BREEDING FOR PRODUCTION...EGGS AND OR MEAT.

[seventreesfarm]

IMO finding good birds is difficult, even SOP birds are too often lacking and do not match what was produced decades ago. My AMs are NOT met birds and my BCM are NOT meat birds. A couple of the SS roosters were better. I figure if only a small percent is kept for breeding or egg laying, than the others better make a good meal or 2 or 3.

Yeah, that's one big thing I don't like about Ams. Too small. They size up ok when crossed with a Marans roo though. I'm planning to 'import' one more batch of hatching eggs before I stop for the season, and hopefully can find some Ams I can use to select for size and still keep the blue egg gene nice and strong. I like the pea comb though, since it's associated with the blue egg gene and helps me narrow down my culling for likely olive-eggers.

I had SS for a while. Hatchery stock, so nowhere near the original breed purpose. Good cold climate birds though, and the cockerels were tasty.

So many variables! Working with a single breed/species definitely cuts down on the mess, but I like the surprise bonuses with my crossbreeds.

I have another hatch coming on the 14th with my new golden cuckoo roo, so I imagine my grow out pens will be very colorful this summer.

 

[bnjrob]

I need to pay attention to the SOP because to make olive eggers I am working with Marans and Ameraucana, and I can't make quality crossbreeds without good original stock. I don't care about show quality, just *good* dependable quality. Can't recall where I read it, but I'm working on the assumption that only about 10% of what I breed will be worth keeping. I also assume that crossbreeding, at least the initial generations, will make selection tougher due to unexpected variability. And there are certain traits from each breed that I want to keep over others. Aaaand I have my own feather preferences I'd like to work towards.

All this, and good egg production too. But since chickens will always be part of my food supply and business enterprise, I might as well enjoy the challenge of seeing if I can get them to do what I have in mind.

I'm glad there are people dedicated to certain breeds, for whatever reason. Even show birds that have lost some of their original purpose need to be there as foundation stock for other people to work back into productive strains, or work into interesting crossbreeding programs.

A friend of mine is doing a little bit with olive eggers with Marans and Ams. It's been challenging for her as well.

We only have one breed, although in different colors including a non-recognized color project. It's a challenge trying to breed to the SOP and still make sure at looking at meat and egg production.

Type, size, and pinched tails are a big priority right now. Egg laying size could improve buy overall laying is good. Breast meat could improve but the older cockerels we've butchered dress out about 5-6 lbs and even have had a runt dress out at about 3 1/2 pounds, so not too bad on meat. But always room for improvement.

With this last year's hatch, I kept a female with the most horrible flopped over comb, but she was the largest of her hatch with good type, excellent pelvic width, started laying sooner than her sisters, and was at the correct weight for the breed. So I'll have a bit of work to counteract that comb of hers in her offspring, but I just couldn't pass up her other good qualities.

We originally had planned just on good all purpose farm birds to meet our food needs and not have to buy chickens again. But then we discovered the need for preservation and decided to take things a step further with having one breed to work on with looking at all aspects including the future of the breed and not just our current food/farm needs. It's definitely a lot more work. But they taste good and we enjoy it.

 

[LindaB220]

OOPS...I missed the part where LindaG200 sought anyone's opinion.

Heck, I just thought she was musing about what she was going to do while enjoying retirement.

One thing that seems to be missing in lots of discussions about chickens and what someone desires in their own breeding program. To me, chickens have a very short shelf-life and if someone crosses two "pure breeds", the effect on either is transitory at most. They mature at a rather young point and live about 1/3rd the span of the average mutt dog and few actual fanciers will be affected by their actions and none will be buying any birds from them.

Enjoy your chickens Linda...I'm enjoying my little meat birds, knowing full well they are doomed to the hatchet.

Thanks Turk, I will enjoy them. I have 20 CX coming on the 16th. They will be 8 days old so I'm not putting them under a lamp. I'm putting them outside with one of the Pseudo brooders like a heat plate. Created by Beekissed. Made with a heating pad and supported with wire. High enough for the babies to stay under at night if needed. Probably won't need it much because I'm in North La and the nights are in the 70's. My coop is in the shady part of the lot.

 

[LindaB220]

Linda, I found this on crossing birds just looking for fun. But is is an experiment by an Agricultural Station in Kansas about how to sex chicks at hatch. I thought it might help some. http://www.ksre.ksu.edu/historicpublications/pubs/SB307.PDF

A great find. Thank you so much. Of course I downloaded it.

 

[chickadoodles]

Your welcome.

 

[colburg]

After our latest fiasco of raising(attempting to raise) 150 CX from a hatchery, we decided to fill the incubator with a few more eggs.

Late last year we drove to Phoenix to pick up some good White Rocks(4 pair) from a fellow at the bird show. We've only raised chickens for almost 2 years and never knew what we were missing. The new White Rocks were amazingly heavy and large for only 7-8 months old. The 4 cockerels averaged about 9.5 lbs each. The hens are also good sized averaging 6lbs each. But one didn't lay at all while we had the breeding pens set up, and one died when she got tangled up between the side of the barn and some hay. Only 2 hens-a-layin wouldn't fill the bator, so we pulled our heaviest hatchery layers and put one of the Rocks over 4 Turkens.

I don't know what color the rock/turken chicks will be, but they are getting large fast. Out of a total of 40 WR eggs set in the bator, 1 hatched(I think the WR's were just too young). 6 out of 21 of the turkens hatched.

The plan is to put breeding pens together in Sept just so we can put some more in the freezer and we need some replacement layers no matter the breed. We'll put the Rocks in one pen in an attempt to get them rolling along and the other pen will have a Rock cock over the Turkens again.

On a side note: One of the Turkens that will not stay with the flock lays every day. She's laid every day for over a month in our Jersey cow's feed trough and we sure wouldn't mind more like her. It'll be interesting to see if she burns out quick and to see how well the WR/T chicks lay and flesh out.

Cheers all,

 

[LindaB220]

After our latest fiasco of raising(attempting to raise) 150 CX from a hatchery, we decided to fill the incubator with a few more eggs.

Late last year we drove to Phoenix to pick up some good White Rocks(4 pair) from a fellow at the bird show. We've only raised chickens for almost 2 years and never knew what we were missing. The new White Rocks were amazingly heavy and large for only 7-8 months old. The 4 cockerels averaged about 9.5 lbs each. The hens are also good sized averaging 6lbs each. But one didn't lay at all while we had the breeding pens set up, and one died when she got tangled up between the side of the barn and some hay. Only 2 hens-a-layin wouldn't fill the bator, so we pulled our heaviest hatchery layers and put one of the Rocks over 4 Turkens.

I don't know what color the rock/turken chicks will be, but they are getting large fast. Out of a total of 40 WR eggs set in the bator, 1 hatched(I think the WR's were just too young). 6 out of 21 of the turkens hatched.

The plan is to put breeding pens together in Sept just so we can put some more in the freezer and we need some replacement layers no matter the breed. We'll put the Rocks in one pen in an attempt to get them rolling along and the other pen will have a Rock cock over the Turkens again.

On a side note: One of the Turkens that will not stay with the flock lays every day. She's laid every day for over a month in our Jersey cow's feed trough and we sure wouldn't mind more like her. It'll be interesting to see if she burns out quick and to see how well the WR/T chicks lay and flesh out.

Cheers all,

That should be quite an interested match. Keep us informed.

 

[Arielle]

Quote: To get the olive eggs I do simple cross marans x EE/Ams. Always get an olive egg that way. Or cross back to a marans, to get a darker olive. I was planning to work a group as you have been working on but just for eggs and in the end decided it was easier to stick with the simple crosses. The marans is a complicated color and really needs two pens to keep the coloring right. THen add on type and improving the meat qualities AND the egg color and decided it was too much o f a head ache . So I admire your effort to continue on!!

 

[Arielle]

Quote: Looks like a great read!! Thanks CHickadoodle for posting it-- love the cover art too. A pen and ink flower.

 

[LindaB220]

Got a note in my mailbox that I had a package waiting. That would be my eggs. They didn't call. So I'll get them in the morning. Really burns me that I didn't check when I drove past at 4pm. Oh well. Live and learn. I found gamebird feed and catfish feed at the feed store. The fish is 32% so I'm trying them both to see what I do best with. Close in price. $18 for gamebird and $17 for catfish feed. I'll do a 4:1 with the layer feed.