I wanted to understand the breed better before I dove into something that I might regret later.

Your post about the leghorns. If you breed a brown leghorn and a white leghorn the chicks are still leghorn. Yes they are. If you breed a white
ameraucana to a brown-red ameraucana, you get--------------------------------------------a bird that doesn't fit the standard, and will not breed true 50% of the time. Genetically it is an Ameraucana, but with chickens it's also about the phenotype. Like I said before most of an Ameraucana's attributes are dominant. So knowing about all this stuff, if I went shopping for some chickens and I saw birds that aren't any of the SOP colors, or are in a project phase, I would know the difference. So someone new to chickens wants a Silver Laced Wyandottes. They go to the breeder/hatchery and the chickens are pink. They have the body shape, the correct leg color, etc. But guess what its not a Silver Laced Wyandotte, its an unknown color. Remember Easter Eggers are not a breed, they are a hodgepodge. So if you see a chicken that doesn't look like a SOP birdie, chances are its a mutt! A good breeder is not selling sub-par birds to unsuspecting people. That is the difference between EE and Ameraucana.

I want to say I bust my A*(&*(&^(*&^SS with my chickens. I am not saying this in a snobby way, but its upsetting to have people undermining a true breeders hard work all the time. In fact I am sorry that you got negatively involved in this argument. Other breeds don't have this issue. Our club/members accepts this. I don't understand why everyone else has such a problem with it.

Ameraucanas are really great birds to have, don't let people stop you from buying/breeding them. Would you want someone to lie to you when you went to get your first birds? That is why non-standard, non-project colors are called EE

 

[heatherscooby77]

I understand where the older members of this thread are coming from, but is it wrong for there to be different opinions? I realize that you can't show non standard ameraucanas, and that they don't breed true. But for a person with a back yard flock, like some of the people on this thread, does that really matter to them? Just because this argument has two separate sides, doesn't mean that either sides are right. I think that both sides are right to a certain extent, and then it's just opinions.

This thread is for standard/project bred birds, Ameraucana. It is for nothing more or nothing less.

 

[kian]

I have to admit, in my naivete I thought that since my chicks were white, they must be the real deal. I thought EEs were chimpmunk striped of all colors. I didn't get it. I do now and I wish the person I bought them from did too!

 

[heatherscooby77]

I feel sorry for all the long suffering breeders of Ameraucanas... I am new to chickens in general and have been reading this thread for about a year and can't belive how often you have to deal with this subject. I am personally ready to jump off a tall building after reading this latest installment of Ameraucana vs EE vs whatever argument... however, I applaud all of those who are willing to set the record straight about what Ameraucanas are. I was duped by unscrupulus or uninformed sellers when I started out and after several attempts am finally starting to build a small flock of true Ameraucanas thanks to what I have learned here. So to all those who would like to "change" the SOPs or hold discussions or whatever, I suggest that you read and learn. There are many experts herewilling to help, including the president of the Ameraucana breeders club and you would be well served if you would stop trying to fight the facts and just accept what they are trying to teach you.

 

[Hangtown Farms]

Does anyone have any good photo's of Brown-Red Ameraucana's
I am really liking the few photo's I see on the Ameraucana site and the web.
I am wrking with Crele penedesenca and white empordanesa but would love to add some in with my empordanesa for olive eggers and just have a few to walk around the yard

help! is this the lost variety .
Or if anyone knows where I can get more photo's to look at.
Also I messaged a few on the ameraucana club but does anyone know anyone In Northern California , or Nevada that raises these?
Brown-Red

 

[heatherscooby77]

I don't think I referenced the Ameraucana Breeders Club in any way, rather I was referring to some who have posted here who firmly state that all non-recognized varieties are EEs. That position prohibits the development of any new varieties of Ameraucana as the development of new varieties obviously involves non-recognized varieties. Or does an EE transform into an Ameraucana once a qualifying meet is held?
Someone recently posted "you can't show non standard Ameraucanas". Well of course you can. Non-standard varieties in many breeds are shown regularly, there's just a limit to what award they're eligible for. Showing non-standard varieties is the first step toward them becoming standard varieties.

I don't think we have a problem with people wanting to create new varieties. There are many dedicated people that are breeding project birds, and working on improving existing colors. I think what is hurting the breed is people selling there mixes as an Ameraucana.