BREEDING FOR PRODUCTION...EGGS AND OR MEAT.

[collie1470]

I know I plan to cross breeds to eventually get to exactly what we want out of our birds. I'll be writing down to ensure things are trending the way I want, since it'll take several generations to get there.

 

[Beekissed]

I didn't say improving oneself was a pissing contest. I'm all about improving a flock and have been working on that for a long time now, but I don't see any worth in posturing about whose a "real" breeder according to some mysterious rule of breeding that dictates that one must write down every time a chicken goes out to free range in order to be considered worth while in their endeavors. It's nice if you want to do it, but one can actually and truly breed one chicken to another and get a good result without jotting down every little fart he let while doing it. Now, whether all the "real" breeders consider that it can be done may be another opinion altogether and they have a right to that opinion...but I don't have to adhere to it. I'm not trying to be a "great" breeder, just simply making improvements in a small way as I enjoy raising chickens.

 

[collie1470]

I said improving for yourself.

You can improve a flock for yourself.

 

[collie1470]

Like I said earlier, whether you write things down or not depends on the person and the end goal.

But to imply writing things down means you're in some big competition is no better than implying not writing things down makes you a hack.

 

[Beekissed]

I agree!

 

[collie1470]

I think it's a lot like the arguments between show/working line dog breeders vs. backyard/hobby breeders :/

 

[collie1470]

Except with dogs, there's the health testing that sets show/working line breeders way ahead.

 

[Beekissed]

I think it's a lot like the arguments between show/working line dog breeders vs. backyard/hobby breeders

That's the thing, though....there shouldn't be any arguments at all. One is a show breeder and all the efforts are geared towards producing dogs fit for show and the other is a small time breeder that breeds a few dogs that are good enough for folks to keep as hunting, herding or pet quality dogs. Never the twain shall meet as they both have a different focus. Comparing the two is futile, so arguing about methods is also futile.

This thread is about breeding for production or meat and isn't even about breeding to SOP or for show. I'd say if one's flock is improving in the areas of more meat and eggs that's good enough to call it an improvement. Some folks just don't see it as this super serious endeavor that requires any argument at all...it's just chickens. Food animals. Shouldn't even garner that much back and forth at all as it's just chickens. It's fun to discuss improving them, but when it gets down to arguing, the fun is sucked right on out of it.

 

[ConPollos]

Hendersons chicken chart has a comparison--The Penedesencas get 4 eggs and the Marans get 3. The Penedesenca eggs are just as dark as Marans--sometimes darker.

Thamks! Now I want some Pendesencas! Lol I bought Welsummers for my dark egg desire, but it would be pretty to have a variety of hues of chocolate eggs. I love Spain too, so that's another excuae to get some Ps.

 

[ConPollos]

This may be of no interest to anyone and it's not about chickens, but maybe something can be gleaned from it.  I worked on a horse farm that decided to do a test.  They gelded a 30 day old colt.  He grew huge.  He was very tall with long muscling.  He never developed the heavy muscle that is so desirable in halter QH's.  Both parents were heavy muscled and large, but he outgrew both in height.  Fast forward and change species.  Rescues start doing pediatric spay/neuters in puppies on a regular basis.  Now we see a relation to early s/n and tall, narrow dogs with long muscling.  I groom an Aussie who was spayed at 4 months.  I know her parents and a sibling who was kept intact.  She's taller than all of them.  She weighs nothing because she is so narrow, even in her head.  She feels like she has no muscle, but she is extremely active, running and herding.  We know now that early s/n is also a factor in increased ligament injuries and tears as well as incontinence problems (I have a rescue, spayed at 10 weeks with incontinence problems and she is also a tall, narrow dog).  Hormones, or lack of, can change so much.

There's basically 2 types of GSD.  German lines and American lines.  So when you talk GSD, the American lines are what you're calling USA bred dogs.  But we have plenty of great German lines in the USA, too.  So please, don't lump them all together as "bad".  Plus, there's some American lines that don't breed for excessive angulation.  They'll never win in the breed ring (whatever!), but they are good working dogs.  They don't have the intense working temperament that the German lines have, so aren't really a good choice for law enforcement work.  But German lines don't always make for good pets, either, unless you are giving them a job. 

I'm glad to hear there are some good GSD lines being bred in America; and you're right, if they're good quality they won't win our nutty USA dog shows.

My vet told me he didn't want to spay or neutered my nine Catahoula mix puppies (I rescued a pregnant mama) until they weren six months old, so I waited till they were five months old, almost six months. I was cutting it close in terms of them just starting to show some amorous intentions, and of course cute ferocity. I was afraid of an accidental breeding, but they all came through it just fine. They're adorable, and now are in their ninth month.

Papa was pure Catahoula, and mama is part. I'm planning to get her DNA tested for $130.00 just out of curiousity. I'm training them all and might just keep them all. They feel like my kids.

My original dog pack that I started in 2000 lived until ages 15 and 16, even the 125 lb one lived to 16. I miss them. But I digress, and I guess my point is I don't care about doggy appearance, just heart and intelligence and ability.