Bob Blosl's Heritage Large Fowl Thread

[winniem13]

Ok, the "wolf and dog" metaphor makes it clear to me. Jungle fowl are the "wolves" that domesticated chicken "dogs" genetically came from (although, who's to say that Adam didn't have flocks of jungle fowl AND Rhode Island Reds? (You get my point).

I would Love to see the reaction of people's faces if a curious Aseel or Malay comes up to their car in someone's yard!!!!!

 

[Chris09]

Does anyone know where this is located? KISS

Look's like the Rhode Island Red Monument in Little Compton, Rhode Island.

Chris

 

[OSUman]

My sister went to India, and from what she told me, a small village will have a communal flock of chickens that runs loose, and from what I saw in the pictures, they kinda looked like a oriental type of bird, or probably something more like grades. But of course they would be used to it

Ok, the "wolf and dog" metaphor makes it clear to me. Jungle fowl are the "wolves" that domesticated chicken "dogs" genetically came from (although, who's to say that Adam didn't have flocks of jungle fowl AND Rhode Island Reds? (You get my point).
I would Love to see the reaction of people's faces if a curious Aseel or Malay comes up to their car in someone's yard!!!!!

 

[Bentley]

The chickens known as 'Red Jungle Fowl' kept by fanciers are not pure 'Jungle Fowl.'

A very good friend of mine, retire Univ. of Ga. research professor Dr I Lehr Brisbin, had the most genetically pure strain of Jungle Fowl in North America at the Savannah River Site. What you see people calling Jungle Fowl are contaminated with domestic chicken genes.

Interesting conversation. I, too, have had some experience with Jungle Fowl and in particular the Red Jungle Fowl in conjunction with the Savannah River Ecology Lab. I lived and worked in Georgia for 10 years and became friends with a great old time breeder named Al Cummings, who has since passed away. One of the greats as far as breeding 'hard to breed fowl' and he told me in his life he had produced some of the 'first breeding's' in the US of several of the very rare pheasant like birds. I had the opportunity to visit his place and work with him several times while I lived there and before he passed away. Truly a great man.

Old Al, gave me a pair of Red Jungle Fowl that had been DNA tested for purity and implanted with a microchip for identification and that mine were now the fifth 'flock' of pure Red Jungle fowl in the US. Evidently they are able to detect the presence of 'western chickens' in the DNA and that even the zoos did not have pure stock and even where they originated they had largely become contaminated with other genetics. Red Jungle Fowl are very difficult to breed and will freely cross with any chicken which is why they have been crossed out so much to get more of them. One characteristic of Red Jungle Fowl is the eclipse molt. They will molt twice, once they will molt and grow in black feathers and the second molt will be the Wild Type pattern and will coincide with breeding season. I was told they imported some Red Jungle Fowl in to Georgia in the 60's with an attempt to create another game bird for hunting. One of the many areas they dropped the birds was in the Fitzgerald Georgia area (I lived in nearby Tifton for several years) and that one of the reasons the project didn't work is these birds had a tendency to migrate to farm areas and associate closely with livestock for food sources and would then stay relatively close to those food sources. Still today there are several feral populations of them on small tracts of land but when I went to see the birds there was no evidence of an eclipse molt.

On the jungle Fowl themselves. There are four recognized Jungle Fowl, all of which have recently been reclassified in the pheasant family. The four are Red, Gray, Green and Ceylon. I have raised the Reds and Grays and I can tell you, the real Grays are much more pheasant like than chickens. I witnessed mine fly up to a perch, hover in the air, turn then land on the perch. Chickens don't do this. Also, their vocalizations are very different. From what I have read, the Grays have been used in their country of origin to cross with native Fowl to create a male that has a very unique crow. Not sure why they do this, but they do and that this cross was sterile. I never tried to cross mine with chickens so I am not sure about this.

So, when people talk about having Red Jungle Fowl, it is usually some sort of cross as there are very very few pure lines left anywhere.

 

[winniem13]

So are malays and assels and such condidered jungle fowl? Do those breeds crow?

 

[Yard full o' rocks]

Interesting conversation. I, too, have had some experience with Jungle Fowl and in particular the Red Jungle Fowl in conjunction with the Savannah Rive Ecology Lab. I lived and worked in Georgia for 10 years and became friends with a great old time breeder names Al Cummings, who has since passed away. One of the greats as far as breeding 'hard to breed fowl' and he told me in his life he had produced some of the first breeding's in the US of several of the very rare pheasant like birds. I had the opportunity to visit his place and work with him several times while I lived there and before he passed away.

Old Al, gave me a pair of Red Jungle Fowl that had been DNA tested for purity and implanted with a microchip for identification and that mine were now the fifth 'flock' of pure Red Jungle fowl in the US. Evidently they are able to detect the presence of 'western chickens' in the DNA and that even the zoos did not have pure stock and even where they originated they had largely become contaminated with other genetics. Red Jungle Fowl are very difficult to breed and will freely cross with any chicken which is why they have been crossed out so much to get more of them. One characteristic of Red Jungle Fowl is the eclipse molt. They will molt twice, once they will molt and grow in black feathers and the second molt will be the Wild type pattern and will coincide with breeding season. I was told they imported some Red Jungle Fowl in to Georgia in the 60's with an attempt to create another game bird for hunting. One of the many areas the dropped the birds was Fitzgerald Georgia (I lived in nearby Tifton for several years) and that one of the reasons the project didn't work is these birds had a tendency to migrate to farm areas and associate with livestock for food sources and would then stay relatively close to those food sources. Still today there are several feral populations of them on small tracts of land but when I went to see the birds there was no evidence of an eclipse molt.

On the jungle Fowl themselves. There are four recognized Jungle Fowl, all of which have recently been reclassified in the pheasant family. The four are Red, Gray, Green and Ceylon. I have raised the Reds and Grays and I can tell you, the real Grays are much more pheasant like than chickens. I witnessed mine fly up to a perch, hover in the air, turn then turn land on the perch. Chickens don't do this. Also, there calls are very different. From what I have read, the Grays have been used in their country of origin to cross with native Fowl to create a male that has a very unique crow. Not sure why they do this, but they do.

So, when people talk about having Red Jungle Fowl, it is usually some sort of cross as there are very very few pure lines left anywhere.

Well, now the story about the birds in the Fitzgerald area makes a bit more sense now!! Was ABAC involved with that transplantation of those birds by any chance?? My MIL and FILs families were both from the Tifton area (Rainwaters and Roberts) but they have now either all passed on or moved away from the Tifton area. Since that whole area was once huge bird hunting area for years (and Albany still is), a new "introduction" of a huntable species would have been welcomed.

The birds my FIL got from the Fitzgerald area were very much feral, but I do not recall a molt in them which yielded a different feather pattern each time. They must have been a result of many years of crossing with local fowl in the area. They were very beautiful and hardy birds....would love to get some again

 

[OSUman]

Malays and Aseels are oriental chickens

So are malays and assels and such condidered jungle fowl? Do those breeds crow?

 

[winniem13]

Im learning so much, and the 13+ members (all under 17 years) of my 4h will learn so much as a result!!! I will be teaching about the breed classifications of chickens (the classes APA divides them into) as the topic for January. I've made a powerpoint and have included pictures of different breeds in each class ((2or 3 each class). The term "jungle fowl" was confusing me, thanks for helping clear that up. I googled the colors mrntioned (red, green, etc), and wow what beautiful combs! I can see the pheasant like qualities. Drfinately not one you can go up and hug for a 4h show!!!

 

[mschlumb]

So are malays and assels and such condidered jungle fowl? Do those breeds crow?

They are not or at least should not be considered jungle fowl.
Echoing what has been said they are oriental breeds. But should not be called jungle fowl

 

[Marengoite]

Here are some of the things I saw at the university. Kids didn't know that postage stamps cost money. At move out time they would leave all their computers and TV's cuz they didn't want to deal with moving them. None can spell.etc, etc. If I needed to talk to a student, the only way I could contact them was to text them. They don't pick up their mail, answer emails or return phone calls. They do have awesome hand eye coordination and great knowledge of personal communication devices and applications. Personally I have no problem with any of that.......it's just another generation and we all do it differently.

Walt

Put me down as old fashioned, Walt. While I think some of the griping about the state of education is perennial, I also feel that there is SO much that kids don't know. Trouble is, I can't tell what knowledge I've picked up because of school and what I've picked up on my own. I recall learning December 7, 1941 and Pearl Harbor in school, but I don't ever recall learning 1066 and the Battle of Hastings. I think I had to pick up that one on my own.

I don't mind what the kids don't know if they have the means to pick it up. Some say they can find out everything the need to know on Google and that may be so for facts and information. But I can tell you as a Baby Boomer that facts and info don't mean doodly-squat unless you know what to think ABOUT the facts and information. A lot - and I mean a LOT - of kids don't know what the facts and information mean or how to use the information and put it together in any sort of sense-making logic.

Makes me wonder what society is going to be like in 20 years.

rick