Black Copper Marans discussion thread

[CountryFriedChicken]

Oops - I may have opened a can of worms about type... can we talk type without being ugly? Yes I have seen the diagram... very good example.

 

[NYREDS]

I'm not even sure how to respond to this. Suffice to say -- there is SO much more to learn when you can hold a real, live bird in your hands - see their size, feel their weight and their angles, their bones, and see their "colours" and flaws with your very own eyes, not just through the eyes of my lens and what I choose to post. On line forums are great sources of information but they are definitately NOT the be all and end all.

Absolutely right. Not to say you can't learn anything from a picture but pictures are of limited value. You can't really judge a bird until you get it in your hand. Even seeing a bird in a cage doesn't tell you everything. I've walked a class many times & decided which bird I was sure would win only to change my mind after handling the birds. This all assumes birds that outwardly appear to be good examples. Obviously a picture of a good specimen vs a picture of a poor specimen would be different.

 

[math ace]

I'm not even sure how to respond to this. Suffice to say -- there is SO much more to learn when you can hold a real, live bird in your hands - see their size, feel their weight and their angles, their bones, and see their "colours" and flaws with your very own eyes, not just through the eyes of my lens and what I choose to post. On line forums are great sources of information but they are definitately NOT the be all and end all.

For me, I spot faults and Dq's a lot easier through photographs. When I look at my flock and try to decide which will be culled and which will stay, I find it hard to spot items. The birds are running, scratching, and exploring. I find that a camera with a telephoto lens allows me to get some real good close ups. Then I bring the photos back to the computer and enlarge them even more. Going one step further, I put photos of two or three birds side by side and compare them. PHOTOS can tell you a lot. I don't even trust my eyes to tell how big my birds are .. Every bird gets a couple of trips to the scale before maturity.

Looking at photos can be an excellent substitute to actually holding the bird if the photos are taken right. A single photo will not tell the whole story. You need shots from top, front, side, and back to form an honest and realistic opinion.

Personally, I like photos way better than the real thing because I can study them. I can compare them to sketches like the one Vicki posted. . . .

 

[math ace]

Oops - I may have opened a can of worms about type... can we talk type without being ugly? Yes I have seen the diagram... very good example.

Oh CountryFriedChicken.... Only 100 posts to your name and you are wading into the rough waters of Marans.
Egg Color or Type which is more important?
Bev Davis or Wade Jean?
Round eggs or Oval Eggs?
Wheaten or Penne Influence?
Photo or Real Bird?
Eggs or Live Birds?
Vaccinate or Not?
Worm or Not?
Organic or Chemical?
Manufacture Chicken Feed or Custom Mix?

You haven't opened a can of worms.... Lord, that ship sailed a Long Dang Time Ago!

Every one has opinions and beliefs . . . Sometimes the discussion gets heated and someone has an ah ha moment. Other times, it just gets heated. This is one GIANT family. Not every one likes their in-laws, but they are still family. Stick around long enough CountryFriedChicken and you will see what I mean. There are some real fine folks on here. . .. . Some are the in-laws and some are the out-laws. One thing is for sure, if you ask a question, you will get an answer...or two.... or three.... or four

 

[CountryFriedChicken]

Thanks Math Ace... Im here to learn more and yes have some marans...

 

[fowlman01]

Interesting, very interesting..... that must be how birds with OBVIOUS DQ's are winning at some sanctioned shows. I know this has come up on the GNH thread about COLOR..... there are no color swatches in the SOP, so it is up to the judge to determine the color and if it is correct. From what I have read the younger judges have NEVER seen the older NH and don't have a reference to draw color from. Everyone was complaining about the artist rendition of the GNH. Makes me think they may all be a little off since the artist is not necessarily a chicken person. I come from a printing background so Copper to me looks NOTHING like what these Marans have (copper in my world does not have much red, just enough to change it from GOLD to Copper). So everyone can take a piece of the pie and make it fit their own views and pallet. Now if someone can give me some PMS colors I can look them up and KNOW what color they are talking about LOL......

If we had Pantone Matching System swatches for poultry colors, it would make things much more consistent. The APA did have color plates of some of the popular colors in the old days, but for some reason it was eliminated from the SOP. Printing an exact match for poultry colors is not an easy thing. It is similar to trying to match food colors with offset printing...it is never going to be accurate. Then if you leave a color plate exposed to light for any length of time, you have another color change........even if you have used UV ink. The PMS color for Marans copper would be in the metallic swatches of the PMS book. In the good BCM's I have seen it is closer to a metallic than a regular color. I was in the printing industry for many years.

Walt

 

[snowbird]

The point on my wanting to show pictures and comments on Marans in general is that very few of the people on byc will ever go to a APA show to see any of the better Marans. At the present time the best resource is to get the comments on BYC for all to see.

All of us are never going to agree on very much of anything but we still should give out our opinion on the Marans when asked.

If anyone wants to post a picture for a critique I will sure comment.

 

[snowbird]

In the past several in this region had thought about having a siminar at some of the regional shows. This would be perfect if it was advertised and the host show furnished a few cages to display some Marans for the group to see.

 

[DMRippy]

Quote: If you still have a PMS book, I might email you for a PMS color match down the road LOL..... Yeah copper would be in the metallics section. I was an Engraver so my metallics are prettier than printing inks.

I know it is hard to get colors PERFECT and keep them that way with printing inks. Engraving inks stay the same for DECADES they are different and lay on top of the paper and are not easy to fade since it is very thick ink.

 

[fowlman01]

If you still have a PMS book, I might email you for a PMS color match down the road LOL..... Yeah copper would be in the metallics section. I was an Engraver so my metallics are prettier than printing inks.

I know it is hard to get colors PERFECT and keep them that way with printing inks. Engraving inks stay the same for DECADES they are different and lay on top of the paper and are not easy to fade since it is very thick ink.

Engraving is a lost art. You guys can pile the ink on but litho's are a thin coating and subject to fade. I had thought about doing color samples of chicken feathers, but to do it right it would be very costtly and once it was exposed to light for any length of time it would fade.

Walt