Chick backing up after drinking.

[thecatumbrella]

How’s the weight gain going
Still growing?

She's doing good! We're able to get the symptoms under control most days with the B + E. There's been a little bit of a setback; found blood in someone's stool yesterday, so the gang's on Corid for the next few days. Praying it's not Willow (since her vitamins will negate the amprolium).

 

[RoyalChick]

She's doing good! We're able to get the symptoms under control most days with the B + E. There's been a little bit of a setback; found blood in someone's stool yesterday, so the gang's on Corid for the next few days. Praying it's not Willow (since her vitamins will negate the amprolium).

Glad she is doing well.
There are 6 different B vitamins. Amprolium is a thiamine (B1) antagonist. It has no effect on the other B vitamins.
B2 (riboflavin) is definitely associated with neurological development. I managed to source B2 (ie without the other 5 Bs) on Amazon. Maybe that would be a good idea to do for the few days of Corid treatment.

 

[thecatumbrella]

Glad she is doing well.
There are 6 different B vitamins. Amprolium is a thiamine (B1) antagonist. It has no effect on the other B vitamins.
B2 (riboflavin) is definitely associated with neurological development. I managed to source B2 (ie without the other 5 Bs) on Amazon. Maybe that would be a good idea to do for the few days of Corid treatment.

It's a good idea. I'm going to see if I can get something locally, because by the time Amazon gets here we'll likely be on Day 4 of treatment.

I'm trying to work out a worse case scenario. If she's getting high-dose B1 as part of her b-complex, I assumed that would mean the amprolium can't do its job (unless it can, and it doesn't matter what her B1 levels are)?

I'm also not sure how my 12 day-old chicks could have coccidiosis. There's no other chickens here, they haven't been outside, and I'm fastidious with keeping their brooder clean and dry. Water is poop-proof and I change their food out daily. Not going to mess around, regardless, but the whole thing feels a bit bonkers. This was truly a watery blood poop though.

 

[RoyalChick]

It's a good idea. I'm going to see if I can get something locally, because by the time Amazon gets here we'll likely be on Day 4 of treatment.

I'm trying to work out a worse case scenario. If she's getting high-dose B1 as part of her b-complex, I assumed that would mean the amprolium can't do its job (unless it can, and it doesn't matter what her B1 levels are)?

I'm also not sure how my 12 day-old chicks could have coccidiosis. There's no other chickens here, they haven't been outside, and I'm fastidious with keeping their brooder clean and dry. Water is poop-proof and I change their food out daily. Not going to mess around, regardless, but the whole thing feels a bit bonkers. This was truly a watery blood poop though.

Hmmm. I suspect that high doses of thiamine would interfere with the Corid. I had a quick search in the scientific literature for supporting evidence of that but while a couple of sources assert it as a fact, none had actual data to support the assertion. It makes sense that it would as they both battle for the same receptor at a cellular level.
I too was wondering about coccidiosis and where they would have got it from.
I think if she has been doing well I would treat with Corid and then put her back on the B-complex. If you can supplement with any of the other Bs while treating I would do that but I couldn’t find anny individual B vitamins at my local pharmacy. Only on Amazon.

 

[thecatumbrella]

Hmmm. I suspect that high doses of thiamine would interfere with the Corid. I had a quick search in the scientific literature for supporting evidence of that but while a couple of sources assert it as a fact, none had actual data to support the assertion. It makes sense that it would as they both battle for the same receptor at a cellular level.
I too was wondering about coccidiosis and where they would have got it from.
I think if she has been doing well I would treat with Corid and then put her back on the B-complex. If you can supplement with any of the other Bs while treating I would do that but I couldn’t find anny individual B vitamins at my local pharmacy. Only on Amazon.

I was able to find this (the blurriest stock photo ever). It's got mostly everything but the B1 and can be overnighted. I'll skip her b-complex this afternoon and just do the E.

Poultry DVM also was very clear about not supplementing with B1.

Oops.

 

[RoyalChick]

I was able to find this (the blurriest stock photo ever). It's got mostly everything but the B1 and can be overnighted. I'll skip her b-complex this afternoon and just do the E.

Poultry DVM also was very clear about not supplementing with B1.

Oops.

Good luck. Hope it works out for you and the babies. Keep us updated!

 

[thecatumbrella]

Just wanted to update and say that Willow has not had an episode in over 2 weeks. If someone finds this thread in the future and wants to know exactly how we were treating her:

The final cocktail was a 400IU Vitamin E soft gel and a B-Complex soft gel (here are the stats for that). Punctured both with a thumbtack and squeezed them into a small "centrifuge tube", shook it up, then sucked it into a 1 ml needle-less syringe. I'd take Willow out of the brooder and place her on a puppy pad between my legs (because there will be poop involved), then kind of gently pin her against my body. A chick's head moves around like a freaking electron, so patience is needed here. I'd get the smallest amount of liquid to pool at the tip of the syringe, then aim for the SIDE of her beak and spread it along the crack. The liquid will slowly work its way in, and you'll see the chick make a lip smacking motion. I did not make her ingest the entire syringe. Even just half would be considered a success, and you'll waste a lot of it anyway when you inevitably miss and get it on her head/you/the carpet/etc.

Thank you SO, SO MUCH to everyone that contributed and helped. This was a chick that we thought would likely be euthanized (it got so bad that she could barely walk), and now she's a happy, healthy terror that's looking forward to her first outdoor field trip tomorrow.

 

[TOMTE]

Just wanted to update and say that Willow has not had an episode in over 2 weeks. If someone finds this thread in the future and wants to know exactly how we were treating her:

The final cocktail was a 400IU Vitamin E soft gel and a B-Complex soft gel (here are the stats for that). Punctured both with a thumbtack and squeezed them into a small "centrifuge tube", shook it up, then sucked it into a 1 ml needle-less syringe. I'd take Willow out of the brooder and place her on a puppy pad between my legs (because there will be poop involved), then kind of gently pin her against my body. A chick's head moves around like a freaking electron, so patience is needed here. I'd get the smallest amount of liquid to pool at the tip of the syringe, then aim for the SIDE of her beak and spread it along the crack. The liquid will slowly work its way in, and you'll see the chick make a lip smacking motion. I did not make her ingest the entire syringe. Even just half would be considered a success, and you'll waste a lot of it anyway when you inevitably miss and get it on her head/you/the carpet/etc.

Thank you SO, SO MUCH to everyone that contributed and helped. This was a chick that we thought would likely be euthanized (it got so bad that she could barely walk), and now she's a happy, healthy terror that's looking forward to her first outdoor field trip tomorrow.

View attachment 4106131

I'M SO HAPPY! YAY!

 

[Seaslug]

That is excellent! Way to go, both of you!

 

[RoyalChick]

Fantastic!!!