Can an old foot injury make your chicken more prone to frost bite? (Photos)

[Bogtown Chick]

Day 9 of this whole ordeal and I see some real progress with Roger's circulation!

 

[shell3]

Thats looking better i think, as i say hard to tell little improvements from photos but to me it looks like the swelling has reduced some. and colour is looking a little better not huge change but i would think youve kept infection under control well or we would being seeing a lot of deteriation.
i agree you might get some skin dying off that needs removing but thats a normal part of healing,when on holiday last year my son got an infection in his finger it looked really serious swollen red and leaky! i washed and applied ointment and by the next day it looked so much better but the skin peeled off completely, it was really strange but the skin underneath was healthy. not really relevant i know but but just saying i wouldnt be worried about a bit of skin dying off.
i like your thinking on the asparin, it makes sense that it could improve blood flow to that toe, and if not he is more comfortable so cant hurt to try it.
glad to hear his going about his normal chickeny bussiness, its probly fair to say we are more upset by his toe than he is lol
also glad he was a good boy in his epsom salt bath! makes it so much easier when the cooperate!!
Your doing such a great job, i feel really positive for that toe

 

[Bogtown Chick]

temperatures were REALLY nice the last two days upper 20's F and Lower 30's f. So the weather cooperated and maybe allowed for some thawing of the toe. LOL. IDK. Deep Freeze starts again tonight but for only 2 days. Warm up for the weekend again. We can do it! Don't like it--but it should be manageable.

I'm just relieved to see the pink sneak further down the toe. I think things are happening down there too now as I did see more drainage on the bandage today. Clear yellow good stuff. Nothing resembling pus. I think this bump on the first knuckle is a more recent injury that swelled up and then opened up in that particular spot. Then froze. I guess it don't really matter now but I guess part of the treatment process is knowing what sort of injury your dealing with and if it's a chronic problem or something that will heal and I'll be done with it thereafter.

. Latter of course is what I hope for.

We've got Company coming from Chicago. Dear dear family on my husband's side. It's going to be busy around here. We're all in an Ice Bocce Tournament saturday. Sorta thing that redneck hillbillies do around here to break up the winter. It's such a fun event. So I'll do my best with updates but it may be quiet from my end. OR Maybe not...so addicted to chickens!

THANK YOU SHELL!

 

[Bogtown Chick]

A colder day for us again today. Hi was 9 degrees Fahrenheit. The chickens enjoyed their run most of the day. I have plastic up on their North and West side of the Run to block the wind. It was still a little bit tougher on Roger. I found him after work with the bandage off the toe but still wrapped around his ankle. There is some degrading of tissue on the other side of the toe as well (smaller ulceration) I imagine there will be peeling of skin around the first knuckle as a whole. So I'm not totally surprised to see more sloughing of tissue. Also his comb seemed very cold and frozen at the tips again. There is some pockets of fluid on the comb from other freezing and I think this wet tissue just compounds the problems. I cleaned this up as much as he'd let me and put antibiotic ointment on this too.

He tolerated his foot bath in epsom salts and took his aspirin. wrapped him up again and he perched between his high hens, Sunny and Holly. Tonight we'll be sub zero again and -25 degrees F for thursday. I put the heat lamp back in the coop and they'll be in there tomorrow for the day. The uninsulated coop maintains usually from -5 to 10 degrees at roost level when this cold and with a heat lamp. So my winterized birds, still really are cool in their coop. I've decided that 0 is my threshold for temps. 1 degree and above they can go outside in the run. Anything lower than 0 takes a toll on my birds. I watch them shift on their feet (to keep warm) or they just plain stay in their coop anyways, even with the popdoor open. I give them BOSS to dig around in their pine shavings or mealies or spinach and cabbage. We make those cold days in the coop worth it a bit. I aim to please, and try to keep things from getting too boring.


Mr. Tootsie soaking his tootsies. And having some cottage cheese. Big spoiled baby.

 

[shell3]

lovely photo!! his georgeous.
your weathers a total nightmare!! poor you
glad his letting you bathe it it makes it so hard when they wont cooperate. skin peeling is hopefully healing process. youve done well keeping bandages on so well dont be put off by the odd slip just clean and start over. his happy and lively so all very good signs. hows the colour coming since the asparin? any change? xx

 

[Bogtown Chick]

Thank you Shell: There was no change in color from the Day before, maybe a little whiter. Maybe not.

.

He's doing well with the baths, but when he's done with cottage cheese he hops himself out and craps on my counter. He's getting too comfortable now in the house. LOL. seriously. first few times I've brought him in he squatted for 1/2 hour submissive (scared) not one pooh. He was feisty again last night. My daughter had a hard time holding him while I bandaged and watching out for her face. He's a nice roo for the most part but we still respect he takes his job seriously and wants back to his girls.

It's been a cold winter. Haven't had these sorts of lows since 4 years ago. So we've been a little spoiled.

This morning. His comb looked much much better. I did not look at his toe...I'll do that tonight but that aspirin I think is to have the credit. Blood thinning properties, and Anti-inflammatory. I'm sure I give majority credit to the aspirin and a bit to the antibiotic ointment I put on to soothe too.

Popping a squash in the oven for my birdies for a warm lunch treat today. That should keep them busy while they hole up in the coop today. Spoiled spoiled spoiled.

 

[shell3]

spoiled indeed!! lol
sounds like youve got the situation in hand though. and whats a poop here and there as long as his happy lol.
got my hands full today having a chicken disaster with bombie but ill check back latter

 

[shell3]

hi forgot to say: have a lovely time visiting with your family as a londoner ive no clue what ice bocce is!lol but have fun and good luck.hope you win!!

 

[Bogtown Chick]

Thanks Shell: LOL. Most people don't know what it is because it's really really some bizarre made up game by bored people who live in the snow and ice. LOL. The Chicagoans and most Minnesotans don't know what it is either.

. So you're in the majority. It's a total humble sport in which you hurl some wood pucks down a lane made of ice with snow banking the sides on your belly. You mainly socialize and laugh at each other and basically outside all day. We love it, it's a good break up of the winter and we get to see all our friends.

 

[cowcreekgeek]

Thank you CowCreekGeek: I'm thinking aspirin-- it is mostly for my benefit too. Ha. One thing I like about the aspirin idea as well is it is a blood thinner in humans, and I'm sure there's the same potential for chickens. This may ease some blood flow into the affected area and make it more efficient, healing the area....? Not sure and thinking out loud, again.

He seems determined yet in his normal activities, eating and courting, being alert while his hens eat and forage. and for that I'm so glad. He gets up on the roost great yet. The only thing I see him do is that flexing of the foot when in Flamingo pose and I know that it could be the toe or the nuissance of the bandage now itself making him do that.

I won't have any problem loosening or removing dead tissue if I see it: tissue that is seperated from nerves and blood flow. His toe was much the same last night. Ulceration not any bigger...so that was good to see. I didn't see any lessening of whiteness but perhaps it was slightly less swollen. Not sure. Very very subtle observation if it's even correct. He tolerated his cool epsom soak in the sink well last night. He jumped out once and then enjoyed some cottage cheese. We have 27 degrees today throughout most of the day and then it will dip down again tonight and Thursday will be nasty, again.

Thank you VERY MUCH for your objective and sensible approach to this. I SO appreciate it!

No problem, at all ... you keep on tryin' what you feel works best, and w/o worryin' too much.

The coolness is only req'd when you're dealin' w/ freshly burned, and esp. still frozen, tissues ... once it's transitioned to a wound, as his clearly has? Warm soaks in epsom salts are highly effective (even several times a day).

Aspirin as a blood thinner for chickens may not be so effective, as their livers are one of those things we eat to thicken up our own blood ... they store large quantities of coagulants. But, for certain? It won't *reduce* blood flow, and *might* increase it. It's sorta unstudied, so far as I've seen.

Some additional information on the use of Aspirin ...

Know that, just like humans, an animal or a bird (although highly unlikely) can have an allergy to salicylates.

The "coated" aspirin is not recommended although, once dissolved, I can see no logical expectation that there'd be any affect upon absorption rates for salicylates by any animal/fowl.

The following snippets are from:
http://vetmed.tamu.edu/common/docs/public/aavpt/aspirin.pdf

Salicylates are rapidly and completely absorbed following oral administration to cats, dogs, and pigs. They are slowly and incompletely absorbed by ruminants and horses.

Aspirin is rapidly hydrolyzed to salicylic acid by plasma esterases in all species.

Therapeutic serum salicylate concentrations varied from 9.15 to 11.90 mg/dL in dogs given plain aspirin orally at a dose of 25 mg per kg of body weight (mg/kg) every 8 hours.

salicylates may displace a coumarin- or indandione-derivative anticoagulant from its protein binding sites, and, in high doses, may cause hypothrombinemia, leading to increased anticoagulation and risk of bleeding

Veterinary Dosing Information
Dosage of aspirin will vary depending on the therapeutic objective to be attained.
Therapeutic serum concentrations: For salicylate—
Analgesic/antipyretic: 20 to 50 mcg/mL.
Anti-inflammatory/antirheumatic: 150 to 200 mcg/mL.{R-37}
Enteric-coated aspirin products are not recommended because gastric retention has been noted to occur.

Notice that, since 1 mcg = 0.001 mg, and 1 mL = 0.001 Liter, 20 to 50 mg/L and 150 to 200 mg/L are the same ratios/concentrations as the above dosages.

:: edited to crorect my misspellins (correct my spellin' that is ~'-) ::