As a parent would this make you mad or would you under stand it????? I am the bus driver

[FarmerJamie]

Kim, kudos for you taking a stand. IMHO, the group punishment was appropriate. I feels it instills a sense of community and group responsibility. My kids have been punished as part of a group discipline effort, even though they had not done anything wrong. When they complained, I asked if they had done anything to try to curb the behavior. When they replied they just sat there and didn't say anything, even thought they knew the actions were wrong, I told them to consider the punishment as the price for their silent acceptance of the behavior. I feel that's a good societal lessons to teach our kids that were are all responsible.

Having relatives who have been bus drivers, I wish you well and hope the admin backs you.

YMMV

wow, I need that spell-check, too. LOL

 

[kimisfishing]

After having talked to all of them and doing the punish the offenders only thing most of the year, I was trying to instill in the offenders that sometimes your actions effect more than just you. This is not something I do on a daily basis. This is for serious issues. Their behavior did effect the other kids because it made the ride less safe. So what you are saying is actions do not effect others.
Lets say they were being loud and one student in the back had a seisure, the driver could not hear what was going on and did not know their names so the student in the back died. Now the driver is fired, the student is dead, the parents are heart broken and all because someone elses kid was loud on the bus. Maybe you can see my point now. On a bus we have SECONDS to see, hear, think and react.
2 months ago theses same kids would not have done any of this, we have some new kids and they have disrupted the whole situation. If it were my choice, we would not add students in the middle of the year and my nice quiet well behaved children would not have had this at all. Maybe the offenders will feel bad about EVERYONE having to be silent and write a letter so they do not do this again.
Thank you for your input, because I can see how some parents think. My children used to get in trouble on the bus for * protecting* other kids. My son and daughter did not allow others to insult or make fun of the *different* kids. My children took their punishment because they stood up for what was right.
Is there not something about being an accomlise? If you and are in a store and you rob it I am just as guilty for not stopping you. So if a student dies because the driver did not help them, the kids could be just as guilty and the driver????? Or I as the driver take all the blame when the parents of the offenders just sit back and say " my kids did not do anything".
I understand both sides of this and I can only do waht I feel is best for (my bus kids) and me.

I don't understand why you have a problem punishing only the children who were misbehaving? You don't need to call them up in front of their peers, let alone be demeaning to them. Contact only the parents of the children that you know were misbehaving and talk with them. The other riders would never even know unless the punished tell them.
Writing the apologies is good if you don't know who was causing the problem. Punishing the innocent, like others have said, isn't fair to those who do behave. As a parent, yes, I would have a problem with that.

 

[kimisfishing]

Thank you, I do what I think is best for all the kids. A few minutes of silence or 1 sentance will not kill anyone. But Misbehaving on the bus could kill many.

Kim, kudos for you taking a stand. IMHO, the group punishment was appropriate. I feels it instills a sense of community and group responsibility. My kids have been punished as part of a group discipline effort, even though they had not done anything wrong. When they complained, I asked if they had done anything to try to curb the behavior. When they replied they just sat there and didn't say anything, even thought they knew the actions were wrong, I told them to consider the punishment as the price for their silent acceptance of the behavior. I feel that's a good societal lessons to teach our kids that were are all responsible.

Having relatives who have bus drivers, I wish you well and hope the admin backs you.

YMMV

 

[WingingIt]

After having talked to all of them and doing the punish the offenders only thing most of the year, I was trying to instill in the offenders that sometimes your actions effect more than just you. This is not something I do on a daily basis. This is for serious issues. Their behavior did effect the other kids because it made the ride less safe. So what you are saying is actions do not effect others.
Lets say they were being loud and one student in the back had a seisure, the driver could not hear what was going on and did not know their names so the student in the back died. Now the driver is fired, the student is dead, the parents are heart broken and all because someone elses kid was loud on the bus. Maybe you can see my point now. On a bus we have SECONDS to see, hear, think and react.
2 months ago theses same kids would not have done any of this, we have some new kids and they have disrupted the whole situation. If it were my choice, we would not add students in the middle of the year and my nice quiet well behaved children would not have had this at all. Maybe the offenders will feel bad about EVERYONE having to be silent and write a letter so they do not do this again.
Thank you for your input, because I can see how some parents think. My children used to get in trouble on the bus for * protecting* other kids. My son and daughter did not allow others to insult or make fun of the *different* kids. My children took their punishment because they stood up for what was right.
Is there not something about being an accomlise? If you and are in a store and you rob it I am just as guilty for not stopping you. So if a student dies because the driver did not help them, the kids could be just as guilty and the driver????? Or I as the driver take all the blame when the parents of the offenders just sit back and say " my kids did not do anything".
I understand both sides of this and I can only do waht I feel is best for (my bus kids) and me.

I want to start by saying, once again, that I can tell you are a very caring bus driver and those kids are very lucky to have you. I LOVE that you make it a point to play the what you're going to be when you grow up game, what a great idea!

I'm not posting this to argue or prove you wrong, but I want to point out something from the side of the kids that were behaving. If the quiet children had decided to try to handle the misbehaving children FOR the sub. bus driver, how would that have gone? They'd have been talking/yelling at the others to be quiet and sit down, which would make it worse, even more loud and could possibly result in someone getting hit or something. I don't see how that would help. I can see it making it even more hard for the sub. to be able to hear and pay attention. It's far different than an adult choosing to step into a situation, IMO.

I don't think it's fair to say the other kids should help handle the rowdy/misbehaving kids. The bottom line is that it was the sub's job. If they can't handle it, figure out to pull over until they calm down, call the bus barn to let them know they are going to be delayed, find out who the problem is, etc., then maybe they shouldn't be a sub. driver. To try and pin the blame on you isn't right and I don't want you feeling guilty when you weren't there and had no control or any idea what the driver did.

It's obvious that you can handle it and you do it well. I realize you have the advantage of knowing names, but I know on every bus there are children who would be happy to assist the driver in identifying other kids' names. I know 100% they could put you on a new bus and you'd do just fine and figure out how to handle a similar issue. Is the sub. pretty inexperienced, by chance?

It sounds to me like you've identified the problem children as a few of the newer riders. That's good. If they don't respond to what you've been trying then perhaps it's time to contact their parents and/or their principals and make the issue known. As you said, safety is a HUGE thing and if they are jeopardizing that, then it has to be handled or they have to be removed to keep the others safe.

Hope you don't mind, but I think I may steal your what you'll be when you grow up game to play with my Scouts.

Best of luck to you and I hope the rest of the year goes great!

 

[kimisfishing]

I am glad to share my game with anyone who deals with kids. I understand all the points you are making, and wish it worked that well. I am glad I am not a teacher, 1 hour at a time is enough for me LOL. This was a one time thing and I just wanted to be sure I was not sounding mean or hateful. Silent time is an accepted practice on the bus for short periods of time. I also never use the word PUNISHMENT or BAD. When I have to do something like move a student or anything I always tell them they are NOT IN TROUBLE, I am removing them from the situation to keep them out of trouble, so being silent is just another way of keeping them safe, and out of trouble. The way I see it is, They need to show respect for all adults, and in a situation like this I can assure you that not ONE of them did exactly what they should have like they would have if I had been there. There is only a DEGREE of offence. And some of the kids are sneaky enough to not get caught.
I know kids will be kids. That is what I love about it cause I never know from one day to the other who will do what and how.
If you called my kids today and asked if I was right or wrong the majority of them would tell you I did what was needed and that I am there for them. I even have a sign in my bus that I made that says " MS. Kimberlee"s Kids are the best"

There is no RIGHT or WRONG here. Just different ways of correcting behavior. Personally I would rather just sing and play with them, but my boss frowns on letting them do anything they want LOL.

 

[dewey]

LOL.

Ours would throw you off the bus if you misbehaved. Didn't matter where on the route we were, either. He'd tell them to get off and start walking and then he'd give their phone number to the next kid that got let off and tell that kid to call and let them know where to pick up their brat. He also let the really little kids sit up front right next to him on that flat spot between him and the driver's window. Mr. W. Still remember him!

LOL The coveted flat spot for some kids, and for others, the bane of their existence where their bus contraband was held captive within sight, yet out reach. I don't recall ever having drivers that tried to bribe us to be good. In fact, some of the drivers would make big productions of eating confiscated candy while smiling & eyeballing the offending kid in that big mirror, lol.

 

[WingingIt]

I am glad to share my game with anyone who deals with kids. I understand all the points you are making, and wish it worked that well. I am glad I am not a teacher, 1 hour at a time is enough for me LOL. This was a one time thing and I just wanted to be sure I was not sounding mean or hateful. Silent time is an accepted practice on the bus for short periods of time. I also never use the word PUNISHMENT or BAD. When I have to do something like move a student or anything I always tell them they are NOT IN TROUBLE, I am removing them from the situation to keep them out of trouble, so being silent is just another way of keeping them safe, and out of trouble. The way I see it is, They need to show respect for all adults, and in a situation like this I can assure you that not ONE of them did exactly what they should have like they would have if I had been there. There is only a DEGREE of offence. And some of the kids are sneaky enough to not get caught.
I know kids will be kids. That is what I love about it cause I never know from one day to the other who will do what and how.
If you called my kids today and asked if I was right or wrong the majority of them would tell you I did what was needed and that I am there for them. I even have a sign in my bus that I made that says " MS. Kimberlee"s Kids are the best"

There is no RIGHT or WRONG here. Just different ways of correcting behavior. Personally I would rather just sing and play with them, but my boss frowns on letting them do anything they want LOL.

I haven't thought you sounded mean or hateful with anything you've said. I really did mean it when I said the kids are lucky to have you.

 

[kimisfishing]

I could never do that to my kids. I do know that some drivers are like that, but I look at like this: If this child never gets a smile or praise at home then atleast he or she will remember that the bus driver cared. I might be too soft hearted, but I let my kids know that with out them I have no food for my family, and that they make my day better. I also like the offenders just a bit more that the others because I worry that it might stem from no attention at home. Maybe I should be more hard but it is not in my nature. But it is good to get other ideas. and I am sure it never killed a kid for the driver to do stuff like that.
HEY WE AE ON THE CHICKEN SITE< now for chicken talk LOL

LOL The coveted flat spot for some kids, and for others, the bane of their existence where their bus contraband was held captive within sight, yet out reach. I don't recall ever having drivers that tried to bribe us to be good. In fact, some of the drivers would make big productions of eating confiscated candy while smiling & eyeballing the offending kid in that big mirror, lol.

 

[kimisfishing]

I haven't thought you sounded mean or hateful with anything you've said. I really did mean it when I said the kids are lucky to have you.

Thank you, I really appreiciate the input, it gives me more ways to look at things.

 

[WingingIt]

FTR, Dewey and I were talking about things from long ago that happened on the bus when we were kids. At least, I was and I think Dewey was, too. NONE of that would happen now-a-days. Just funny bus memories from long ago.