BREEDING FOR PRODUCTION...EGGS AND OR MEAT.

[Beer can]

Long day yesterday, trying to get down to a more manageable # hoping to get down to just breeding stock soon.
No more red sussex hens or silkies, and four giant cockerels.
12 down. 'Resting' in spare fridge.

 

[3riverschick]

Do commercial meaties really need more meat on their breasts? Lately the commercial chickens at the grocery store seem to be all freakishly large breast, legs and wings have almost disappeared :-\ bad news for a dark meat lover like myself.
I'm definitely going to start adding food to the hatcher though- there are clearly other benefits.

I wasn't thnking of the commercial birds, I was thinking of the large fowl heritage breeds .
I watched for a decade as the Marans folk worked to add more meat to their strains.
Some were willowy. They have made a great amount of progress. What if we could use nutrigenomics and epigenetics to accomplish the same thing in less time. Sorta give Mother Nature a hand. And give an extra tool to novice breeders.
Plus, if the big hatcheries end up utilizing these methods, think of the advantage to folk who buy shipped chicks! They could withstand the 48 hour period without going into starvation mode. The effects of shipping would be decreased. And perhaps the birds themselves would come closer to reaching their genetic potential.
epigenetics nutrigenomics
Best,
Karen

 

[ronott1]

I wasn't thnking of the commercial birds, I was thinking of the large fowl heritage breeds .
I watched for a decade as the Marans folk worked to add more meat to their strains.
Some were willowy. They have made a great amount of progress. What if we could use nutrigenomics and epigenetics to accomplish the same thing in less time. Sorta give Mother Nature a hand. And give an extra tool to novice breeders.
Plus, if the big hatcheries end up utilizing these methods, think of the advantage to folk who buy shipped chicks! They could withstand the 48 hour period without going into starvation mode. The effects of shipping would be decreased. And perhaps the birds themselves would come closer to reaching their genetic potential.
epigenetics nutrigenomics
Best,
Karen

If you pump up a chicken and make it grow more meat because of feeding methods, that will not change the genetics. The next generation would need to be on the new feed to get more meat or it will go back to scrawny.

The famous example is if you cut off a mouses leg, the missing leg will not be passed on to the offspring. The same is true with chickens. If you pluck the tail feather off of a cock bird and the hen, the next generation of chickens will have the tail feathers back.

You could possible select for chickens that respond better to the feed program though. That might make them less of something that Preppers would want.

 

[bnjrob]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Beer can

Long day yesterday, trying to get down to a more manageable # hoping to get down to just breeding stock soon.
No more red sussex hens or silkies, and four giant cockerels.
12 down. 'Resting' in spare fridge.


Makes me tired thinking of doing that many birds at once.

 

[CanadianBuckeye]

I wasn't thnking of the commercial birds, I was thinking of the large fowl heritage breeds .
I watched for a decade as the Marans folk worked to add more meat to their strains.
Some were willowy. They have made a great amount of progress. What if we could use nutrigenomics and epigenetics to accomplish the same thing in less time. Sorta give Mother Nature a hand. And give an extra tool to novice breeders.
Plus, if the big hatcheries end up utilizing these methods, think of the advantage to folk who buy shipped chicks! They could withstand the 48 hour period without going into starvation mode. The effects of shipping would be decreased. And perhaps the birds themselves would come closer to reaching their genetic potential.
epigenetics nutrigenomics
Best,
Karen

I can see how this would be a very good thing for shipped hatchery chicks. And of course it would benefit all chickens to give the chicks a head start.

 

[3riverschick]

If you pump up a chicken and make it grow more meat because of feeding methods, that will not change the genetics. The next generation would need to be on the new feed to get more meat or it will go back to scrawny.

The famous example is if you cut off a mouses leg, the missing leg will not be passed on to the offspring. The same is true with chickens. If you pluck the tail feather off of a cock bird and the hen, the next generation of chickens will have the tail feathers back.

You could possible select for chickens that respond better to the feed program though. That might make them less of something that Preppers would want.

From what I am reading of the epigenetics of all this... feeding the chick in ovo ( in the egg) creates an epigenetic change ( a change in phenotype not related to the genotype) which can be passed on down to the next generation. I remain open to the fact I may have interpreted wrongly, but that's how I read the studies. Here are a couple:.. it's easier to just post the URL to the BYC thread. There are only 3 posts on it. oops, the URL's are at the top of this post.
Karen
epigenetics nutrigenomics

 

[ronott1]

From what I am reading of the epigenetics of all this... feeding the chick in ovo ( in the egg) creates an epigenetic change ( a change in phenotype not related to the genotype) which can be passed on down to the next generation. I remain open to the fact I may have interpreted wrongly, but that's how I read the studies. Here are a couple:.. it's easier to just post the URL to the BYC thread. There are only 3 posts on it. oops, the URL's are at the top of this post.
Karen
epigenetics nutrigenomics

Is that current science? It does not change genes to do this--same as humans. Within one generation of not using the feed, they will be right back to what they were.

It is not permanent.

 

[Beer can]

Makes me tired thinking of doing that many birds at once. 

Skipped lunch, dw wanted me to quit and eat diner, nope, not feeding them anymore, set out to do twelve and not stopping till I'm done or I might put it off again. Thought I was going pretty quick, took forever anyway..
Still want to cut down on NN pullet #s, and have a giant/polish cross cockerel and two giant/silkie pullets I don't want, kids think they are theirs though so I'm going to 'give them away' while they are at school. Only ones I'm keeping of nonbreeding stock is five EEgrs easy to pick their eggs out though Lol.
Saved time by skinning, even the silkies. They wern't as black under the skin, gray with some black in the legs, breasts were not dark. Heart, gizzards and crops were blackish, weird the bb size eggs and ovary were black, looked like caviar.

 

[3riverschick]

Is that current science? It does not change genes to do this--same as humans. Within one generation of not using the feed, they will be right back to what they were.

It is not permanent.

 

[Kassaundra]

I have a question about an injury to a chick it has graphic pics so I am putting it in the spoiler underneath.

My 1.5 week old chick injured itself, shattering the larger wing bone entirely and completely exposing the smaller wing bone still intact. The wing was still attatched by flesh, which I severed and removed. It had already started to discolor and get mushy, but still had some blood flow and had not become necrotic yet. The chick is still very active, alert, eating and pooping, running around w/ it's hatch mates and mom. My question is what to do if anything w/ the two bones, the one that is shattered and jagged, as well as the one that is in tact.

small inner circle is the jagged bone end, the larger circle shows the wing nub w/ some swelling, not sure if it is infection starting or just from the trauma.



here is the in tact wing bone



short circle is the jagged bone, long circle is the in tact bone



showing he is bright and alert this is 12+ hours after the event.



again showing both bones. The wet is vetricyn spray.


The severed wing.