breeding project - chicks that can take the heat and keep foraging

[saladin]

I free-range (literally: no fence at all) my stags from 12 weeks of age until they are between 10 and 14 months of age. You can't do it on the amount of feed you stated: nowhere close. There are times I'll have up to 50 stags running loose and they eat around 7 lbs of feed per day: which is very, very little feed.

Most of the breeds on you list would not work well. In addition, I would not choose any of the breeds you chose other than the Leghorn.

To the Leghorn, I would add:

Games
White Faced Black Spanish
Cubalaya


(For the egg laying project only).


No offense, but I really do agree with the poster that said this has been done before. There is nothing wrong with you doing it, but the other poster was just asking, 'Why re-invent the wheel?'

But if you want to you need to stay away from English and Continental Breeds. Stick with the Med. Class, Games and the Cubalaya. You need heat-tolerant birds.

Understand though that any chicken left in the Southern sun for 30 minutes in the midst of July will be DEAD.

 

[galanie]

I would strike Orpingtons off that list. While I and many others do raise them in the heat and humidity similar to Florida, they don't have the heat hardiness or efficiency you want. It does take some extra work to make sure they don't suffer too horribly in 100+ weather and they tend to get a lot of fat on them.

 

[rebel yell]

The Delaware is the most forageing bird I have, they are the first to be out in the yard & the last to go in at night, I dont know about 1 bird suriveing on 25lbs. of feed a year, but far as the bread I love them, just my input, take it as you wish.

 

[purposefully]

Quote:
I'm quoting you this time, though I'll try to respond to everyone again:

So, you have 65ish chickens and go through about 45lbs of feed+oats per week. That's about .7lbs per chicken per week, or .1 per day, or about 36lbs per year. I've said that I want to use 25 lbs of commercial feed and 25 lbs of sprouted grain plus supplemental protein from roaches. I guess I'm not following on why this isn't a goal worth working towards. I was under the impression that sprouted grain is far more bioavailable than regular grain... I'm actually willing to feed more sprouted grain, but I'm fairly dead set on minimizing how much I need to buy from 'off the farm' - including / especially feed, because organic feed is expensive!

And then (yay!) there's the same info from Saladin, with different numbers: 50 chickens / 49lbs per week = 1lb per chicken per week, or .15lbs per day, or about 53lbs per year - right on par with my 25+25, I thought. Unless I'm really off about sprouted grain, anyway...


Again, I'm not trying to create a new breed, I'm trying to find a way to hatch my own hybrid crosses. If I had access to recent studies, I could see exactly how the different (common, anyway) breeds respond to cross breeding in terms of hybrid vigor - but I don't. I have to say, I hoped someone would laugh at me doing all this research and point me towards some school that has done extensive hybrid vigor research. I'm stuck using 1940s research - those birds really don't exist anymore. I will, eventually, get access, but in the meantime I do what I can with less rigorous methods.


PS - I have two completely unrelated bachelors degrees and it's long since been time to get a masters. Neither of my degrees have anything to do with agriculture, but I've been seriously considering getting a masters in project management and using a self sustaining farm as my major research project. Saladin and kfacres, I would happily pay you (or buy you pretty peeping things) to be able to pick your brain for a while - mind if I PM you?

 

[gallorojo]

Sure it's a goal worth working for, I'm not saying I'm against your stated purpose at all.

As for my numbers, keep in mind that I will have no free range in 2 months, but, way less birds, so, feed costs do vary for month to month.

My pesonal opinion is you can raise them with no feed at all in the spring summer and fall, and keep them alive on minimal rations over the winter. This is how things are done in many parts of the world, and, how they used to be everywhere. Your production will drop back dramatically, however. What it all comes down to is what your goals are and what you are willing to live with. I do my best to produce as much food as I can for them, and I have posted about some good ideas on here before. Lots of people have posted lots of info on this sort of thing. Many people on here would never do things my way, too much predator risk, not maximizing growth and egg rate, etc. My way works for me, so, if want to start your project, go for it.
Just stay away from the heavy breeds. Seriously. They will not take the heat and they will not forage anything like a light breed. Saladin has given you great suggesstions on breeds.

 

[purposefully]

and, of course, I neglected to respond to the rest:

@skylinepoultry - they've been added to my list of breeds to research, but I'm wondering how they'd feel about 80-100 degrees for several months. They sure are beautiful, though!

@galanie - Opringtons were one of the breeds that would have been knocked off my list by the mother earth survey, but were listed because I found several people saying they thrived for them in Florida. I admit I haven't really considered them, even as one of my parent breeds for broilers.

@rebel yell - I do like the Delaware, a lot - I'm torn between that and the RIR, and always end up leaning towards the RIR for their laying capabilities. How have your Delawares laid?

 

[skylinepoultry]

Quote:
My EO's tackled the hot weather better than any of my breeds this year. When the other ones were in shade the EO's were foraging in the open sun in the fields. They are a spanish breed if that helps any.

 

[kfacres]

i don't know if the sprouted grain idea will actually do you any good. by that point in time, the grain will have lost it's nutritional advantages, and just be like green fodder..

my degrees in animal sciences and forestry... and minors in natural resources and conservation... don't do much either...

pm away with questions...I'll do my best to hlep.

 

[purposefully]

Well, I certainly wouldn't be growing my sprouted grains all the way to shoots - probably a 24 hour sprouting cycle, as I use when I make bread.


These studies are from Canada, and appear to prove that grains that are a little sprouted don't hurt any, and might help a very little.

https://www.gov.mb.ca/agriculture/livestock/nutrition/bza21s05.html
https://www.gov.mb.ca/agriculture/livestock/nutrition/bza17s01.html


This is another Canadian study looking at barley instead of wheat, but Table 3 seems to imply that sprouting minimally (1 day) results in a significant benefit in chickens (~30%!) but longer term sprouting reduces the amount of energy that can be obtained from the grain.

http://www.sproutnet.com/Nutrition/Research/feeding_value_of_hydroponically.pdf

I'd welcome more recent / additional studies, of course.


Again, I'm quite content to feed them more, but I really do want to eventually only have to buy high protein feed in bulk, for chicks and about half of the feeding of layers. I want the remainder to be something that I could produce on my farm - even if I choose not to do so for economics reasons. Using sprouted grain (or soaked, which may be a more appropriate term) would keep me from having to use milled wheat, and it's definitely something I want to work towards.

 

[kfacres]

personally, as a time consumer, and ease of work (and much cheaper)... you'd be better of focusing your efforts towards feeding and buying byproduct, and coproduct type feeds-- if you're not feeding them right now. I've done quite extensive research on feeding them to all kinds of livestock and poultry.. and believe that I have a mixture that's pretty much as cheap, and high quality as one could be... It's 19-20% CP, depending on what numbers you use to calculate...

I don't know about your animals, but our livestock won't eat soggy grain-- not of any species. The cows will eat slightly soggy stuff, but only the tops of buckets wetted for long travel to keep it from blowing out the back of the truck. The thing about soggy grain, unless they eat it ASAP, then it'll be wasted... and if you're free ranging, they'll honestly not have a reason to eat something that'll be just as available outside.