Chickens for 10-20 years or more? Pull up a rockin' chair and lay some wisdom on us!

[Beekissed]

Quote:
I never really gave it any thought. I don't consider raising chickens and producing eggs for my family a hobby no more than you consider going to the grocery store a hobby, I would venture. It's something I do to insure I'm eating the best meat and eggs available at the cheapest cost for me. If I didn't care about the source of my food and the ramifications of ingesting it on a long term basis, and I still raised chickens for fun, for pets, for entertainment, then I guess I would call that my hobby.

I grow a garden also and for the same reason that I grow chickens, as a source of healthy, cheap food for my family. Before you even ask...no, I don't consider my garden a hobby. I save a tremendous amount of money putting these healthy foods in the jar, on the table and in the freezer. The health benefits of eating this good food insure that my personal medical costs are low, thus saving me even more money.

I have a single income. I was a single parent on a low, single income raising three boys who are now grown and gone. If it couldn't have been done cheaply, I wouldn't even have attempted it as I watch my pennies more than anyone I know. Really poor folk don't indulge in hobbies. I still count every dime and make sure it is going for the best value for me and those I love.

 

[Lower Michigan]

Okay, so maybe we do agree on the basic premise of this thread. That is, this thread leans toward the hobby side.

I gave up with this thread when someone who claimed to be an old timer said that the going rate for a point of lay (POL) pullet in Michigan was around $15. I can buy POLs for $6.50 in Michigan, Having 20 years experience does not make a chicken hobbyist smart or successful.

Anyway, that you for posting. You are just saying what many of us here are thinking.

edited by staff

 

[bestpractice]

If you are counting every dime you may want to consider looking at the cost of raising those chickens. In the summer "poor people" like me utilize farmers markets. I'm being honest and trying to be helpful -- I'm certainly having to watch all my pennies. It would probably be cheaper to purchase organic (the definition of organic is a different discussion). Some small farmers are using the term "pasture fed" to indicate the chicken is truly "free range" (the definition of free range is a different discussion). Pasture fed is "typically" closer to what the OT's thread is leaning toward -- which can be a healthy way to raise chickens. I would be very concerned about buying my chicken from some of the OT's around here (I'm talking about where I live, not BYC). Chickens can be a source of disease and bacteria if not properly taken care of. I will only buy "certified" or inspected, because I know there are safeguards in place.

I never really gave it any thought. I don't consider raising chickens and producing eggs for my family a hobby no more than you consider going to the grocery store a hobby, I would venture. It's something I do to insure I'm eating the best meat and eggs available at the cheapest cost for me. If I didn't care about the source of my food and the ramifications of ingesting it on a long term basis, and I still raised chickens for fun, for pets, for entertainment, then I guess I would call that my hobby.

I grow a garden also and for the same reason that I grow chickens, as a source of healthy, cheap food for my family. Before you even ask...no, I don't consider my garden a hobby. I save a tremendous amount of money putting these healthy foods in the jar, on the table and in the freezer. The health benefits of eating this good food insure that my personal medical costs are low, thus saving me even more money.

I have a single income. I was a single parent on a low, single income raising three boys who are now grown and gone. If it couldn't have been done cheaply, I wouldn't even have attempted it as I watch my pennies more than anyone I know. Really poor folk don't indulge in hobbies. I still count every dime and make sure it is going for the best value for me and those I love.

 

[Beekissed]

The information here is on a take or leave it basis, so you are free to leave it. No one forcing it down yer throat with one hand and thumping their own chest with the other, by any means.

edited by staff

 

[Beekissed]

If you are counting every dime you may want to consider looking at the cost of raising those chickens. In the summer "poor people" like me utilize farmers markets. I'm being honest and trying to be helpful -- I'm certainly having to watch all my pennies. It would probably be cheaper to purchase organic (the definition of organic is a different discussion). Some small farmers are using the term "pasture fed" to indicate the chicken is truly "free range" (the definition of free range is a different discussion). Pasture fed is "typically" closer to what the OT's thread is leaning toward -- which can be a healthy way to raise chickens. I would be very concerned about buying my chicken from some of the OT's around here (I'm talking about where I live, not BYC). Chickens can be a source of disease and bacteria if not properly taken care of. I will only buy "certified" or inspected, because I know there are safeguards in place.

There are no farmer's markets here....just country folk raising their own. The nearest thing that might resemble a farmer's market is more than 50 miles away.

I might have missed something here...are you privy to my bank accounts and what I spend on my chickens? I only ask because you speak as someone who knows exactly what I spend on feed and care for my chickens....which I know can't be, as I've never shared my personal expenses with anyone.


Quote:
Every poor person's dream...to inherit a farm with all the buildings intact and have enough money to shop at farmer's markets. I envy you your level of poverty!

Thanks for "being honest and helpful" in trying to help me sort out my finances, but since we are both poor, neither can really advise the other on matters of finance, can we?

 

[bestpractice]

I gave up with this thread when someone who claimed to be an old timer said that the going rate for a point of lay (POL) pullet in Michigan was around $15. I can buy POLs for $6.50 in Michigan, This thread is about a lot of chest thumping. Lots and lots of misinformation here. Having 20 years experience does not make a chicken hobbyist smart or successful. The OP seems to have that confused.

Anyway, that you for posting. You are just saying what many of us here are thinking. You obviously have rattled a few cages here.

Holy Toledo! I want the name of that buyer I could retire and not worry about supplemental income in my old age if I could get that much money for a chicken!

 

[JenellYB]

First, on putting our years of experience so it shows on our visible profile...if someone would explain how to to that I will....so far I haven't figured that out.

Now, topics at hand.

Hobby or business? Consider IRS tax laws here. actually making a profit or not is NOT the distinction between 'hobby' and 'business'...I DO have actual experience with both owning a small business AND having had hobby enterprises that made profits.And doing my own taxes related to those.

.INTENT of profit is. A legit business can run a certain time without a profit, even with a loss, but the INTENT to profit is the key question. It must be operated as a business, with expences and activities geared toward a reasonable expectation of a profit. decisions are made on the basis of how they affect the bottom line, increase revenue, reduce expences and costs, maximize profit.

That a 'Hobby" actually makes a profit does NOT make it a "business." If it involves activites, expenses, and costs that are purely for personal enjoyment or satisfaction or emotional attachments with no function toward making a profit, it is a hobby, not a business...any "profit" is accidental and incidental to the primary purpose and operation of the enterprise.

Economics---management? These really can't be separated. One is intergal to the other. Even if your interest and reasons for raising chickens is aesthetic, just having pretty chickens to look at or take to shows or whatever, economics matter to at least most of us. I guess its possible someone might find it economically acceptable to just get pretty chickens to decorate the yard or take to shows with no concern for management or the expense of just going out and buying new ones to replace those that got sick and died or killed for lack of protection against predators. That's not most of us, I think.

Even where raising chickens just for one's own family to have fresh healthy food involves economic considerations. Is thework and time and trouble really worth it when you could go buy organic humanely raised meat and eggs for less than its costing you to raise them? And i suspect MOST of those raising them for meat and eggs are not just concerned about healthiness of food, but hoping to supplementtheir family's food budget as well, to eat better or at least as good for less.
From there, it is a very reasonable take-off to hope to also be able to bring in some supplemental income from the project, to help afford other things to make our family's life more comfortable and enjoyable. Here is becomes important, for tax purposes, to be very careful how you treat that "hobby" vs "business" question.

Back Yard Chicken hobby or business....seems pretty clear to me as someone else mentioned, "back yard" eliminates commercial agri-business operations and interests. It just isn't relevant or applicable to back yard chickens. But backyard chicken operations are also not neccesarily only "hobby"...back yard operated small buisnesses and cottage industries are definitely legitamate businesses.

 

[bestpractice]

There are no farmer's markets here....just country folk raising their own. The nearest thing that might resemble a farmer's market is more than 50 miles away.

I might have missed something here...are you privy to my bank accounts and what I spend on my chickens? I only ask because you speak as someone who knows exactly what I spend on feed and care for my chickens....which I know can't be, as I've never shared my personal expenses with anyone.



Every poor person's dream...to inherit a farm with all the buildings intact and have enough money to shop at farmer's markets. I envy you your level of poverty!

Thanks for "being honest and helpful" in trying to help me sort out my finances, but since we are both poor, neither can really advise the other on matters of finance, can we?

Oh my, you really have an odd idea of what *my* life is. Good luck with counting your pennies and raising your chickens. I think I'll stay on topic, and that is raising chickens to make a profit versus "Hobby".

 

[JenellYB]

One more I missed...
Family farm as business.. There are allowances for farm produce drawn from the farm operation for family use without dissallowing that farm as a legitamate "business" operation. However, when/if you get into practices clearly not conductive to an intent to profit, such as writing off costs and expenses of raising chickens as a business operation, but then routinely keeping non-productive birds that in good business sense should be culled, or just giving away all your extra roosters becasue you can't bring yourself to harvest them, or inlcuding in chicken expenses the costs of a flock of show chickens that bring in no profit at all, only uncur costs you wouldn't have other wise, you a discrediting a valid claim as a family farm as business.

 

[Beekissed]

Oh my, you really have an odd idea of what *my* life is. Good luck with counting your pennies and raising your chickens. I think I'll stay on topic, and that is raising chickens to make a profit versus "Hobby".

Actually....the current topic is brooding systems that OTs have used, are currently using and why they chose those(few pages back). The general topic of the thread is if you have been raising chickens for awhile and how you can add to the pool of wisdom on this thread, to feel free to do so.

Since you are discussing neither topic but merely arguing a point you are trying to make about how you feel the OTs are all wrong and don't know their chickens from a yak, then it will be tough for you to "stay on topic".

You might want to start your own thread covering that profit vs. hobby thingy?

But...feel free to roll that hoop while I get out there and tend to my chores...er...hobbies.