Blackhead poo?

[KsKingBee]

Well she is real droopy, won't eat much. We have her isolated with special feed and drink, started fish zoil this afternoon. Haven't really heard anyone say it looked like blackhead poo, hopefully it's a dietary problem.

 

[casportpony]

Well she is real droopy, won't eat much. We have her isolated with special feed and drink, started fish zoil this afternoon. Haven't really heard anyone say it looked like blackhead poo, hopefully it's a dietary problem.

It looks more like blackhead poop than this does, and this *was* blackhead.

The above picture was from this peacock:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/...s-probable-blackhead-five-miles-from-my-place

These are also black head poops:

 

[KsKingBee]

That fifth picture is very close to what we have witnessed. The other people that I spoke to were describing something more like the sixth one. I think you are spot on and this is nothing to take lightly. We have her contained and started on medication and will keep you informed. Thanks for the reassurance! The not knowing for sure and being unsure what to do has really bothered us.

 

[casportpony]

That fifth picture is very close to what we have witnessed. The other people that I spoke to were describing something more like the sixth one. I think you are spot on and this is nothing to take lightly. We have her contained and started on medication and will keep you informed. Thanks for the reassurance! The not knowing for sure and being unsure what to do has really bothered us.

I've seen blackhead soooooooo many times and it doesn't always look the same, but I almost always treat the same way. Do you have any other antibiotics like Baytril, Clavamox, Augmentin, Cipro or amoxicillin? If this has been going on for awhile she might also have an e. Coli infection, many of mine often do.

Remember that the pills *must* be given orally. I know some people will say to put it in the water, but they won't drink enough water for it to work.

If she were my hen I would tube fluids, then fluid and food, 'cause it's not usually the disease that kills them, it's dehydration. Tubing is very easy to do and I can provide help over the phone for anyone that can get the supplies.

Read this:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/805728/go-team-tube-feeding

This is not a picture from one of mine, but I have seen poop just like this in one of my turkeys that had blackhead, but I've also seen it in peafowl that had coccidiosis.



-Kathy

 

[KsKingBee]

We needed a feeding syringe so we went to town to the vet. Since we were going we took a stool sample for a fecal test. She said our turkey has tape worms.

The vet loaded us up an injection, doubled the cost of our turkey, and sent us on our way with feeding suggestions. She said that the worms will come out in about three days so we now have her in the garage with a heat lamp and a smorgasbord of yummy and delicious.

 

[KsKingBee]

I've seen blackhead soooooooo many times and it doesn't always look the same, but I almost always treat the same way. Do you have any other antibiotics like Baytril, Clavamox, Augmentin, Cipro or amoxicillin? If this has been going on for awhile she might also have an e. Coli infection, many of mine often do.

Remember that the pills *must* be given orally. I know some people will say to put it in the water, but they won't drink enough water for it to work.


-Kathy

Ok, poor turkey not only has tape worms but blackhead too. There is no doubt now after looking in the kiddie pool where the turkeys cage is, the bright yellow poo is. well there is a lot of it.

I read your thread on using horse wormer, very good info, but when we were at the vets we noticed another product called Quest Plus gel. What caught our attention is that it has both Moxidectin 2% and Praziquantel 12.5%. What the vet prescribed for the tape worm was Praziquantel, one ml injected IM or squirt down the throat. The vet told us that the Praziquantel was the best product for tape worm, that there was another I think it was Valbazen?

We are planning on deworming all the remaining flock and was wondering if you knew how much Quest Plus we should use.

 

[casportpony]

Ok, poor turkey not only has tape worms but blackhead too. There is no doubt now after looking in the kiddie pool where the turkeys cage is, the bright yellow poo is. well there is a lot of it.

I read your thread on using horse wormer, very good info, but when we were at the vets we noticed another product called Quest Plus gel. What caught our attention is that it has both Moxidectin 2% and Praziquantel 12.5%. What the vet prescribed for the tape worm was Praziquantel, one ml injected IM or squirt down the throat. The vet told us that the Praziquantel was the best product for tape worm, that there was another I think it was Valbazen?

We are planning on deworming all the remaining flock and was wondering if you knew how much Quest Plus we should use.

If I remember correctly, the main ingredient in Quest wormer, moxidectin, does *not* have a wide margin of safety and it requires accurate dosing or one runs the risk of overdosing. You vet is correct, praziquantil is the best for tapes and if they'll sell you the liquid or write a prescription, that's how what I would do if I were you, but I would treat for the blackhead, probable e. Coli and cecal worm first.

According to studies (see below), Valbazen (albendazole) and Safeguard (fenbendazole) will also work, but Safeguard has to be given 3 days in a row for it to be effective at the lower dose, so Valbazen is probably a better choice.

Are you still giving the metronidazole? When they don't get better by the third day I give them Baytril, too. Baytril Doses that three different avian vets have told me to use are:

• 10mg/kg twice a day for 5 days
• 15mg/kg once a day for 5 days
• 20mg/kg once a day for 5 days

-Kathy

Source: http://japr.oxfordjournals.org/content/16/3/392.short
Determination of the Anthelmintic Efficacy of Albendazole in the Treatment of Chickens Naturally Infected with Gastrointestinal Helminths

In the spring of 2006, 60 naturally infected hens obtained from a broiler-breeder farm in northwest Arkansas were used in a controlled titration study to determine the anthelmintic efficacy of albendazole in the treatment of both nematode and cestode infections. Albendazole was used at the dose rates of 0.0, 5.0, 10.0, and 20.0 mg/kg of BW, with all treatments given individually as an oral suspension on d 0 (split doses) and with necropsies for parasite collection conducted on d 7. There were 15 birds per treatment group. Statistically significant (P < 0.05) reductions in worm burdens from control levels were seen at the 5.0 mg/kg dose level for adult and larval stages of Ascaridia galli, Heterakis gallinarum, and Capillaria obsignata. A significant (P < 0.05) reduction in the numbers of Raillietina cesticillus (scolexes) from control group levels was seen only at the 20.0 mg/kg rate of treatment. For albendazole given at the rates of 5.0, 10.0, and 20.0 mg/kg, respective anthelmintic efficacies based on geometric means were 87.7, 91.2, and 98.2% (A. galli larvae); 100.0, 100.0, and 100.0% (A. galli adults); 96.9, 95.7, and 98.9% (H. gallinarum larvae); 92.7, 95.4, and 94.9% (H. gallinarum adults); 90.3, 91.3, and 95.1% (C. obsignata larvae and adults combined); and 73.1, 73.1, and 96.2% (R. cesticillus). No adverse reactions to albendazole were observed in this study.


Source: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/6750887
Efficacy of fenbendazole against helminth parasites of poultry in Uganda.

Ssenyonga GS.
Abstract

Fenbendazole 4% (Panacur, Hoechst) administered in feed was used to treat chickens infected with Ascaridia galli, Heterakis gallinarum and Railletina spp. It was also used to treat Syngamus trachea in broiler birds. There was a marked drop in helminth egg counts in the faeces on the second day of treatment and the faeces became negative by the seventh day after the last treatment. Post-mortem examination 15 to 21 days later showed that the drug was 100% effective against Ascaridia galli and Heterakis gallinarum at 10 mg/kg. However, for complete removal of Railletina spp. 15 mg/kg was required. Similarly 20 mg/kg fenbendazole was effective against Syngamus trachea. It was concluded that fenbendazole is suitable for the treatment of the important intestinal and tracheal worms of poultry, a dose of 15 to 20 mg/kg for 3 consecutive days being recommended for use under field conditions.

 

[KsKingBee]

Are you still giving the metronidazole? When they don't get better by the third day I give them Baytril, too. Baytril Doses that three different avian vets have told me to use are:

• .

It has ben a bit of a roller coaster trying to decide what the problem is and what to treat for. Our first thought was blackhead so we got the fish zoil and started that. The next day the vet said it was tape worms so we got the liquid Praziquantel which we spilled when the turkey pulled her leg back and pulled the needle out.

The next day the poo was so obvious that we restarted the fish zoil and re administered the Praz injection. So now we are planning, after missing one pill, to do the full five (perhaps seven), days of fish zoil. The hen is drinking ok, and eating very little. We are going to tube feed again today and until she gets her appetite back.

The reason we wanted to get more info on the Quest gel is because we want to treat all our flock for tapes, but at $14 per cc for the Praz injectable it is not financially feasible.

 

[casportpony]

Any time I see yellowish poop here they get wormed with Safeguard *and* I start them on metronidazole, period. If they've been sick for awhile they also get Baytril or Clavamox or there is a good chance they'll end up like this:



Liver and cecal pouches


Contents of cecal pouch - black liquid poop, NOT normal!


Inside of cecal pouch




Liver with the blackhead spots and I think the black edges are necrotic

Call your vet and see if he'll give you any advice for treating blackhead with Safeguard, metronidazole *and* Baytril. FWIW, when I tube a large bird they get between 60-120ml several times a day.

This is a very serious disease and the longer a bird is sick the more likely it will die.

-Kathy

 

[KsKingBee]

Turkey is looking and feeling much better today. She is eating and drinking on her own and looks to be on the road to recovery. Or it is the looking better before she croaks...

The vet is out of the office until Monday, I will see if she will make a recommendation for the wormer then. Thanks for your advise.