Broody bleeding from nostrils, very pale, won't eat - please help me

[caralouise1974]

I'm really concerned about our broody.

She has lost a huge amount of weight since going broody (nine weeks ago, the last three of which were actually spent sitting on eggs) and her comb is very pale. She's now got one chick and things have got even worse - she spends all her time feeding it instead of herself. Her crop is almost completely empty.

Then today, I find her with blood coming from her nostrils and I'm certain I found some mites in her bedding tonight. I've changed the bedding and dusted the house quickly down before putting in fresh stuff, but as it's 8.30pm now, I don't want to start spraying the house etc, especially as she has a chick and they are settled for the night. I plan to dust her (and the chick?) tomorrow and put some Ivermectin pour-on drops on her, and disinfect the house totally.

I really need to get to the bottom of her problems and get her well again, and need advice as follows:

1. How do I get her to eat, instead of simply breaking up the food and giving it to the chick? I'm tempted to take the chick away from her, if it is the only way to get her well again. Would this work or would she pine and mope about even more?
2. Would mites also cause her to be so thin? If I got rid of the mites would her condition improve and would she go back to eating again?
3. Why is she bleeding from her nostrils? This is really concerning me.

I'm so terribly worried about her. Please help.

 

[Judy]

I have no idea why she's bleeding, but suppose it could be because she is so malnourished; I have occasionally seen this in starved people, perhaps from a vitamin deficiency. I'd certainly add vitamins to anything I could get into her.

For sure you must find a way to get her to eat. Perhaps holding or even hiding the chick for a few minutes would encourage her. That instinct to feed the chick rather than herself is so strong, though. I hate to see a baby taken from its mama but you may have to. She will mourn and hunt but hopefully not for long, especially if she cannot see or hear the chick. Might even be able to return the chick to her in a day or two if you can get her eating. Certainly you're going to have to get some nourishment into her. You may find yourself mixing up food so you can roll it into a little ball and poking it at her. Have you tried mixing up sort of a wet mash of favorites, maybe oatmeal or even her feed with a bit of yogurt, hard boiled egg, applesauce, whatever she likes?

Mites can make them seriously ill, can even kill, if the infestation is serious enough.

Don't see why you need to dust AND do the ivermectin, at least not immediately. What kind of dust do you guys have over there for mites and lice? If it is a permethrin or pyrethrin, it will do the trick. And yes, dust the chick, too. Have no idea about putting ivermectin on a chick.

 

[caralouise1974]

Thanks for the advice ddawn. I will definitely try holding the chick out of her sight when feeding her - I have to say that after dark tonight, when the chick was hidden underneath her, I did get her to eat a slug I found by the coop, and she does seem to pick at food once the chick has finished with it, so your suggestion would definitely seem to be very astute.

I have been offering all her favourites, scrambled egg, bread soaked in olive oil, sunflower seeds, and she looks right through them all. It's completely bizarre. I haven't yet tried the wet mash, as I was worried that making up a mash from her layer food would be dangerous for the chick, although I suppose I could make up a mash from the chick crumbs instead. I may get DH to go to the fishing tackle shop and buy some maggots tomorrow, as she always used to love them and it now seems that she will eat 'live' food. I'll make sure the chick is out of sight and hopefully she'll eat.

I've been keeping her and the chick in a run (on advice that the chick might get chilled in the wet grass), while our other hen free ranges, and it has just occured to me that maybe she wasn't actually bleeding from the nostrils, rather that she had damaged her face around the nostrils and that was what was bleeding... from poking her beak through the wire mesh of the run to try and get out to her pal/peck at the greenery. Might a bit of exercise and a trot around the garden give her her appetite back if I were to let them out for a while tomorrow? I could also dig up some worms and bugs to encourage her to eat. Would the chick be okay if it got a bit damp out there?

I didn't want to take any chances with Henny and the mites, but if you think that dusting alone will do the trick for her/the chick/the housing, then that's what I will do. Just wanted to use the Ivermec to be certain. This is the product I use: http://www.gardenfeathers.co.uk/barrier-red-mite-powder-500g_p31.aspx Not sure of exact ingredients, but it is the most widely sold red mite powder over here, so I assume must be pretty effective.

Thanks again for all the advice

 

[Judy]

Your thought about her poking her beak through wire mesh really struck me as a good possibility for the bleeding.

Don't know what to make of the powder; glad it is widely used. I'd still dust the chick, too, and dust again, in case it doesn't kill hatching eggs. Or use ivermectin as well, if you wish, and know how much to put on the chick. Ivermetin is supposed to be a relatively benign drug.

Yes, I would trust her to take care of her chick, and let her run where she wanted. Maybe the freedom to do as she wants will help her begin eating better.

Best of luck! And let us know.

 

[caralouise1974]

Right. Have done all the dusting and disinfecting.

Henny Penny is still refusing to eat unless the chick is completely out of sight, or if it turns its nose up at something, or if something is clearly too big for it to manage. Her crop os completely empty, still, and its 4pm. I just saw her do a poop and it was a pitiful squit of green. There's clearly nothing in this hen's tummy. I'm worried she's not long for this world.

Stuill, that's her lookout. I can't force it down her. It's amazing that she's refusing mealworms, wet mash, boiled egg and sunflower seeds. I can't do anything more for her I'm afraid.

Fingers crossed she'll make it.

How long till she stops being so protective and feeding ths chick? Does it get better after a couple of weeks when it can forage a little for itself?

 

[robin416]

Having left this bird broody for so long the chances are it will not recover.

It is time to get serious about it, start offering things like cooked oatmeal, her feed mixed with water. You are going to have to nag her. Offer her some fish that has been boiled, beef that has no added ingredients. Cook some pasta and mix it with the fish or beef. You need to pack in the calories and any vitamins you can get in to her now while she's still trying to care for her chick.

 

[Judy]

I have a mama who is raising 3 chicks, who are now about 5 weeks old. She still offers them the bits of food and waits. I id notice in just the last day or two she's starting to wolf things down herself while they are still eating. Four weeks is probably an average length of time that they mother, but like so many other things, it varies a lot.

If she'll eat when the chick is out of sight, why not remove the chick for, say, 30 minutes, 3 or 4 times a day?

 

[caralouise1974]

Quote:
I think this would be the last ditch solution, but being at home all day with a newborn baby (who suffers with colic and won't be put down), I'm not sure I'll be able to manage to get out to the coop that many times a day, in all truth. I will of course do everything I can for her but I fear I can only spread myself so thinly...

I feel sick at the thought we're going to lose her

 

[caralouise1974]

A friend suggested giving her some aloe vera juice, administered by syringe. This might apparently give her the boost she needs to start looking after herself again.

Anyone got any ideas about dose/frequency?

I'm considering force feeding her every evening from now on - taking her into the house and leaving the chick safely in the closed coop. Would that be a good idea?

 

[caralouise1974]

She's definitely bleeding from the nostrils, and I've just read that this can be a sign of severe anaemia. She's been completely sucked dry by those mites hasn't she? Oh my God, I feel sick with guilt that I never noticed before the chicks hatched. I just left her on the nest, afraid to disturb her and the eggs. I'd even given the coop a full disinfecting and dusting down for mites and lice just before I set her on the eggs, so I never imagined a severe problem would have managed to develop in those 21 days.

She is ravenously eating grass/clover, but only that - could this be a sign that she knows she needs vitamins? Do we think I might be able to shove more iron into her through some spinach or broccoli, if she'll take some?

It's weird. She isn't acting weak - she's scratching around, eating clover, preening, and flapping and trotting along with the chick as if nothing's wrong. She had a lovely long dustbath with her pal Bella yesterday too. She's just incredibly thin and won't eat. I can't fathom it at all. It's as if she doesn't realise how gravely ill she is.

How can I get more iron into her and get her platelet count back up? Should I take the chick away? I really don't care what happens to it, if I'm honest (I'll give it to the local fowl trust centre. They would be happy to take it), I just want my Henny back.