Black Copper Marans discussion thread

[Ihilani Coffee]

Are Marans an extra large large fowl breed? Because my Marans rooster is 2 weeks younger then my Colombian rooster and they were raised together on the same feed and yet he is WAY bigger. And my Easter Egger roosters who are just a week younger then him are half his size.

SOP is 8.5 pounds for cocks. American bred Marans seem to be bigger than other origins. EE/Ameraucana/Araucana are much smaller birds and don't make much on a plate for the time it takes to raise them.

 

[JekkaLynn]

When we breed him to out Ameruacana and Easter eggers to get olive eggers hopefully he will pass on his size. That way the extra roos can go to freezer camp sooner

 

[GaryDean26]

I read a nice article on an Orpinton Club sight about breeding for size. The author who obviously had decades of experience was of the opinion that size of the offspring is influence more by the hen than the cockerel. He said that this is called the big hen theory. Classic poultry farmers swore by it.

If you want to get scientific there was a study done by Punnett & Bailey on the inheritance of size. I skimmed it once but still need to go back and study that one.

 

[JekkaLynn]

So I would do better breeding my Easter egger or Ameruacana to my BCM hens then?

 

[GaryDean26]

So I would do better breeding my Easter egger or Ameruacana to my BCM hens then?

I don't know, but if you try it both ways you can grow them out together and report back on how the big hen theory holds up.

 

[JekkaLynn]

I don't know, but if you try it both ways you can grow them out together and report back on how the big hen theory holds up.  

Wait what about when a bantam roo breeds a large hen and the babies grow up to be shrimpy... wouldn't that disprove the big hen theory?

 

[GaryDean26]

You can read the Punnett & Bates paper. It crossed Bantams with Larger Fowl to see how size was inherited.

I am pretty sure that they didn't do anything to try to determine if one sex had a greater influence on the cross than the other did though since I don't see any crossed that were done both ways. I also don't think they did anything to see if hybird vigor created larger crosses than pure breeds or if it made a difference in the prepotency of a bird if it was the largest in its grow out group vs. an averaged size bird (i.e. do you get bigger offspring if you pair a 6 lbs hen from a breed that ranges 5-1/2 to 6-1/2 lbs or do you get bigger offspring from a 6lb hen from a breed that ranges 5-6 lbs when paired to the same cockerel and how does that compare when those same two hens are paired to a 7 cockerel from a 6-1/2 to 7-1/2 breed vs a cockerel from a 6-7 lbs breed).

If you are crossing breeds, I am guessing that you aren't going for predictable or calculated results and are fine with any range of variation and will take what ever you get.

 

[ochochicas]

Probably the Ameraucana, but I think either would be fine. It depends on what your goal is. I have an Ameraucana x Cream leg bar rooster that I'm going to cross with my Marans next year, that is if I can keep them from being broody long enough. Should produce some nice olive eggs and pretty chickens as well.

So I would do better breeding my Easter egger or Ameruacana to my BCM hens then?

 

[DMRippy]

You can read the Punnett & Bates paper. It crossed Bantams with Larger Fowl to see how size was inherited.

I am pretty sure that they didn't do anything to try to determine if one sex had a greater influence on the cross than the other did though since I don't see any crossed that were done both ways. I also don't think they did anything to see if hybird vigor created larger crosses than pure breeds or if it made a difference in the prepotency of a bird if it was the largest in its grow out group vs. an averaged size bird (i.e. do you get bigger offspring if you pair a 6 lbs hen from a breed that ranges 5-1/2 to 6-1/2 lbs or do you get bigger offspring from a 6lb hen from a breed that ranges 5-6 lbs when paired to the same cockerel and how does that compare when those same two hens are paired to a 7 cockerel from a 6-1/2 to 7-1/2 breed vs a cockerel from a 6-7 lbs breed).

If you are crossing breeds, I am guessing that you aren't going for predictable or calculated results and are fine with any range of variation and will take what ever you get.

I crossed a med size roo with LF hens and got bigger pullets, but they were not as big as the hens. I also noticed MOST if not ALL the roos from that cross were smaller even bantam sized. In fact they were just not hearty either. I then found some info that the bantam genes are sex linked...... just a though I didn't research it much but saw it in my birds.

 

[Chick CJ]

My two roos ended up being very big bodied - very healthy and big boys ... I think that is why I am really into them for a dual purpose breed - those extra roos make for a big dinner.

At what age do you usually cull the cockerels you will use for food? I currently have approximately 5 BCM cockerels that I will cull either for trade for food or I will put in my freezer. I am wondering what is a good age in order for them to still be tender meat. They are currently 4 months old.
CJ