BREEDING FOR PRODUCTION...EGGS AND OR MEAT.

[gevshiba]

OK, so as I think I've shared before, on an impulse, I got 5 Speckled Sussex chicks at the feed store 4 weeks ago. Shouldn't have, but I did, and they're my responsibility to manage now... My intention is to NOT name them, have the pullets as layers for a little while, and then play it from ear from there - if they turn out big enough, I may cross into the NN line. If not, either cull or turn loose and see how well they do as a more free ranging low management group. Cockerels will be eaten.

I have NO idea of their sex. The Cream Legbars I have are auto sexing, and the Naked Necks, while not auto sexing, were pretty easy to sex very early (2-3 weeks) for the vast majority of them (and once Kev shared some coloring tips regarding male vs. female, it was even easier). The New Hampshires have lagged, but I am certain about the sex of them now at 9 weeks (which to me seems late, as I am comparing to the NNs and Cream Legbars).

I just looked up the Specked Sussex "What sex is my chick" threads - I had no idea what sort of drama was involved in waiting to see the gender of these (or some of the other common breeds) for SOOOOOO long - including just waiting to get an an egg!!! I guess I'm just spoiled.

Sooooo, that brings me to my point - that the ability to sex chicks early (either at hatch or early in life) is a production-related characteristic, depending on your management style. I have rather stridently made this point over on the Cream Legbar thread, because the breed was actually developed primarily as an auto sexing breed, yet some breeders/lines are now selecting for subtle pretty feather characteristics to the detriment of auto sexing (and not taking care of the whole package, coloring AND auto sexing, when making their breeding decisions). This is alarming in a new-ish breed where a characteristic like good auto sexing can be lost so quickly. I may have made myself a little bit irritating about it...

What are everyone's thoughts about this?

- Ant Farm

edit to add: I don't think Cream Legbars will win any productivity awards any time soon, I just mean the general concept...

I only have Speckled Sussex and turkeys, so I can't comment on auto sexing or any of those other ways to sex early. But I can say that I'm getting much better at educated guesses. I think the more you get to know your chosen breed, the better you get at *seeing* those characteristics.

 

[Fire Ant Farm]

I only have Speckled Sussex and turkeys, so I can't comment on auto sexing or any of those other ways to sex early. But I can say that I'm getting much better at educated guesses. I think the more you get to know your chosen breed, the better you get at *seeing* those characteristics.

You know, that's a good point. I read a bunch more on the SS sexing, and it seems that once you get the hang of the specifics of body shape, amount of white feathering (including chest), and tail feather development, it gets easier to make an educated guess.

I guess it also depends on what sort of production one is breeding toward - it would be a lot more important to easily identify pullets early if one were totally focused on egg production, whereas I guess if one is also interested in meat, cockerels are just used for meat instead of eggs, but still for "production"... I think egg production is where it is most useful. (Well, that and for unfortunate folks who are not allowed to have roosters to know as soon as possible.)

- Ant Farm

 

[3riverschick]

You know, that's a good point. I read a bunch more on the SS sexing, and it seems that once you get the hang of the specifics of body shape, amount of white feathering (including chest), and tail feather development, it gets easier to make an educated guess.

I guess it also depends on what sort of production one is breeding toward - it would be a lot more important to easily identify pullets early if one were totally focused on egg production, whereas I guess if one is also interested in meat, cockerels are just used for meat instead of eggs, but still for "production"... I think egg production is where it is most useful. (Well, that and for unfortunate folks who are not allowed to have roosters to know as soon as possible.)

- Ant Farm

Hi,
I can do find out the sexes of my chicks three ways. My strains can be feather sexed at hatch thru 4 days old.
Second, the hackle feathers work. Rounded at the ends is a female. Pointed at the ends is Male.
Third is the old metal nut and string method. Some say it is horsefeathers. I don't agree. I saw it work. Amazing. I rehomed 5 cockerels and pullets to a local farmer. Farmer Karl is an old time farmer and when I told him the started birds could have been feather sexed, Karl was not impressed and ordered me to go get a small metal nut ( that wrenches onto a bolt) and a smaller diameter string. I got both and he tied the small nut (sans bolt) onto the string. Then ordered me to watch. Held each chick and held the string over their heads. Now I already knew which was male and female. I watched, fascinated, as the nut began to move, either in a circle over their heads or in a back and forth line over their heads...depending on the sex. Karl nailed it 100% on the corrct sexes. Very impressive.
Best,
Karen

 

[ronott1]

Hi,
I can do find out the sexes of my chicks three ways. My strains can be feather sexed at hatch thru 4 days old.
Second, the hackle feathers work. Rounded at the ends is a female. Pointed at the ends is Male.
Third is the old metal nut and string method. Some say it is horsefeathers. I don't agree. I saw it work. Amazing. I rehomed 5 cockerels and pullets to a local farmer. Farmer Karl is an old time farmer and when I told him the started birds could have been feather sexed, Karl was not impressed and ordered me to go get a small metal nut ( that wrenches onto a bolt) and a smaller diameter string. I got both and he tied the small nut (sans bolt) onto the string. Then ordered me to watch. Held each chick and held the string over their heads. Now I already knew which was male and female. I watched, fascinated, as the nut began to move, either in a circle over their heads or in a back and forth line over their heads...depending on the sex. Karl nailed it 100% on the corrct sexes. Very impressive.
Best,
Karen

What percentage accuracy do you get for feather sexing the chicks?

 

[varidgerunner]

Have seen string and nail used many times accurately, not everyone can do it. Just remember if your mare/ goat, etc. is not pregnant the nail will tell you she is having a girl.

 

[Beer can]

Crazy! You all just want to see how many will try it right? Lol!
Now I can't wait till spring hatch....

 

[DesertChic]

Hi,
I can do find out the sexes of my chicks three ways. My strains can be feather sexed at hatch thru 4 days old.
Second, the hackle feathers work. Rounded at the ends is a female. Pointed at the ends is Male.
Third is the old metal nut and string method. Some say it is horsefeathers. I don't agree. I saw it work. Amazing. I rehomed 5 cockerels and pullets to a local farmer. Farmer Karl is an old time farmer and when I told him the started birds could have been feather sexed, Karl was not impressed and ordered me to go get a small metal nut ( that wrenches onto a bolt) and a smaller diameter string. I got both and he tied the small nut (sans bolt) onto the string. Then ordered me to watch. Held each chick and held the string over their heads. Now I already knew which was male and female. I watched, fascinated, as the nut began to move, either in a circle over their heads or in a back and forth line over their heads...depending on the sex. Karl nailed it 100% on the corrct sexes. Very impressive.
Best,
Karen

I've no doubt I would probably influence the outcome if I did this myself based on my own assumptions. So.....maybe I need to track down Karl to do it for me.

 

[varidgerunner]

If you have "the gift" as Karl apparently did, it works on eggs, too. I've never done it because I always wanted some hens for laying and some roosters for eating. I got 2 out of 2 kids right with nail and string. Back and forth is boy round and round is girl, do it over the belly on a pregnant animal, if it's a boy it will go back and forth and if you swing back to the mom's heart or upturned wrist it will start circling again.

 

[3riverschick]

What percentage accuracy do you get for feather sexing the chicks?

100% It's because they come originally from Canadian pure English strains.
Best,
Karen

 

[jbkirk]

OK, so as I think I've shared before, on an impulse, I got 5 Speckled Sussex chicks at the feed store 4 weeks ago. Shouldn't have, but I did, and they're my responsibility to manage now... My intention is to NOT name them, have the pullets as layers for a little while, and then play it from ear from there - if they turn out big enough, I may cross into the NN line. If not, either cull or turn loose and see how well they do as a more free ranging low management group. Cockerels will be eaten.

I have NO idea of their sex. The Cream Legbars I have are auto sexing, and the Naked Necks, while not auto sexing, were pretty easy to sex very early (2-3 weeks) for the vast majority of them (and once Kev shared some coloring tips regarding male vs. female, it was even easier). The New Hampshires have lagged, but I am certain about the sex of them now at 9 weeks (which to me seems late, as I am comparing to the NNs and Cream Legbars).

I just looked up the Specked Sussex "What sex is my chick" threads - I had no idea what sort of drama was involved in waiting to see the gender of these (or some of the other common breeds) for SOOOOOO long - including just waiting to get an an egg!!! I guess I'm just spoiled.

Sooooo, that brings me to my point - that the ability to sex chicks early (either at hatch or early in life) is a production-related characteristic, depending on your management style. I have rather stridently made this point over on the Cream Legbar thread, because the breed was actually developed primarily as an auto sexing breed, yet some breeders/lines are now selecting for subtle pretty feather characteristics to the detriment of auto sexing (and not taking care of the whole package, coloring AND auto sexing, when making their breeding decisions). This is alarming in a new-ish breed where a characteristic like good auto sexing can be lost so quickly. I may have made myself a little bit irritating about it...

What are everyone's thoughts about this?

- Ant Farm

edit to add: I don't think Cream Legbars will win any productivity awards any time soon, I just mean the general concept...

That is the reason I got some Bielefelders, I wanted to know what my chicks were when they hatched.
Quote: Does anyone know where this practice originated?