Arizona Chickens

[a little chiken]

I, too, lost a chicken this week. Piper my first chick, the silver laced wyandotte, the only chicken that I named, died on Sunday. She stopped laying the end of May and wasn't quite right since. I guess she was just being weak and the heat eventually got here. May she RIP.

condolences from us. That is so hard and double when she was your first.

 

[a little chiken]

Just think about the logic of this for a minute. A coyote SEES me, right there in front of him and still thinks it's worth a shot at trying to take a chicken a dozen feet away from me. Another walks right between my wife and I on it's way to grab a bird in the back yard. If a person's presence doesn't deter them, why would the odor of urine have any impact? I'm curious about your reasoning.

I am not sure Gallo. an old Indian medicine man told my father to do that. we lived on the end of a road and had desert on three sides of us. We had free range chickens ducks geese and turkeys. every once in awhile we lost one. one year it got real bad and so after trying the urination method my father did the dead coyote thing and it worked for us. It also works for rattle snakes. Kill one and spread its blood, they do not cross it. that smell stays strong and coyotes have a much higher sense of smell so maybe thats why.

 

[a little chiken]

Awwwww, SO CUTE!

I have dreams of getting more farm animals some day. My husband and I are originally from WI, and my mom lived on a dairy farm when she was a child. I would love to be able to give my family fresh cows milk, but there is no where really local for us. I've thought about goats, but my husband doesn't like goats milk products and the kids and I have never tasted fresh goats milk so I would hate to get into it and find out none of us like it! I did discover there is a dairy farm opening soon in Casa Grande though that will be distributing their products. I'm praying their products come to Tucson as we go there about once a month.

I will be getting my mini heifer next week. I plan to have both fresh goats and fresh cows milk so I will let you know and you can come taste it. most people do not realize that all goats and all cows of different breeds have different flavored milk. It has to do with fat and butterfat content also the cream each breed makes. I love Nubian goat milk because they have very high cream and butterfat so it is sweet.
It also matter's what they eat. If they eat things that taste bad it flavors the milk. This is why most people feed a sweet feed of some sort because the flavor it gives the milk and the protein it gives the doe that is producing the milk.
I cannot legally sell milk unless it is sold for "animal consumption" only per AZ state laws.

 

[carnivore]

Wow, it looks like I'm not the only one with losses this week. 

I'm getting over it, and planning with my husband as to what we are going to do. I really would like to get an electric fence put up eventually but we need to save for that. In the meantime, when he gets back from El Paso I think we will be putting up some plywood or something similar around the bottom perimeter of the coop where there is exposed wire. 

Depending on the size of your run, it's probably a lot cheaper than you think. my run is about 600 sq ft, and I installed electric fence for less than $100. The cheapest controller at Tractor Supply was $49 and will run 2 miles of wire (single strand). I bought about twice as much wire as I actually used, but had to go back for more insulators. Best C-note I ever spent. When I originally built the run, I roofed it over, so I have no problems with avian predators. I put the wire at 6 inches, 12 inches, 4 feet, and 6 feet above ground level for diggers or jumpers. Not a single problem since.

P.S.--whoever it is, they will only touch the wire once, then go look somewhere else for an easier meal. The controller puts out a high voltage low amp current. It also "pulses" the current many times per second, so you don't freeze to the wire. Because of the pulse, it is non-lethal, but nobody comes back for a second try.

 

[K9Dave]

Just think about the logic of this for a minute.  A coyote SEES me, right there in front of him and still thinks it's worth a shot at trying to take a chicken a dozen feet away from me.  Another walks right between my wife and I on it's way to grab a bird in the back yard.  If a person's presence doesn't deter them, why would the odor of urine have any impact?  I'm curious about your reasoning.

The area hasn't been claimed by a dominant species with markings. Your presence even with a successful kill to me further shows they believe themselves to be more dominant. To me they're clearly unafraid because they've not been shown a reason to think otherwise. Make them believe that there are easier meals elsewhere. Mark your territory heavy, as would the dominant male of most species, with urine and carcass if possible. If you kill one of their family members even better, and hang it for all to see and smell.

Edited: I just woke up and I'm afraid a part of this didn't make sense. Lol

This just isn't my theory, it's been around the south and southwest for a long time. I saw it everywhere in Texas.

 

[Gallo del Cielo]

Quote:
While I have great reverence and respect for old Indian medicine men, as a biologist, I work with data. This doesn't necessarily mean that he's wrong, or that Dave is wrong--they're just not correct in all contexts. Part of the problem here is understanding the context of urban vs. rural. The fact is, there are profound differences in the behavior of urban coyotes compared to rural coyotes. In order for deterrents to work, the coyotes must, on average, fear humans. Most people in town either do not recognize the errant coyote out walking in public, or they do not interact with it in any way. Generally, people don't harass wildlife and in most contexts that's a good thing. In more rural settings, coyotes are much more likely to be shot on sight. This is coming from someone who has done so many times while growing up on our rural farm. In the rural setting, cues associated with humans--things that predict high risk of human encounter---will be more salient and more easily associated with eminent trouble and therefore more informative to the trespassing coyote. In the urban setting, coyotes do not fear humans as much as their rural cousins and cues that predict human presence are largely not meaningful.

 

[primaknits]

Depending on the size of your run, it's probably a lot cheaper than you think. my run is about 600 sq ft, and I installed electric fence for less than $100. The cheapest controller at Tractor Supply was $49 and will run 2 miles of wire (single strand). I bought about twice as much wire as I actually used, but had to go back for more insulators. Best C-note I ever spent. When I originally built the run, I roofed it over, so I have no problems with avian predators. I put the wire at 6 inches, 12 inches, 4 feet, and 6 feet above ground level for diggers or jumpers. Not a single problem since.

P.S.--whoever it is, they will only touch the wire once, then go look somewhere else for an easier meal. The controller puts out a high voltage low amp current. It also "pulses" the current many times per second, so you don't freeze to the wire. Because of the pulse, it is non-lethal, but nobody comes back for a second try.

I didn't know there was a tractor supply store around here, I'll have to check it out. I was looking at ones online and it looked like it was going to run us $200-300. My husband is pretty handy, so it sounds like he would be able to set up something similar to what you did. Thanks for the advice. Our coop is smaller, so letting our chickens be able to free range a bit would really be helpful.

 

[primaknits]

I will be getting my mini heifer next week. I plan to have both fresh goats and fresh cows milk so I will let you know and you can come taste it. most people do not realize that all goats and all cows of different breeds have different flavored milk. It has to do with fat and butterfat content also the cream each breed makes. I love Nubian goat milk because they have very high cream and butterfat so it is sweet.
It also matter's what they eat. If they eat things that taste bad it flavors the milk. This is why most people feed a sweet feed of some sort because the flavor it gives the milk and the protein it gives the doe that is producing the milk.
I cannot legally sell milk unless it is sold for "animal consumption" only per AZ state laws.

Have things changed with the laws at all recently? This is the farm that I am talking about.
http://fonddulacfarms.com/

Unless they are going to put for animal consumption only on all of their products that get distributed?

My friend had Nubian goats for a while before she moved into a gated community, but we never got the chance to try her milk. I'm guessing we would probably like something with a higher fat/butterfat content as we still drink whole milk here. My mom tells me stories about how they used to sneak the cream off the top of the milk jugs when she and her siblings were younger.....but now she can't drink anything but skim milk. Yuck.

 

[Gallo del Cielo]

Quote:
I get the theory and as I noted above, it may work in some rural contexts. My concern is that someone in the city here is going to read that and think it's going to provide some protection against coyotes. It won't and it hasn't. I was willing to test it and found it has had no impact on the frequency of visitation to my yard. Maybe going out there several times a day, nearly every day, for the past year isn't enough?

I'm not sure what your neighborhood is like, but hanging a coyote carcass out for all to see and smell would not work in my neighborhood.

Seriously, the best coyote deterrent that I've found in the city is a well constructed chicken enclosure.

 

[carnivore]

While I have great reverence and respect for old Indian medicine men, as a biologist, I work with data.  This doesn't necessarily mean that he's wrong, or that Dave is wrong--they're just not correct in all contexts.  Part of the problem here is understanding the context of urban vs. rural.  The fact is, there are profound differences in the behavior of urban coyotes compared to rural coyotes.  In order for deterrents to work, the coyotes must, on average, fear humans.  Most people in town either do not recognize the errant coyote out walking in public, or they do not interact with it in any way.  Generally, people don't harass wildlife and in most contexts that's a good thing.   In more rural settings, coyotes are much more likely to be shot on sight.  This is coming from someone who has done so many times while growing up on our rural farm.  In the rural setting, cues associated with humans--things that predict high risk of human encounter---will be more salient and more easily associated with eminent trouble and therefore more informative to the trespassing coyote.  In the urban setting, coyotes do not fear humans as much as their rural cousins and cues that predict human presence are largely not meaningful.  

When I was living at Diamond Bell Ranch, south of Three Points, I was plagued with coyotes (and mountain lions). The coyotes would walk down the middle of the street in broad daylight when they weren't snacking on pet cats and dogs. I was highly ticked off when I found that the BATF agent that lived across the street was actually putting out food for them!
That area is a bit more rural than downtown Tucson, and I kept a .22 next to my door for the more brazen coyotes. If you have a bolt action .22 (not a semi-auto), you can get Aguila ammo, that has a light bullet, and no gunpowder. the bullet is propelled by the primer only, and believe it or not, it is quieter than a pellet gun. Won't kill a coyote, but it will send him to the next county!
The problem here is easy access to food. Why hunt in that dusty dry desert, when you can knock over a trash can? Fresh chicken, all penned up so they can't get away? MMMM-HMMM!
My point is, make it as difficult as possible for anybody to snack on your birds, and they will pass you by. That guy down the street lets them free range in the yard! Let's go!