Araucana Hen Losing Blue in Her Legs

[aart]

Come to think of it, the Silkie laid a tiny, unusual egg. And the plymouth's egg was soft shell. I was suspecting parasites. I thought it might've been fleas, as my cat had health problems, which all vanished when we killed the fleas.

How do you know whether to treat for cocci or parasites? Or do you just do both?

Did you see my posts?
More info would help.
How old are birds?
What and how exactly are you feeding?

Have you checked them over real well for mites and/or lice?
Best done well after dark with a strong flashlight/headlight, easier to 'catch' bird and also to check for the mites that live in structure and only come out at night to feed off roosting birds.
Wipe a white paper towel along the underside of roost to look for red smears(smashed well fed mites).
Part the feathers right down to the skin around vent, head/neck and under wings.
Google images of lice/mites and their eggs before the inspection so you'll know what you're looking for.

 

[junebuggena]

Did you see my posts?
More info would help.
How old are birds?
What and how exactly are you feeding?

Also, how long have they been laying?

Pictures of the birds may help.

 

[aart]

Quote: Yes, thank you.... ..and while we're at it.
How many birds total?
How big is coop and run in feet by feet?

 

[lazy gardener]

Hey everyone,

I noticed my Araucana chicken is losing blue in her eggs. Also, my large Plymouth Rock chicken laid for the first time a white, not a brown egg.

I think our feed must not have what's necessary for color.

Does anyone know what to feed them to get color back?

You have 2 different color factories represented in these 2 breeds. The brown egg laid by the PR is produced when brown pigment (produced by break down and recycling of red blood cells) is laid over a white egg as it passes through her system. Early in her laying cycle, there is plenty of pigment. So, her shells will be nice and dark, and most likely of good quality. As she nears the end of her laying cycle (late summer, into fall) her pigment supply lessens, and the stress of continuous egg production results in a lighter colored egg, and possibly decreased shell quality. After a molt and time to replenish her system, she will resume the dark shells.

In the case of the Araucana (Unless you bought her from a breeder, and she has no tail, she is not an Araucana, but is an Easter Egger) (The egg pigment is produced by break down of bile) This pigment is more likely to go all the way through the egg, and if you peel the white membranes from the inside of the shell, you should see the blue color. Varying degrees of blue (which are apt to be quite light in the case of an EE, I'm not sure how dark the blue in an Araucana or an Ameraucana depend on the specific bird. With an EE, you may see blue, or varying shades of aqua, green, or olive which indicate that she also has some brown pigment (just like a brown egg layer) to add to the shell over the blue.

Hmm.....both of those links cited seem to combine shell color with coating color.
I always thought they were separate functions/processes.....especially with the blue shells.


Can you post full body view pics of your Araucana and Plymouth Rock?

How old are they?

The cited article spoke about several things that could affect the shell color:
Stress, disease, poor diet, treating with a coccidiostat. IMO, any of these factors, including excess heat can result in stress to the system, possibly resulting in reduction of brown or blue pigment production. Coccidiostats (at least the one I am familiar with ) work by preventing Thiamine uptake in the cocci organism. If they do so in the organism, I am wondering if they also do so in the chicken. Last I knew, Thiamine is pretty necessary. The article mentioned providing water at 50* to help with shell color. IMO, that's not WARMING the water, but it is COOLING the water. When I look at my thermometer, and see that it's been around 80* almost every day this summer, I'm guessing my birds would be pleased if their water was 50*! Again, the cooler water would decrease the physical stress on the flock. And, Aart's ? re: age of the birds: If they are nearing the end of a laying cycle, this would result in decreased pigment. Also, if they are laying bigger eggs, there may be less pigment available to cover the larger area of the egg.

Aart's ? about age of birds has direct bearing on what you will be seeing for shell quality/color. And her ? about size of coop/run also has bearing on the discussion: crowded = stressed. Parasites can cause anemia. Anemia = lack of red blood cells = lack of brown pigment. Very easy to check and treat for external parasites. Internal parasites: don't treat unless you actually know you have an issue with them. It's more normal than we realize for any animal to have a small load of internal parasites. And, a small load can actually benefit the immune system.

My suggestion: Don't jump to treating for coccidiosis or worms. You can have a fecal sample processed with your vet for not much money. If that's what you want to do. But, if the birds are all acting well, one might wonder how necessary it is to do so. Your call here, no right or wrong in it. Do your best to give them a good diet. (I am a proponent of fermented feed) Do your homework on this one. There are folks who are passionate about the benefits of FF. (I'm in that tribe) and there are also folks who are equally as passionate about not using it. Do you eat yogurt? If you buy the nutritional benefit of yogurt over milk, then the idea of FF should bear = consideration.

 

[bluehazard]

Come to think of it, the Silkie laid a tiny, unusual egg. And the plymouth's egg was soft shell. I was suspecting parasites. I thought it might've been fleas, as my cat had health problems, which all vanished when we killed the fleas.

How do you know whether to treat for cocci or parasites? Or do you just do both?

Sorry for the late response. I'm going to look into this more and post pictures tomorrow.

Cheers.

 

[junebuggena]

Please answer the questions so that we can advise on the best course of action.

 

[bluehazard]

Sorry for not answering the questions. Thanks for everyone's help. I just have a project to do right now.

How old are birds?

I don't know how old the silkie is or the new plymouth as I got them as adults. I estimate the New Plymouth is 3-5 years old. The silkie is 2 years old. The Araucana is most likely 3 years old.

What and how exactly are you feeding?

We just buy scratch and lay mash. We also feed them corn and lettuce too.

How long have they been laying?

The new plymouth has been laying for at least 2 or 3 years.

The silkie for one year.

Coop Size?

They're free range all day. They get caged in the evening.

I checked the new plymouth for lice the other day, only because she had them when we first got her. She had no lice.

From my own personal experience with animals (and I have a lot), I'm suspecting they have internal parasites, perhaps even yeast. In general, parasites are responsible for complex problems, such as lack of melanin production, even in humans.

Did I miss any questions?

 

[TwoCrows]

How old are these birds? Have they been laying long? Young birds can have troubles putting on a hard shell and their dye maker may not be functioning just yet. They too can lay these tiny "fairy" eggs. In which case time will take care of itself. If these are older birds, you may be dealing with parasites. Young birds are highly susceptible to Cocci as they haven't had had enough time yet to develop proper immunity. Older birds are highly susceptible as well as their immune systems can be weakening.

A boat load of worms is generally found in older rather than younger birds, depending on how they are kept, how healthy they are and such. Birds do develop some immunity to worms as well, however any bird that is overwhelmed with worms or cocci's can succumb to either of these.

Thin shells can be laid by any age bird which can stem from not enough calcium, not being able to absorb enough calcium or other health issues as worms, coccidiosis, internal laying, reproductive cancer or any oviduct infection.

You can take a poop sample into any vet for an exam just to see if you are dealing with worms and what species.

Cocci is fairly easy to spot, but not guarantee you can accurately guess for sure. But Corid is not harmful and only a Thiamine blocker. The Cocci need Thiamine to stay alive and reproduce and the lack of it kills them. There is no egg withdrawal with Corid. Generally the signs of Cocci, (but not always) are blood in the urates or poop, white diarrhea, mucus in the poop, birds that are very ill will go off their food and water, stand with feathers fluffed out. When they get to this stage, the can die quick.

As for worms, it's a lot harder to spot other than SOMETIMES they can have diarrhea but not always, they may eat like wolves but still lose weight, their combs will pale, and they can stop laying all together.

 

[TwoCrows]

We crossed in cyber space.

 

[bluehazard]

You have 2 different color factories represented in these 2 breeds. The brown egg laid by the PR is produced when brown pigment (produced by break down and recycling of red blood cells) is laid over a white egg as it passes through her system. Early in her laying cycle, there is plenty of pigment. So, her shells will be nice and dark, and most likely of good quality. As she nears the end of her laying cycle (late summer, into fall) her pigment supply lessens, and the stress of continuous egg production results in a lighter colored egg, and possibly decreased shell quality. After a molt and time to replenish her system, she will resume the dark shells.

In the case of the Araucana (Unless you bought her from a breeder, and she has no tail, she is not an Araucana, but is an Easter Egger) (The egg pigment is produced by break down of bile) This pigment is more likely to go all the way through the egg, and if you peel the white membranes from the inside of the shell, you should see the blue color. Varying degrees of blue (which are apt to be quite light in the case of an EE, I'm not sure how dark the blue in an Araucana or an Ameraucana depend on the specific bird. With an EE, you may see blue, or varying shades of aqua, green, or olive which indicate that she also has some brown pigment (just like a brown egg layer) to add to the shell over the blue.

The cited article spoke about several things that could affect the shell color:
Stress, disease, poor diet, treating with a coccidiostat. IMO, any of these factors, including excess heat can result in stress to the system, possibly resulting in reduction of brown or blue pigment production. Coccidiostats (at least the one I am familiar with ) work by preventing Thiamine uptake in the cocci organism. If they do so in the organism, I am wondering if they also do so in the chicken. Last I knew, Thiamine is pretty necessary. The article mentioned providing water at 50* to help with shell color. IMO, that's not WARMING the water, but it is COOLING the water. When I look at my thermometer, and see that it's been around 80* almost every day this summer, I'm guessing my birds would be pleased if their water was 50*! Again, the cooler water would decrease the physical stress on the flock. And, Aart's ? re: age of the birds: If they are nearing the end of a laying cycle, this would result in decreased pigment. Also, if they are laying bigger eggs, there may be less pigment available to cover the larger area of the egg.

Aart's ? about age of birds has direct bearing on what you will be seeing for shell quality/color. And her ? about size of coop/run also has bearing on the discussion: crowded = stressed. Parasites can cause anemia. Anemia = lack of red blood cells = lack of brown pigment. Very easy to check and treat for external parasites. Internal parasites: don't treat unless you actually know you have an issue with them. It's more normal than we realize for any animal to have a small load of internal parasites. And, a small load can actually benefit the immune system.

My suggestion: Don't jump to treating for coccidiosis or worms. You can have a fecal sample processed with your vet for not much money. If that's what you want to do. But, if the birds are all acting well, one might wonder how necessary it is to do so. Your call here, no right or wrong in it. Do your best to give them a good diet. (I am a proponent of fermented feed) Do your homework on this one. There are folks who are passionate about the benefits of FF. (I'm in that tribe) and there are also folks who are equally as passionate about not using it. Do you eat yogurt? If you buy the nutritional benefit of yogurt over milk, then the idea of FF should bear = consideration.

Wow, thanks for all this. I especially liked the analysis on egg color. It's nearing summer, and the New Plymouth is older, so I can see why her egg turned white.

How do you know the difference between an Easter Egger or a Aracauna? As posted earlier, I did check the New Plymouth for parasites. I'll check the Aracauna today too.

I tried feeding my birds the fermented sauerkraut, but they didn't take.

Do you have more articles or links on fermented feed? Now that they're older, I probably agree they need fermented feed.

Also, do you think the lack of blue in the legs is also a bile problem?

I'm going to check with the vet on Monday to do a stool sample. Maybe, I'll just buy my own microscope to do it myself.