Any way to make this work?

[imacowgirl2]

Trying to figure out if there is any way to make this work…

We currently have 14 pullets in our new layer flock…8 weeks old right now. We have them housed in an 8’ x 10’ coop, with an attached 8’ x 26’ run, and they free range most every day (we only leave them in the run if there are aerial predators in the area).

I REALLY want to get about 30 Cornish cross to feed out for about 7-8 weeks this fall (arrive early September, freezer camp mid to late October.

Hubby will absolutely say no to another chicken structure being built. Even if he was ok with me building a chicken tractor, we live in a heavily wooded area, so don’t have enough grass/pasture to support raising them in a tractor environment (with my work schedule I wouldn’t be able to move it multiple times a day like I suspect it would need moved); they’d just make a big mess, I’m sure.

However, I’m wondering if there is a way for them to all share the coop at night (our pullets are already roosting some nights, and when they don’t, they make their cuddle puddle up on the elevated poop board, not on the floor of the coop) and then either free range them with the layers during the day, or free range the layers and have the Cornish use the run during the day. We don’t feed in the coop overnight, so we wouldn’t have an issue with food removal overnight for the Cornish cross birds. If the Cornish were in the run and the layers free ranging, we could also manage separate diets as needed.

Either way I anticipate needing to clean the coop/run more frequently but that shouldn’t be a huge issue. Weather is fairly temperate in our area that time of year, so rainy days would be the only time where the layers would need coop/run access, and we could lock the Cornish in the run by closing the pop door (run has a waterproof/wind proof area in it) and leaving the big coop door (its not in the run) partially to allow the layers access to the coop for shelter from the weather. Though we currently leave the layers in the run in the event of aerial predators, that is mostly due to an over abundance of caution due to their relatively small size right now — there is a wild abundance of natural cover in their free range area, and we could also leave them with coop access if we needed to.

Has anyone ever attempted anything like this? Even if you haven’t done it, any ideas on how I could theoretically manage it? Or do I just need to give up my dream of raising Cornish cross for the freezer?

 

[1muttsfan]

So your coop is big enough for about 20 birds, and it sounds like you want to fit in about twice that many. I understand your point about them spending time outside, but you're still talking about any times of inclement weather, and at least 8 hours a night when these birds will all be shut up together. You would also need to consider having enough roost space, at about 10 inches per bird that would mean somewhere around 36 ft. And remember that meat birds do nothing but eat, drink, and poop, they make a huge mess.

It sounds like too much for the space you have available. Maybe if you run was completely secure you could have birds roosting out. But that's very dangerous if you don't have a completely secure run.

You might be able to make it work if you raise fewer meat birds, maybe a dozen instead of 30. That would also give you a chance to see how it works for you and how well you like raising meat birds. And maybe your husband would help you with a larger space if he enjoyed eating home raised chicken.

 

[imacowgirl2]

You would also need to consider having enough roost space, at about 10 inches per bird that would mean somewhere around 36 ft.

I was under the impression that Cornish cross usually didn't roost due to the young age they are processed at? I was envisioning the layers having the roost space and the Cornish cross using the floor all cuddled together like young chicks do...

Am I mistaken? Do they roost?

 

[1muttsfan]

If you free range them they are more functional and stronger. Even if they don't roost, when you have 40 plus birds milling around on the floor of your coop that is just a lot of birds for that small space. Crowding increases the risk of behaviors like bullying and picking, and meat birds are usually on the slow side and can have a hard time defending themselves. Crowding birds together also increases the risk of infections and parasitic issues. You may also have more trouble than you think splitting them up if you intend to keep them all together at night and separate them during the day.

 

[iwltfum]

Space requirements are not about elbow room. It's about manure loading. If manure loads up to quickly, it will form a cap in the bedding which seals in moisture and becomes impenetrable to the chickens scratching. Cornish crossed manure load much quicker than laying stock and double decking them will do nothing for the manure load other than increase it. The only way to deal with an over stocked coop full of meat birds is to clean it - alot. Like potentially more than once per week, potentially more than 3 times per week. That is alot more work than moving a portable pen. Even a small hutch type pen that they could day range out of would be better than trying to get too many birds into your coop.

Personally, I think you would likely not have any problems raising 24 birds in a 8x10 coop with the run and day ranging - and also assuming the bedding is managed properly. But that number would be close to the max imo.

 

[imacowgirl2]

That is alot more work than moving a portable pen. Even a small hutch type pen that they could day range out of would be better than trying to get too many birds into your coop.

I think I'm envisioning to much work with a portable type pen...maybe I'm making this too complicated . I was envisioning needing to rake manure up from the area after the portable pen was moved daily to avoid having an area that is just totally covered in chicken poop. And that seemed like a lot more work than scooping poop out of the sand inside the chicken coop and run daily (we already scoop inside the coop daily... just takes a few minutes, we would just have to add scooping the run daily to our routine) and tossing it on the compost pile.

Would I not need to rake up manure from area where a portable pen was? Attaching a picture to show the very sparse ground cover I'm working with -- the majority of the area won't have any thicker ground cover than this all summer/fall, which is why I figured I'd be doing a lot of poop raking if they were in a moveable pen in this area. The ground also gets fairly hilly right outside this picture, so there is very little ground where I think I could put a moveable pen, but free ranging birds are able to take advantage of the hillsides as ranging area. Am I overthinking this and I wouldn't need to rake constantly if I did a tractor type thing? Because I think I could convince the hubby to allow a portable tractor, especially if I build it myself

Thank you everyone for the responses so far! They are very helpful!

 

[iwltfum]

I think I'm envisioning to much work with a portable type pen...maybe I'm making this too complicated . I was envisioning needing to rake manure up from the area after the portable pen was moved daily to avoid having an area that is just totally covered in chicken poop. And that seemed like a lot more work than scooping poop out of the sand inside the chicken coop and run daily (we already scoop inside the coop daily... just takes a few minutes, we would just have to add scooping the run daily to our routine) and tossing it on the compost pile.

Would I not need to rake up manure from area where a portable pen was? Attaching a picture to show the very sparse ground cover I'm working with -- the majority of the area won't have any thicker ground cover than this all summer/fall, which is why I figured I'd be doing a lot of poop raking if they were in a moveable pen in this area. The ground also gets fairly hilly right outside this picture, so there is very little ground where I think I could put a moveable pen, but free ranging birds are able to take advantage of the hillsides as ranging area. Am I overthinking this and I wouldn't need to rake constantly if I did a tractor type thing? Because I think I could convince the hubby to allow a portable tractor, especially if I build it myself

Thank you everyone for the responses so far! They are very helpful!

No need to rake unless they are being left in one spot for too long. I generally keep a stocking density of 3sqft/chicken in my pasture pens. They can go 24 hours on one spot- at that density- and within 10 days of moving them off, the grass has all grown back without evidence of chickens being there. Too long on one spot and the nitrogen will "burn" the grass and you will have a bare patch until the next season. Or until you reseed.

Raking isn't going to hurt, but it certainly isn't necessary. Even when over done, a bare patch full of chicken poop is just a fertilizer reservoir waiting for the next heavy rain to spread it.

Hilly areas and areas with bumpy terrain can be difficult with movable pens - just sayin.

Pasture pens are meant to be easy, quick, and low management.

Like I said before though - 24 birds is not ridiculous to put in a 8x10 coop, esp considering 10 of them will only be there for 7 weeks (3-4 weeks at full size. And the fact that there is a large run and the fact that you are day ranging them often.

 

[1muttsfan]

If you read the original post the op is talking about getting 30 meat birds plus the 14 she already has. That is a lot of birds for that space.

I disagree that density in the coop is only about manure load, elbow room can be very important when you start talking about bullying, and about just quality of life in the sense of not being packed in like sardines. Having multiple perches can really help with that situation but again that is just a lot of birds.

 

[iwltfum]

If you read the original post the op is talking about getting 30 meat birds plus the 14 she already has. That is a lot of birds for that space.

I disagree that density in the coop is only about manure load, elbow room can be very important when you start talking about bullying, and about just quality of life in the sense of not being packed in like sardines. Having multiple perches can really help with that situation but again that is just a lot of birds.

All I was saying was manure problems happen before crowding problems. And, to that end, that you can't visually look into your coop and say, "sure it looks like twice as many birds will fit in here because they are only using half of the space"

I must have missed that 30 bird number but I was very clear to say, twice, 24 birds maximum in that space.

 

[1muttsfan]

Honestly cowgirl you have no idea what a big stinking slimy disgusting mess even a dozen meat birds can make. Imagine the floor of your coop packed and crawling with huge poorly feathered birds that are just poop machines, pecking at each other and getting pooped on by the birds above them on the perches.