Building A Broiler

[trescloudy]

They say that today's broilers are developed from 4 different varieties. They cross 2 varieties and 2 other varieties initially creating 2 separate hybrids then again cross those 2 hybrids to make what the industry calls an F2 hybrid.

If you were to choose 4 varieties to make a broiler which would you choose and why?

You can choose more if you wish, just explain why you prefer each variety for the cross.

I'll go first:

1. Wyandotte - Super meaty bird that can tolerate our cold winters in Michigan. I also believe this variety is basically the "improved" Dorking which was also known for having excellent quality meat.

2. Barred Rock - another very meaty bird with excellent shape well known for being a heavy variety. I believe the industry uses Barred Rocks in their CXs.

3. New Hampshires - were once used as broilers because of their quick growth. Seems like they could help with creating a fast growing hybrid.

4. American Bresse - A new bird on the scene but supposed to be excellent flavored and textured. I just started raising these because of that reason. They are supposed to be excellent foragers also and I'm witnessing that behavior already in my 6 week old chicks.

I think all 4 varieties are nice sturdy dual purpose breeds that could make an excellent meat variety. I'm hoping to actually try it someday.

 

[Compost King]

1 Cornish (large breasts)
2. Egyptian Fayoumis (rapid development, people will mock it but I don't mind them not understanding that speed is more important than size with meat birds)
3. Dorking (Deep Keel allowing for more meat production)
4. Buckeye (American Pride)

 

[Ridgerunner]

They say that today's broilers are developed from 4 different varieties.

That's not quite correct. Today's broilers were developed by selectively breeding certain varieties and crosses, not just by crossing certain breeds. Selective breeding was the key but starting with good stock is important.

If i had to choose four breeds to use to develop a meat chicken that I could hatch their eggs, and eliminating Cornish X and the Rangers,

I'd try to find Delaware and New Hampshire that someone is breeding for meat qualities. There is a huge difference in hatchery birds and the birds that a breeder can develop if those are his goals and he/she knows what they are doing. Delaware and New Hampshire were two of the breeds that formed the backbone of the USA commercial meat industry before the Cornish X took over.

I'd want a White Rock also bred for meat production. Certain strains of White Rock were also part of the commercial industry before the Cornish X took over. The reason I separate them is that I would breed the final product to be white. The Buff of the New Hampshire wouldn't be bad but you get a prettier carcass if you pluck with a white or buff bird.

My fourth would be a true Cornish for the larger breast, again from a breeder that was breeding for meat qualities.

If Rangers were allowed I'd substitute them for the Cornish. A lot if selective breeding has already been done.

2. Egyptian Fayoumis (rapid development, people will mock it but I don't mind them not understanding that speed is more important than size with meat birds)

I agree with speed being important but I think I could handle that with selective breeding. How you want to raise them might factor into some of these decisions too.

 

[trescloudy]

1 Cornish (large breasts)
2. Egyptian Fayoumis (rapid development, people will mock it but I don't mind them not understanding that speed is more important than size with meat birds)
3. Dorking (Deep Keel allowing for more meat production)
4. Buckeye (American Pride)

Nice selections. Which would you try breeding to the Cornish? I think it would be cool to take the Cornish to the Dorking. What are your thoughts?

I've definitely thought about using Dorkings, Buckeyes and Cornish for meat crosses.

I chose Wyandottes because I think they are a much better maintained variety than Dorkings. I've had white and black Dorkings although the black couldn't shine a light to my whites neither could shine a light to the old world description. But if I had an actual well kept Dorking I would select that over a Wyandotte.

Have to start somewhere though.

 

[Compost King]

Nice selections. Which would you try breeding to the Cornish? I think it would be cool to take the Cornish to the Dorking. What are your thoughts?

I've definitely thought about using Dorkings, Buckeyes and Cornish for meat crosses.

I chose Wyandottes because I think they are a much better maintained variety than Dorkings. I've had white and black Dorkings although the black couldn't shine a light to my whites neither could shine a light to the old world description. But if I had an actual well kept Dorking I would select that over a Wyandotte.

Have to start somewhere though.

The Dorkings I had struggled to survive if I bred Dorking to Dorking, but when I Cross bred them I had great results as far as making a meat bird. I crossed mine to Red Rangers. The deepest Keel of any cross I had with the Red Rangers. The Breast meat didn't look large until I removed it from the bone and it was deep. Buckeye I just picked randomly between 3 birds, Buckeyes, Delawares, New Hampshires. I could pick any one of the 3. Cornish because that a great base for any white meat loving chicken eater. I would never do this experiment unless it was a last resort to get a decent meat bird. projects like this need serious selective breeding and much of which would take up an awful lot of space. I just prefer to take the existing Hybrid females and put a heritage rooster over them. Maybe just take 2 different meat hybrids in existence and cross those. Red Rangers over CX seem like a good cross to me. A heritage breed I would consider in a group of 4 would Naked Necks because they have less feathers. I might had included them if I thought of them in my first post on this thread.

 

[trescloudy]

That's not quite correct. Today's broilers were developed by selectively breeding certain varieties and crosses, not just by crossing certain breeds. Selective breeding was the key but starting with good stock is important.

If i had to choose four breeds to use to develop a meat chicken that I could hatch their eggs, and eliminating Cornish X and the Rangers,

I'd try to find Delaware and New Hampshire that someone is breeding for meat qualities. There is a huge difference in hatchery birds and the birds that a breeder can develop if those are his goals and he/she knows what they are doing. Delaware and New Hampshire were two of the breeds that formed the backbone of the USA commercial meat industry before the Cornish X took over.

I'd want a White Rock also bred for meat production. Certain strains of White Rock were also part of the commercial industry before the Cornish X took over. The reason I separate them is that I would breed the final product to be white. The Buff of the New Hampshire wouldn't be bad but you get a prettier carcass if you pluck with a white or buff bird.

My fourth would be a true Cornish for the larger breast, again from a breeder that was breeding for meat qualities.

If Rangers were allowed I'd substitute them for the Cornish. A lot if selective breeding has already been done.



I agree with speed being important but I think I could handle that with selective breeding. How you want to raise them might factor into some of these decisions too.

Oh, I understand that the industry has intensively bred the strains they use to make the CXs. According to the industry the final result is an "F2 hybrid" which means they used 2 hybrids to create their final product.

Exactly how true that is.... I dont know for sure but it makes sense.

So I'm talking about starting stock knowing each line would need to be worked toward being meaty to some degree. Some more than others depending on the quality of the stock started with.

That's partly why I selected the 4 varieties I chose. I think most wouldnt need as much work as they are all still fairly common varieties.

 

[trescloudy]

The Dorkings I had struggled to survive if I bred Dorking to Dorking, but when I Cross bred them I had great results as far as making a meat bird. I crossed mine to Red Rangers. The deepest Keel of any cross I had with the Red Rangers. The Breast meat didn't look large until I removed it from the bone and it was deep. Buckeye I just picked randomly between 3 birds, Buckeyes, Delawares, New Hampshires. I could pick any one of the 3. Cornish because that a great base for any white meat loving chicken eater. I would never do this experiment unless it was a last resort to get a decent meat bird. projects like this need serious selective breeding and much of which would take up an awful lot of space. I just prefer to take the existing Hybrid females and put a heritage rooster over them. Maybe just take 2 different meat hybrids in existence and cross those. Red Rangers over CX seem like a good cross to me. A heritage breed I would consider in a group of 4 would Naked Necks because they have less feathers. I might had included them if I thought of them in my first post on this thread.

Dorkings have excellent shape and are great birds but I feel the Wyandottes are basically the same bird but easier to find a good example of the same basic breed.

Short legs, great winter layers, mellow, rose comb, same shape. I think Wyandottes even have an extra toe?

 

[Ruthster55]

1. Giant Naked Neck —— Buff (never seen white)
2. White Rock — — already in CX
3. Bresse
4. Black Copper Marans heavily selected for size

Maybe let an Aseel rooster into the pens with hens once in a while.

 

[trescloudy]

1. Giant Naked Neck —— Buff (never seen white)
2. White Rock — — already in CX
3. Bresse
4. Black Copper Marans heavily selected for size

Maybe let an Aseel rooster into the pens with hens once in a while.

Nice choices. I like the idea of Naked Neck birds being used in a farmyard broiler breeding project. Would help when its butcher day. Heads come detached easier and less plucking. I wonder if we could breed them to become even more naked. I could see an issue with naked birds in a commercial set up or even in a dirty farm set up. Just means the birds would be raised in better conditions though.

I need to learn more about Marans but like your choice of Bresse also. In fact I like all your choices. I'm going to go read up on Marans now.

Thanks for your input and help with making this fun.