BREEDING FOR PRODUCTION...EGGS AND OR MEAT.

[CanadianBuckeye]

I need some advice- the new coop is almost ready and I need to separate out my cockerels from my pullets. This will be a major rodeo. I have a fish net, but is there some way to do this without freaking them out too badly? This will be very stressful for them and I'm a bit worried about injuries. Unfortunately they don't stay quiet when I go in the coop, even when it's dark and they are not roosting at night yet.
There's probably around 45 or so cockerels.

 

[oshun55555]

Not interested in cat kibble?

Usually feather picking is a space issue and birds with nothing better to do than pick at one another....or so I've been told. I've no experience with it at all....many breeds and many birds over the past 40 yrs but have never had a single feather picker, so it could very well be a space issue...I free range and that could be why I've never seen it.

I have been raising chickens about as long as you and only had a picking issue once when I moved to a new place and had to pen them up until I could get a fence up around the 8 acre pasture I have for them, it was not pretty, its a space issue, when you pasture or free range this does not seem to be a problem, as least in my experience.

 

[Beekissed]

Maybe the space issue goes hand in hand with the proper protein availability? Out on range the protein is what suits their natural body needs, so the question of the right kind of protein is solved by free ranging as well.

What I can't get my mind around on the protein issue is that~for some of a particular flock~the proteins fed seemed adequate, as only some of the birds were picking feathers. At that point, it becomes a bird problem and not a flock problem. If most of my flock thrive well on what I'm feeding but I have one or even a few that seem to not do as well on it, my solution is to eliminate the problem of the few and leave the status quo for the whole as is.

Sort of like when folks start feeding more calcium or more protein because they find a soft shelled egg in the nest on a consistent basis....to me that's not a nutritional deficit that needs correcting in the flock but an absorption problem or reproductive disorder of a single bird, so my solution would be to eliminate that bird and leave the feed rations alone.

 

[Molpet]

OK @duluthralphie , this one will get your goat up. I subscribe to a magazine called Backyard Poultry, and they have also an online thing called Countrysidenetwork.com. They have a Countryside living daily stories, etc. This morning, they posted an article called "4 things I learned about growing meat chickens", and it is all the regular horror stories about them laying in their own poop, incapable of free ranging or even moving more than a foot at a time, incapable of crowing, incapable of breeding, yada, yada, yada. I posted a rebuttal this morning in the comments section, but it is still " awaiting moderation".

Made my hackles raise....I left a comment. Doubt if they will post it, though....truth is not exactly in the forefront of their interests, judging from this incredibly ill-informed article.

Originally published in 2014 and I didn't see any comments
http://countrysidenetwork.com/daily/poultry/eggs-meat/lessons-learned-raising-meat-chickens/

 

[lpatelski]

Some of My Buff Plymouth Rocks are 6 weeks now
They have a decent shape but not much weight to them, now at 430g.




They are not in my project plans for next year but possibly later depending how things shape up.

This bird has a nice breast muscle.

 

[lpatelski]

I agree completely, I think chickens definitely need meat and sourced the only feed I could find that has meat protein in it (pork). Although I don't have any idea of the actual % meat in there. I've offered them an expensive cat kibble as well that supposedly has a lot of meat in it too, but they aren't that interested in it. I can get them beef bonemeal, I will add that to their diet.

I know someone commented about superworms carrying botulism. I asked our Shelter Veterinarian whom also happened to be a long time poultry judge. He said the superworms are okay to feed. So I raise and feed them to my hungry stock. I regularly save back the largest superworm stock to create beetles.

Nutritional content of the superworm(Zophobas morio)
Nutritional composition(%) and energy content (Kcal/100g), based on dry matter:

Protein - 43.13-46.79
Fat - 40.80-42.04
Fiber - 9.26-13.00
NFE(Carbohydrates) - 2.61
Energy content(Kcal/100g) - 575.53
Vitamin composition based on dry matter
Vitamin A - 29.16 mcg
Vitamin E - 18.29-32 IU/kg
Vitamin C - 2.85 mg
Vitamin B1 - 0.14 mg
Vitamin B2 - 1.78 mg
Vitamin B3 - 7.67 mg
Vitamin B5 - 4.61
Vitamin B7 - 83.14 mcg
Vitamin B9 - 0.16
Mineral composition(mg/100g) based on dry matter and recommended daily intake for adults(mg/day).
Calcium - 42-120
Potassium - 750.59
Magnesium - 118.29
Phosphorus - 562.95
Sodium - 112.83
Iron - 3.92-5.03
Zinc - 7.29-8.75
Manganese - 0.15-1.02
Copper - 0.86
Selenium - 0.03
Amino acid content (mg/g protein)
Valine - 52.3
Arginine - 48.7
Histidine - 30
Serine - 46.7
Proline - 54.8
Alanine - 72.6
Glycine - 48.2
Glutamic Acid - 122.8
Met + Cys - 18.3
Isoleucine - 47
Leucine - 97
Lysine - 52.3
Phenylalanine - 34.5
Methionine - 10.7
Cysteine - 7.6
Phenylalanine + Tyrosine - 31
Threonine - 39.6
Tryptophan - 9.1
Source for nutritional information:
Rumpold, BA; Schluter, OK. "Nutritional composition and safety aspects
of edible insects." MOLECULAR NUTRITION & FOOD RESEARCH; MAY, 2013; 57; 5; p802-p823

 

[lpatelski]

Ouch.... came home after long weekend to a smelly house... refrig died. Had to toss everything as everything looked and smelled like they were at room temperature(and you know exactly how HOT that is for us lol) for 2 days or so. UGH. You have my sympathies, glad you managed to get some use out of that incident.

I had a feather picking issue in the recent crop of chicks. Due to not having incubator and several different project lines I have to do few but big batches of very different chicks. The "oriental mix" chicks suddenly started to pick at the bigger and much more placid meat mixes.. to the point one died and several had bloodied tails and elbows. They targeted primarily the white chicks, apparently the red shows through their pin feathers just too temptingly.. what I did was separate all the whites and added eggs to chick starter(22%, no animal protein- not my choice! Grr).. basically, wet the mash, break eggs over it and stir. They love it and the picked seemed to stop overnight.. however I noticed all of the chicks from an EE hen were literally hunting for pin feathers- going from chick to chick despite the addition of eggs. So all the EE and oriental mix chicks are now separated from the rest.. chicks are feathering out like crazy, but there is still some evidence of feather picking in the oriental/EE group. To be honest I've thought of culling all of those, even though I love how the adults look. It's so frustrating.

From what I've read, there certainly can be a genetic aspect to feather picking and sure looked like it from the recent experience as the meat mixes are all feathering out really well and fast, did not see any attempt at picking from those- aside from when the oriental/ee were still with them, they did become interested in the bloody tails but not 'hard core'. They seemed to take a bite then go hmm that tastes good.. while the others were like wood peckers, very intense about it too.

Kev from the looks of it you have a severe feather picking issue!

 

[Kev]

Now that you mention it, I've heard a lot of feather picking complaints from people with EE and Ameraucanas. I even know one local breeder who culled all but three of her pure Ameraucanas because they were all feather picking very badly, and one of my most persistent feather pickers was an EE. (The other was a Dorking-mix, but she's just a really nasty bird all the way around.)

Oh really? Appreciate this very much, this sounds a lot like what I'm seeing. The hard core ones were all EE- oriental crosses.... even the orientals stopped picking(I hope, seems that way to me) after eggs were added to their feed.. except for those ee crosses.

Most likely going to cull them all if it;s such a widespread problem.. no desire to introduce a nasty habit into the flock.

 

[Kev]

Kev from the looks of it you have a severe feather picking issue!

alternatively... the ultimate solution to feather picking... no feathers to pick, so....

 

[Kev]

Ugh that's got to be so frustrating and disappointing. I culled a very promising Buckeye pullet for feather picking. Sad, but I just can't have that behavior in my flock. I've noticed that the buff rock chicks, the dark cornish and the barred Hollands never bother the other chicks. the pickers were actively chasing other chicks and pulling feathers. Nasty.

It totally is frustrating. That;s exactly what I see with the ee- oriental chicks.. going from chick then looking very closely around the tail/ and over their backs if the chick is sitting with wings relaxed, grabbing a pin feather then on to the next chick. Non stop. Ugh.

After separating them, did not see any picking amongst the meat mixes, even though they had very exposed pin feathers all over their backs as they recover from the picking issue. I'm pretty convinced it had at least partly a genetic basis in this case.