Best Processing/Killing Method----PLEASE HELP!

[trifecta]

I agree with your concern too. I worked for a small animal veterinarian and helped put animals under for surgery. My hope is to get the birds unconscious place them in the cone and bleed them before they come to. They are using this method with hogs with great results. I will try the gassing but if it doesn't work well I will skip this step and just bleed the bird in a cone.

You may want to look into some of the commercial boxes made for euthanizing baby piglets. The problem that I have seen with them is that they are fairly difficult to maintain, at least on the farm, as they have to be constantly filled with gas and leak while taking animals in and out. I guess the constant thing is not really an issue if you're only using it on the day of slaughter.

I am going to try debraining this batch. I also thought about making an electrical stunning pool but am very concerned about (my) safety, so have put that on the back burner for now. I personally feel that decapitation is much less humane due to the large amount of research showing that decapitated animals have functional EEG waves for a significant length of time, with a huge pain response when the spinal cord is severed- in fact in the near future, this will likely no longer be a humane method of euthanasia for lab animals and I think its something that needs to be re-considered for home processing as well.

Let me know if your stunning box works out because I would be VERY interested in this.

 

[punk-a-doodle]

Aye, decapitation is actually strongly advised against in my pure research/animal testing department due to the information available. It can be used as a primary or secondary method for pinky/neonatal rodents, and may be used on small mammals with approval if decapitation must be used for rapid brain removal and tissue collection. That said, I am personally fine with the use of decapition for home disposal of pet and meat animals. It is a fairly fool-proof way to fairly quickly dispatch an animal. It just isn't my personal first (or second) choice.

I am considering buying a live meat bird to start figuring out what process to use for my future meat birds now. I can't raise my own right now, but it would be nice to try the nitrogen gas method I have in mind so I can go from there. I'm very comfortable with various gases, and gassing is the method we use at work. I have used gassing methods on pet rats with great success. The vet option still tends to be a painful injection to the heart, and my rats definitely suffered with that method. :/ I haven't seen or experienced issues at work with gas, but have seen and heard plenty of horror stories outside of work from gas being used incorrectly, or the incorrect type of gas being used. Know your gas. *insert fart jokes here*

 

[bobbi-j]

You may want to look into some of the commercial boxes made for euthanizing baby piglets. The problem that I have seen with them is that they are fairly difficult to maintain, at least on the farm, as they have to be constantly filled with gas and leak while taking animals in and out. I guess the constant thing is not really an issue if you're only using it on the day of slaughter.

I am going to try debraining this batch. I also thought about making an electrical stunning pool but am very concerned about (my) safety, so have put that on the back burner for now. I personally feel that decapitation is much less humane due to the large amount of research showing that decapitated animals have functional EEG waves for a significant length of time, with a huge pain response when the spinal cord is severed- in fact in the near future, this will likely no longer be a humane method of euthanasia for lab animals and I think its something that needs to be re-considered for home processing as well.

Let me know if your stunning box works out because I would be VERY interested in this.

How long is a "significant amount of time"? Just curious. I wonder how much pain response there would be when they're shocked? Or when the throat is slit to let them bleed out? Or when a knife is inserted through the roof of their miouth into their brains? I guess what I'm trying to say is, I wonder if there is any "painless" way to kill them? Even gassing them, they're stuck in a box, finding themselves struggling to breathe.

 

[LilyD]

How long is a "significant amount of time"? Just curious. I wonder how much pain response there would be when they're shocked? Or when the throat is slit to let them bleed out? Or when a knife is inserted through the roof of their miouth into their brains? I guess what I'm trying to say is, I wonder if there is any "painless" way to kill them? Even gassing them, they're stuck in a box, finding themselves struggling to breathe.

Bobbi-j I think the way that people process is subjective to their own personal beliefs. Personally I understand that they are finding that the brain is firing after death but I also understand that the brain is full of nerves. Like the rest of the body that has nerve firing at the time of death the brain is bound to have the same type of reaction. This can produce stiffening and movement in the head (and yes even the brain) just as much as it can in other areas of the body. That doesn't mean the animal is coherent and thinking just that the nerves are firing before they shut down.

Pithing does interest me just because it seems like it might be helpful in keeping the meat tender but my first method will always be slitting the throat. I have been in a position to lose a lot of blood due to a severe cut and can tell you that you feel nothing. It's like being in a haze and going in and out of consciousness. Not really scary just disconnected.

I would have reservations about using any type of gas on an animal because depriving the body of oxygen is not pleasant. Suffocation would be my last choice as a way to process an animal.

Like I said though these are my personal opinions and no one has to follow them but me. Everyone is entitled to believe what they believe.

 

[punk-a-doodle]

LilyD, inert gases such as nitrogen caus anoxia. It is not the same as suffocation.

 

[LilyD]

LilyD, inert gases such as nitrogen caus anoxia. It is not the same as suffocation.

Had to actually go and check it out because I wasn't sure what anoxa meant (been a while since I was in school) lol. But honestly it doesn't sound much different from what happens from extreme blood loss. You have the potential for light headedness and unconsciousness from blood loss and from anoxia. It does however say that anoxia can occur from drowning and suffocation as well so I am not convinced that the animal will just go to sleep and will not feel frightened by the inability to take in oxygen.

I guess honestly you can make an argument for or against any of the killing methods used. They all have pros and cons it depends on what you are comfortable with.

 

[TexasLady]

We really all have to deal with it the way we think works best for us. It matters little as long as people aren't slamming their heads against a wall or choking them to death slowly.

I do not like the breaking of the neck because I imagine this has to be painful.

I have seen hundreds of chickens killed and killed enough myself, and from my perspective, the debraining is the best. But we all have to do what we feel is right.

I enjoyed the video, Survival Skills with Russ, that you posted. The only think I didn't like was the fact that the other to-be-butchered chickens were there and able to see what was happening. I recently saw a video of a cattle slaughtering plant in another country. They had five cows lined up for slaughter. B the time that the last cow was up for slaughter, she was shaking so badly that she could hardly stay on her feet. IMHO it is cruel to allow the next one to see what happened to the one that went just before. That video traumatized me to the point I will walk half way across the farm to avoid that happening to another being.

 

[bobbi-j]

Bobbi-j I think the way that people process is subjective to their own personal beliefs. Personally I understand that they are finding that the brain is firing after death but I also understand that the brain is full of nerves. Like the rest of the body that has nerve firing at the time of death the brain is bound to have the same type of reaction. This can produce stiffening and movement in the head (and yes even the brain) just as much as it can in other areas of the body. That doesn't mean the animal is coherent and thinking just that the nerves are firing before they shut down.

Everyone is entitled to believe what they believe.

Had to actually go and check it out because I wasn't sure what anoxa meant (been a while since I was in school) lol. But honestly it doesn't sound much different from what happens from extreme blood loss. You have the potential for light headedness and unconsciousness from blood loss and from anoxia. It does however say that anoxia can occur from drowning and suffocation as well so I am not convinced that the animal will just go to sleep and will not feel frightened by the inability to take in oxygen.

I guess honestly you can make an argument for or against any of the killing methods used. They all have pros and cons it depends on what you are comfortable with.

LilyD, thank you for saying more clearly and eloquently what I was trying to say. Sometimes words just don't come out right, and since you can't read tone of voice, I can see where my words may seem argumentative. I don't believe there is any 100% painless way to kill a chicken. No matter what method is used, the chicken may feel something for a few seconds or minutes, depending on how you do it.

 

[TexasLady]

LilyD: I too lost a lot of blood. After the birth of my first child, they gave me four pints of blood and were considering giving me more. I could think. It didn't feel good. I hated the feeling. It was not painful, but it was very confusing. I hated it. But since it is not painful, I suppose it is the easier. However, I'm not sure having your throat cut isn't painful. There are a lot of nerves around your head, and having your throat cut would surely be painful.

I don't know that any way to die is painfree except maybe when you die in your sleep.

 

[booker81]

I think the biggest thing is what YOU feel comfortable with. Most of us here raising meat chickens (any chicken that we plan to slaughter from a broiler to a old hen), are doing so to make sure the bird has a lifetime of comfort and a few minutes of discomfort.

It's important to take our own selves into consideration. Personally, I can't use an axe or loppers to cut the head off. I can't even successfully cut a small limb off a tree with an axe or loppers without jacking up the process. Even last week, I was clearing brush with a hand saw. I managed to gouge my LEG - with a hand saw. How, I don't know. I just don't have that coordination (I won't even touch a chainsaw). I carry that to processing. The biggest implement I use is my handy scalpel - and I manage to cut myself with that too. The use of gas etc is intriguing, but I don't trust my ability to estimate the right amount and time. So, I stick with a quick, deep slice with the scalpel. I don't trust my ability to hit the sweet spot to try pithing. I don't trust my hand strength to try "wringing" the neck. However - to those who use any of these methods successfully - more power to you!

The best way is the way you are proficient in and most comfortable with.