BREEDING FOR PRODUCTION...EGGS AND OR MEAT.

[gjensen]

Sussex at their best were expected to be good market birds and have hens that were solid layers. No one ever expected mediocrity. Their survival was in the food they raised. They did not have that luxury. There is no good reason why a Sussex pullet should not lay 200 eggs in her first laying cycle, with good management.

Of course there has always been variation between strains and some were better at one than another etc.

 

[Arielle]

I can see what you mean George-- the SS I have have a tail that is squirrel tail. I delved into tthis for a long time, asking about this . Only "don't use him" was the answer. Or about pinched tail-- don't use it. BUt not why or hwo to wrk with it. ALL my males have squirrel tail. All. I'm praying that sudenly a non-squirrel tail will appear. However, logic tells me that this is a process of altering the body shape until the tail sits were it is supposed to be WHEN the body shape is right. Maybe I am wrong .. . but it's all I"ve got right now.

 

[southernmomma]

You are right ROn that the SS is supposed to be a meat breed. However, the big hatcheries have turned it into a meatless egg machine ( for a sussex). I am playing around with trying to improve the SS that I have as I was able to get a few someone was working on for a few years. I just love their all day foraging and huslting for food.

I want meat on the culls.

I had planned to save 2 of the meatier cckl, but a third blasted past me as I was reaching for him to give him one more review. He's staying. THat is 3 meatier boys.

ANd I kept two of the larger type.

I was a little surprised to see the carcass without the feathers. Meatier at the area above the keel. BUt none were as good as the boy I culled earlier in the week. I regret that now. Haste . . . and all that.

I was also suprised that the white skin becomes yellow when it dries. I wonder if that is the effect of the grass they eat in abundance? It had me looking at all the cckls for white skin. Terrified that somehow a yellow skinne gene had entered the gene pool. BUt all were whiteskinned.

My realization today is that it is too bad that so many of us have not been able to learn since childhood how to raise good poultry. So much could have learned from a chicken savy adult. I feel like I am re-creating the wheel.

This is one (of many) reasons we're leaving the city; my husband has so many stories of growing up around cattle and knowing where his food came from. I want the same for our children. My son had a friend over to play and this little boy couldn't believe we were growing food in our backyard....funny but mostly really sad.

M

 

[LindaB220]

You are right ROn that the SS is supposed to be a meat breed. However, the big hatcheries have turned it into a meatless egg machine ( for a sussex). I am playing around with trying to improve the SS that I have as I was able to get a few someone was working on for a few years. I just love their all day foraging and huslting for food.

I want meat on the culls.

I had planned to save 2 of the meatier cckl, but a third blasted past me as I was reaching for him to give him one more review. He's staying. THat is 3 meatier boys.

ANd I kept two of the larger type.

I was a little surprised to see the carcass without the feathers. Meatier at the area above the keel. BUt none were as good as the boy I culled earlier in the week. I regret that now. Haste . . . and all that.

I was also suprised that the white skin becomes yellow when it dries. I wonder if that is the effect of the grass they eat in abundance? It had me looking at all the cckls for white skin. Terrified that somehow a yellow skinne gene had entered the gene pool. BUt all were whiteskinned.

My realization today is that it is too bad that so many of us have not been able to learn since childhood how to raise good poultry. So much could have learned from a chicken savy adult. I feel like I am re-creating the wheel.

Is corn in their ration? I've heard that this will yellow the white skin.

 

[gjensen]

I can see what you mean George-- the SS I have have a tail that is squirrel tail. I delved into tthis for a long time, asking about this . Only "don't use him" was the answer. Or about pinched tail-- don't use it. BUt not why or hwo to wrk with it. ALL my males have squirrel tail. All. I'm praying that sudenly a non-squirrel tail will appear. However, logic tells me that this is a process of altering the body shape until the tail sits were it is supposed to be WHEN the body shape is right. Maybe I am wrong .. . but it's all I"ve got right now.

That what is what many smart people would say, but I disagree at least partially. In other words, I do not think that the cause is universal.

The problem with high, near squirrel tails, and squirrel tails is that they are highly heritable. As you can see. It is tough to contend with. One of the fancy I first had trouble with.

That is why I mentioned finding a good typed exhibition trio, and using them. I know that you are interested in utility traits (I am to), so you have some useful qualities in the birds that you have. Possible something that the exhibition birds would fall short on. I am not familiar with your birds, but am familiar with the typical hatchery examples. High, pinched tails, narrow, and shallow. Pretty layers, but far from being actual Sussex.

I ramble about this stuff, because I would like to see more birds that represent the breed reasonably well, but were generally useful as well. The rarest of all examples I think. I find the idea of "re-building" projects fascinating. The genetics are available. Just a big commitment.

I am not certain that the speckled variety was ever utilitarian, but would be nice looking birds to be useful.

 

[Arielle]

Quote: I'm happy for ou and your family. I am hoping more and more people become a little more self sufficient.

Here it is difficult to farm. THe tagging station for the area is at a VFW next to a young childrens play ground. THe uproar was amazing-- the tagging was moved to the farthest side of the VFW to reduce the stress to the little kids and mothers. I was outraged at how limited people here have become. I explain to my kids the nessesity of hunting: we have taken the homes from the deer and there is less food, so it is important to keep the numbers of deer down so they have enough to eat all winter. THe other problem is people get outraged when hired professionals are killing geese that stay for the winter. THe endless complaining at the goose poop but don't kill them!! Really? Humans are loosing a sense of balance witht he natural world. I feel like I am still learning it. I don't hunt, but I don't object to it. IT is WL management. Yah, funny but mostly really sad.

 

[Arielle]

Quote: I read the online sussex book that was wriiten by the first prez of the sussex club in Britain. Definitely a utility breed, for meat primarily, decent layers in their time. I know 3 riverschicks can speak to this far better than I can. BU my impression is that they were a highly sought after table fowl for derby day in England. SO pushed as a winter layer to be ready for the spring day of horse racing.

SS was a meat bird-- pressed for meat production during a time when the current commercial cornishx did not exist. Raised in SE England if I have my geography right. Cool, lots of green pastures. I think of OR as a similar climate.

Math Ace tried many sources, all disappointing, until she bought from either OVerton or the other fellow, sorry drawing a blank. Rietick, something similar. THese were the closed to what she thought the SS should be as a meat bird-- but they need a lot of work. A lot. IF I stay with the SSI hope to add some of her effort into my stock, Or cull my stock . THe latter would be very hard to do as I will have put some work into them.

ANyway-- back tothe book-- this bird took decades to develop. Decades before accepted intot he equivalent of the APA, and then 30 more years. WHat I did determine was that the shoe birds were not the utlity birds. WHat I am not clear about is was the show bird then used on the utility birds. Typically this is the method to alter the native stock to the new breed-- so I wonder if show stock was used on the farm stock. As I said I can only wonder. . . . nothing was specifically said about this.

Yeah it used to be a utility breed-- it is SOP or a layer now though. Can't cross in the other sussex because they were developed separately and grouped together as Sussex. I like them as layers so I start here.

 

[Arielle]

Quote: LOL that is probalby the cause. Corn was not grown in the UK as far as I know when SS developed.

 

[gjensen]

I read the online sussex book that was wriiten by the first prez of the sussex club in Britain. Definitely a utility breed, for meat primarily, decent layers in their time. I know 3 riverschicks can speak to this far better than I can. BU my impression is that they were a highly sought after table fowl for derby day in England. SO pushed as a winter layer to be ready for the spring day of horse racing.

SS was a meat bird-- pressed for meat production during a time when the current commercial cornishx did not exist. Raised in SE England if I have my geography right. Cool, lots of green pastures. I think of OR as a similar climate.

Math Ace tried many sources, all disappointing, until she bought from either OVerton or the other fellow, sorry drawing a blank. Rietick, something similar. THese were the closed to what she thought the SS should be as a meat bird-- but they need a lot of work. A lot. IF I stay with the SSI hope to add some of her effort into my stock, Or cull my stock . THe latter would be very hard to do as I will have put some work into them.

ANyway-- back tothe book-- this bird took decades to develop. Decades before accepted intot he equivalent of the APA, and then 30 more years. WHat I did determine was that the shoe birds were not the utlity birds. WHat I am not clear about is was the show bird then used on the utility birds. Typically this is the method to alter the native stock to the new breed-- so I wonder if show stock was used on the farm stock. As I said I can only wonder. . . . nothing was specifically said about this.

Yeah it used to be a utility breed-- it is SOP or a layer now though. Can't cross in the other sussex because they were developed separately and grouped together as Sussex. I like them as layers so I start here.

Modern Sussex is a re creation of a much older breed.

 

[call ducks]

Quote:
Yes indeed! The Sussex we have today are a entirely different than Sussex, that was more or less a landrace in Sussex, England.

Light coloured sussex (White, and Light) were preferred by farmers and consumers. People must remember the methods farmers had of finish sussex in Sussex, are like the methods the French have for Breese. The way Sussex were bred in their haydey was away that would make most modern show breeders have a heart attack - they were bred like a landfowl with farmers throwing chickens togeather. Sussex got their name because it was a regional chicken... Any ways Sussex have played a large role in poultry history in the UK and Canada - not so much in the US.

I don't breed for show - I don't own an SOP nor do I want to... That being said those that I sell chicks to have own ( just off the top of my head, a pullet took Champ. English at an APA show)