Black Copper Marans discussion thread

[blackbirds13]

These are the two boys I have left. I will probably keep both of them at this point but if I have to choose I am leaning towards No. 1.

The first one has been just a bit smaller than the other but seems to be catching up every week. I loved the size of the other more and his shape but he has feathered middle toes...both have eyes that will hopefully keep developing as they seem to be SLOWLY changing over time - one too dark and one too light. They are 17 weeks old and Bev Davis line birds. I have kept 3 BCM hens and 1 Blue Copper hen. I'm not breeding to show just to keep my flock going and to sell off what I cannot keep or send to the freezer.
No 1 BCM - friendlier than the other

his feet from the back

and from the front

and now from the top

This is BCM 2 - he is darker with less color and he always hides from me so there will be less pics

and his feathered toes

the two together

a

the two BCM's with my son's "Favorite Guy" the Splash Copper who is HUGE!

and the girls - the blue copper is huge

I really like all my birds alot and also have Black and Lavender Ameraucanas ( I have 2 Lavs (f) and 2 blacks(m&f) and 1 blue (f) that I kept from my Paul Smith spring shipment). I am looking forward to a pair of Legbars this fall

so I also have space issues to deal with and I may have to eventually let a someone(s) go

... All comments are welcome - I am thick skinned and will do as I wish - to quote Geebs I also don't have a money tree in the backyard...I've had a wonderful time reading along (lurkaholic) and I know some have definite opinions on what to cull so I'm looking forward to what anyone has to say as it will only serve to help guide me...knowledge is power!

So please comment.

 

[Medicine Man]

The first roosters eyes are too dark(?) and his back is a bit short; the second rooster is too dark all around and has feathering on the middle toe, but a bit longer in the back.

That's what I see, but I have no opinion on which versus what.

 

[Zanna]

Blackbirds13, I am very novice so do not usually comment but I lurk and learn and also do what I like

I must comment as I love your roo #1 and I can not see a fault in him at 4 months old. A lot can change in the next 8 months for better or worse I have found so we have to be prepared for that. With more colour on him (than roo #2), that should help your hens which look a little lacking in the copper from the pics. Love his foot feathering, length of back, tail set. He has everything I would look for in a breeder roo. I believe the comb gods were on your side with both these roos, five points and nicely hanging off the back of the head. The middle toe feathering on roo #2 is a DQ as far as the SOP goes and I have read that it is a challenge to breed out............ Hopefully someone more experienced will give some comments.

 

[cpartist]

Quote:
IMO...you've got a couple of cockerels here that are defiantly worth growing out. I do not see any of the major issues that present so often with these...straw hackles, red breasts, godawful combs, squirrel tail, white feathers. They look pretty good for size and shape at only 17 weeks. The middle toe feathering on the second boy I think makes him not showable, but he may be a good breeder and throw nice offspring. Adult eye color usually shows at around this time, but the greener eyes almost always turn pumpkin and I've had a few with darker eyes lighten up at nearly a year old.

I sure like the size of these at 17 weeks...shape as well. Your pullets pics are not looking as clear to me...I think they may need more width and copper color, but the cockerels are 50% of your breeding and when you breed them cull early for middle toe feathering and keep the best for size and width...hopefully a few of these pullets will have more copper hackles. You'll have to keep or cull for egg color as well..which adds an extra dimension to breeding these, but gives you more satisfaction if you get the desired results.

If I were to get really picky...think the wings on #1 are held a tad low. This may be just the heat or the photo, but something to keep an eye on.
I am not fond of the splashes as I am never sure what they will add or subtract to the color...but think your splash looks pretty good for size. but hasn't as good or as nice shape as your BCM's,

I think you have some REALLY good potential with these

 

[pinkchick]

#1 's eyes may still change....I like this bird better than #2, if his eyes lighten up I wouldn't hestitate test mating him to see what he produces, heck even if his eyes didn't lighten up I would still test mate him.

#2 is kinda dark, but the feather on the middle toe would keep me from breeding him...other than that I think he is a nice bird. Both have nice tail sets.

My favorite is that Splash Copper.......need more photos of him.

 

[blackbirds13]

Thanks for all the comments thus far.
I only recently started to like no.1 more, but only since he's started to size up a bit. I checked him this morning and his wings are a bit too low, and hopefully his eyes will lighten. I am anxious to see what the girls do for egg color. They are all overly dark thus far and one is especially so. I was really obsessively down on my roosters a few weeks ago and did some looking around but could not find anything that was really better. Everything seemed to have their own faults whether it be leg/shank color and feathering (that middle toe issue or not at all), a LOT of over colored birds, small birds and egg color that would range from below 4 I think to about 6 max and some even with my inexperienced eyes just did not look right. I'm gonna hold out until next spring and then reassess. My husband says I can be a bit obsessive (who me?) and particular (my dad calls it high-strung) so I am trying to take my time with this hobby and let things grow out before I get all wiggy. I've had very, very, very little success with hatching shipped eggs but perhaps if I need to and can get a hold of some super dark ones i'll try that dry incubation I've read so many good things about on BYC...Just wanna keep it as fun as it has been thus far. Have to remember I started this "hobby" for fresh-know-where-they've-been -and-whats-in-'em-eggs. I will not obsess, I will not obssess....okay gonna head back outside and stare at my birds for a while.

ETA - I have posted Favorite Guy, the Splash on BYC before - he is huge but his feet are a mess!!!! I thought about using him to make blue and splash EE's next year. My 2 year old loves him but he may have to go depending on space issues. I was gonna build another large coop this summer but my mon and dad both had some health issues so I went down to FL for a bit. I do have 2 large dog houses I have converted to smaller coops to use as rooster pens or grow outs...but I am not sure about how they will work in the winter up here and how to heat the water for them. We plan on moving the coops and their large run further out later this summer and that will compound the problem. They have a lot of freerange space when not in the run but that decreases with all the snow no matter how much plowing and snowblowing DH does.

 

[DMRippy]

Glad I am not the only one to stare at my birds

My adult son and hubby do kinda think I have lost my mind. I just tell them I know exactly where I left it... in the coop!

 

[Wynette]

Excellent observation on wing carriage, cpartist! It takes me 2, 3, 4 looks to see everything but you quickly saw this - I wihs I had your eye! Wing carriage should be horizontal. Someone posted something on how to "fix" this - was it Don? I think maybe it was...I THINK he said [don, correct me if I am wrong and if it was you who said it] to raise your roost bar so they have to fly higher...this exercises the wings & the muscles needed to be able to hold them horizontally as they should be.

I like #1 better than #2 - I don't see a short back, though...that comment interested me. The ONLY thing that bothers me is that your gals look to be a bit slight in build; this is something lacking in the breed and, for that reason, I might consider trying #2 boy since he's larger. Can you keep them both?

 

[snowbird]

Quote:
Wynette, The older show people use the higher roost pole to raise the wing carriage as it strenghtens the muscle and will raise the wing up. I have used several of the Mahogany males colored like #2 with real good luck. I used four of them this year and the female were at least 90 % copper hackle, some of the female used were black with no color but real good type. I believe the dark female will produce copper hackle if it is in their Genes. The males from this were junk.

Wonder if the one pullet actually has all the white or if it is the Camera. They are too young to worry about the eye color. I see nothing wrong with the Back on either. I like the shank feathering except for the middle toe . I also wonder if they have been through the Juve molt yet, can tell more after the molt.

The splash male has the twisted comb and would not use him for SOP type Marans. I also wander if these are all out of the same hatch, BC and blue as this does make a difference.

 

[snowbird]

Just one thing on the roost pole do not put it too high, they will fly up more to a medium high pole that they will up to one that is high. For the Marans about four feet should be about right, when younger use about two feet and when they are ready they will go on up to the higher roost.