BREEDING FOR PRODUCTION...EGGS AND OR MEAT.

[CanadianBuckeye]

How much of an indicator of good laying is width between the legs? Or is that really just a meat characteristic?

I have just gotten into Spitzhauben and MAN do they have their legs closer together than all my other breeds.

I was wondering if that was just a cosmetic choice... Or if it had a production impact.

Here's a handy link with photos. "Call of the Hen" Lite.
https://livestockconservancy.org/images/uploads/docs/ALBCchicken_assessment-2.pdf

 

[CanadianBuckeye]

The best layers from the hatcheries are often a bit pinched in the tail. I think maybe a guy that was into phrenology may have been a bit off on this one.

Can you quote some recent scientific poultry research papers?

I'm trying to see if a pinched tail correlates to narrow pubic bones/ poor capacity/ shallow depth. A wry tail is definitely bad news, since the skeletal structure is compromised but since the tail feathers sit on the Pope's nose (pygostyle?) I don't know why a pinched tail would even matter.

 

[Alaskan]

I still need to take the time to read through the articles, thanks for the links.

Do they include also the width between the legs?

 

[CanadianBuckeye]

I still need to take the time to read through the articles, thanks for the links.

Do they include also the width between the legs?

I don't remember reading about width between the legs, although that could correlate to narrowness elsewhere. It's an important trait for meat birds though. I think you have to wait until they are well into lay to assess them anyway, perhaps they are still young. All my young pullets have only a finger's width between the pubic bones (They are four months old). Unfortunately I don't think it's really possible to assess them for laying ability until they actually get there.

 

[Turk Raphael]

I don't remember reading about width between the legs, although that could correlate to narrowness elsewhere. It's an important trait for meat birds though. I think you have to wait until they are well into lay to assess them anyway, perhaps they are still young. All my young pullets have only a finger's width between the pubic bones (They are four months old). Unfortunately I don't think it's really possible to assess them for laying ability until they actually get there.

Oh yes...yes they can be assessed before point of lay. Not saying I'm expert at it but I have seen a few youtube vids on the subject with various APA judges...one from Canada...dark complected fella and dark hair. He also gave an interesting run down of 4 Buckeye cockerels or cocks that was very enlightening. I just can't quite remember his name but I will get it and perhaps other acts I've mentioned.

 

[bnjrob]

A number of years ago we found a lonely little border crossing in Quebec's eastern townships. There was nobody there. We stopped at the booth, waited for a few minutes, nothing........ so we just drove through. A few seconds later there's the border guard running the 10 second 100 yard dash after us down the road ........ I guess he was in the outhouse or something.
Same trip but crossing into New Brunswick from Maine, they looked through our truck- and found this baggie of cubed brown stuff in the glove box. They guy was so smug, he thought he'd hit the jackpot..... he wanted to know what it was.......... well it was BEEF JERKY. I've never seen a more disappointed border guard. Ha haaa haaaaaa!

 

[CanadianBuckeye]

Oh yes...yes they can be assessed before point of lay. Not saying I'm expert at it but I have seen a few youtube vids on the subject with various APA judges...one from Canada...dark complected fella and dark hair. He also gave an interesting run down of 4 Buckeye cockerels or cocks that was very enlightening. I just can't quite remember his name but I will get it and perhaps other acts I've mentioned.

I would be very grateful

for any links or references you could post on assessing breeding cockerels/ pullets for egg laying potential.

 

[Beekissed]

I'm trying to see if a pinched tail correlates to narrow pubic bones/ poor capacity/ shallow depth. A wry tail is definitely bad news, since the skeletal structure is compromised but since the tail feathers sit on the Pope's nose (pygostyle?) I don't know why a pinched tail would even matter.

I guess it's sort of a "size matters" thing, wherein the small tail sits on a small pelvis whereas the large/wide tail usually graces a wider pelvis...but I've seen some beanpole women throw out huge babies without even having a cramp and the same with HUGE eggs coming out of a Leghorn and come every day.

You can evaluate the potential for egg laying/passage before they reach POL but that width does change after they've laid a good clutch or two. My girls that have a three finger pelvis before POL will usually have a 4 finger after they've actually started laying for a bit. The abdominal capacity can change after POL as well.

I don't even consider keeping a hen that has 2 finger pelvic width prior to POL...those get marked for culling and monitored for laying, just to see if that all pans out.

I'm currently trying to monitor the truth of all these measurements, though that's hard to do without trap nests.

 

[Alaskan]

I guess it's sort of a "size matters" thing, wherein the small tail sits on a small pelvis whereas the large/wide tail usually graces a wider pelvis...but I've seen some beanpole women throw out huge babies without even having a cramp and the same with HUGE eggs coming out of a Leghorn and come every day. 

You can evaluate the potential for egg laying/passage before they reach POL but that width does change after they've laid a good clutch or two.  My girls that have a three finger pelvis before POL will usually have a 4 finger after they've actually started laying for a bit.  The abdominal capacity can change after POL as well. 

I don't even consider keeping a hen that has 2 finger pelvic width prior to POL...those get marked for culling and monitored for laying, just to see if that all pans out. 

I'm currently trying to monitor the truth of all these measurements, though that's hard to do without trap nests. 

Brilliant! I fail at record keeping...so please do that for us and report back!

 

[lpatelski]

I like to poach them to the point they are a little firm on the outside and lusciously oozy on the inside, salt pepper and a pat of butter, dip the toast in, and it feels like you died and went to heaven. ,

I poach them in milk and pour the whole thing over buttered toast...