Chickens for 10-20 years or more? Pull up a rockin' chair and lay some wisdom on us!

[Beekissed]

Agreed. I think it has a lot to do with focus. Not many who first get into chickens have a particular focus beyond wanting fresh eggs and/or the "new" cute pet, or because everyone else they know is getting into them.

Then they run into the inevitable problems that come along with producing livestock. They have different needs than do pets.

You see, cats nor dogs produce anything that will be used for food and they certainly don't produce anything but fertilizer every day. An animal that is on a constant production has various needs that the common pet does not have.

Plus, it's a bird. Not a bird that you can reasonably keep in a cage on some newspaper and teach to talk...it's a bird that is prone to sudden death, needs to have room in order to live a healthy life, is a social animal within it's species, needs to live outdoors for optimal health and to have a normal, functioning life. Most of America is moving away from keeping any pet outdoors, so this is confusing to folks who have only ever owned pets. This particular pet also needs protection from all the other pets you own and those other pets in the neighborhood, not to mention any aerial marauders.

Even for those just wanting fresh eggs, one must weigh the cost of keeping 3-6 birds merely to have eggs. In this economy, it's just silly. Unless you are set up to have chickens who can derive much of their nutritional needs from forage, then they must be fed well on bought feeds. Most people keeping chickens in this manner do not live where local mills make feeding cheaper, so they must feed prebagged, namebrand feeds from TSC.

If they live in the 'burbs or directly in city, they want the coop to look "cute" or the neighborhood dictates aesthetically pleasing coops/pens...which leads to even more expense. For a few eggs.

Then the chickens get sick from being crowded into little boxes called coops and they then vet the chicken, often to no avail, and it is expensive. For a few eggs from a handful of chickens.

See where it all breaks down into being tragically absurd and economically unsound?

For those who have the intention of keeping chickens for the eggs and meat, while offsetting feed costs by selling eggs or birds, finding good information on how to do just that is like looking for a needle in a haystack on this forum.

This thread just happens to be the needle.

 

[stonykill]

I'm curious where your RIRs came from.

the bulk of them came from a local chicken farm that closed up. Old bloodline. The others are hatchery birds purchased at a local feed store. They are smaller birds that lay a normal sized large egg but lay really well.

 

[normanack]

See where it all breaks down into being tragically absurd and economically unsound?
 

Darn it. That makes sense.

Although if we were paying the cost of a smaller-scale farm egg instead of the unimaginably huge enterprise that is the egg industry, it might make more sense. Don't know. Haven't done the calculations.

So, I'm asking those of you who sell eggs on a less-than-100,000-hen scale. How much does it cost you to produce and market a dozen eggs? A lot of people sell them around here for $2/dozen and I don't see how they're not losing money.

 

[Wishing4Wings]

For those who have the intention of keeping chickens for the eggs and meat, while offsetting feed costs by selling eggs or birds, finding good information on how to do just that is like looking for a needle in a haystack on this forum.

This thread just happens to be the needle.

And why it has such a large readership.

the bulk of them came from a local chicken farm that closed up. Old bloodline. The others are hatchery birds purchased at a local feed store. They are smaller birds that lay a normal sized large egg but lay really well.

Thank you.

 

[Gargoyle]

So, I'm asking those of you who sell eggs on a less-than-100,000-hen scale. How much does it cost you to produce and market a dozen eggs? A lot of people sell them around here for $2/dozen and I don't see how they're not losing money.

Local supermarkets sell commercial brown "free range organic" eggs, which come from mass production facilities, for up to $4.00/dozen, so real small flock eggs like most BYC'ers would produce are worth more than that. However, I suspect it would be very hard to sell for over $4.50/dozen, and $3.25 is more likely.

 

[Fred's Hens]

Darn it. That makes sense.
Although if we were paying the cost of a smaller-scale farm egg instead of the unimaginably huge enterprise that is the egg industry, it might make more sense. Don't know. Haven't done the calculations.
So, I'm asking those of you who sell eggs on a less-than-100,000-hen scale. How much does it cost you to produce and market a dozen eggs? A lot of people sell them around here for $2/dozen and I don't see how they're not losing money.

What they sell for is a bit irrelevant, in a way. That's the trouble with just saying what they sell eggs for. There are a half dozen threads a month wherein 40 posters chime in on what they sell their eggs for. Yawn. Your question gets at the real question, which is "What's the margin?" THAT is the question that doesn't get answered very often.

One reason, perhaps, is that people don't know or don't want to know their true expenses. Figuring those must include everything, including electricity, bedding, original cost per chick, gasoline for running to and fro, cartons (if they buy them), and then, feed, feed, feed. Frankly? It is extremely hard to even break even, with most small holdings. That is just the truth.

Even if one sells 60 dozen eggs per month, and makes $1 a dozen, (no small feat) that is pitiful pay for the labor that producing 60 dozen a month represents. Pitiful. That is after all the investment of coop, barn, pens, runs, wire, lumber, waterers, feeders, lamps, etc. LOL. Small holders are simply not going to get rich doing this. No way.

You'd probably be much farther ahead working a part time job and asking if the customer would like to super size their #3 value meal.

 

[Beekissed]

Darn it. That makes sense.
Although if we were paying the cost of a smaller-scale farm egg instead of the unimaginably huge enterprise that is the egg industry, it might make more sense. Don't know. Haven't done the calculations.
So, I'm asking those of you who sell eggs on a less-than-100,000-hen scale. How much does it cost you to produce and market a dozen eggs? A lot of people sell them around here for $2/dozen and I don't see how they're not losing money.

Now, this isn't going to be exact down to the penny or the egg, but I'll give you an example of how many eggs are produced by one of my flocks in a 45 day period, which is the approx. time it takes them to go through 100 lbs of layer mash at $22(that's tax included in that price).

In a peak laying month, of which we get about 5 mo. of those per year, each of my layers will lay an egg(we won't break it down about who went broody or if an egg didn't get laid...this is average laying activity). I normally keep 28-30 layers but I'll just say 28 but I'm feeding a roo as well.

For 45 days my flock is eating $.48 worth of feed per day and each of those days they are producing 28 eggs. I charge $2 a doz., so you can already see that they are making a profit each day of $3.52(we won't count the extra four eggs here). In 45 days they can produce 1,260 eggs or 52.5 doz. @ $2 per, for a grand total of $105.00 worth of eggs per every $22 worth of feed, leaving a profit of $83 every 45 days.

If those days are in peak laying months of 5, then the total profit for that time is approx. $250. If they are only laying half that in the 7 non-peak months they've netted a profit of $188 over and beyond their feed costs(which I make even lower by buying even cheaper whole grains in off-peak seasons). If they are even laying 1/4 their capacity of lay during non-peak months, they still have a profit over feed of $94.

Now, take days when they aren't laying at peak but they are still eating, I don't keep any bird that doesn't lay every day or every other day but I allow a little variance on that during the winter months for older birds. Even if they are totally slacking in the winter months, the profit they made in the good months and even the not peak months, still allows one to turn a profit...even if it's not as big. Heck, most people would be happy breaking even..but not me. I wouldn't even bother doing all this to just break even.

I do, however, donate extra eggs to the local food pantry and give them directly to some of my patients who have a fixed income. This is the good outcome of being thrifty in life...you have some to share with others.

This is why I cull, this is why I free range, this is why I cut layer mash with cheaper grains in the winter, It's why I cull for feed thrift in a bird, It's why I keep a rooster and breed my own hens back for offspring, it's also why I make sure I keep birds that lay for several years instead of having to replace the flock over and over...all these things cut down on my overhead of keeping chickens.

Why do you think we preach good health practices and low cost output on keeping chickens? A healthy chicken is a producing chicken. Buying meds, vetting, keeping birds that do not produce? All eat into profits.

I'm not into this to make big bucks but I sure ain't in it to lose money I don't have in the first place. I raise chickens to supplement our food supply, share some with others...and to make an extra buck here and there while doing so. I don't know many farmers who just raise animals for their own consumption...they really can't afford to do so. Most sell some stock to cover the costs of raising the animal and their own meats can then be pretty much free of costs at that point.

 

[loanwizard]

What they sell for is a bit irrelevant, in a way. That's the trouble with just saying what they sell eggs for. There are a half dozen threads a month wherein 40 posters chime in on what they sell their eggs for. Yawn. Your question gets at the real question, which is "What's the margin?" THAT is the question that doesn't get answered very often.

One reason, perhaps, is that people don't know or don't want to know their true expenses. Figuring those must include everything, including electricity, bedding, original cost per chick, gasoline for running to and fro, cartons (if they buy them), and then, feed, feed, feed. Frankly? It is extremely hard to even break even, with most small holdings. That is just the truth.

Even if one sells 60 dozen eggs per month, and makes $1 a dozen, (no small feat) that is pitiful pay for the labor that producing 60 dozen a month represents. Pitiful. That is after all the investment of coop, barn, pens, runs, wire, lumber, waterers, feeders, lamps, etc. LOL. Small holders are simply not going to get rich doing this. No way.

You'd probably be much farther ahead working a part time job and asking if the customer would like to super size their #3 value meal.

That is very true Fred. However..... Eggs are the marketing loss leader. I sell eggs 70 miles away from my farm for $2.00 per dozen. My first chickens were given to me. I have bought some for $2.00 each and for up to $6.00 each. I free range and feed 100 birds approximately 1/2 a bucket of feed per day. Still, at $2.00 per dozen, I am losing money. That said, I sell beef for $3.79lb. I don't own a cow. I sell Pork for $3.79lb. These are hanging weights. I sell Freedom Rangers for $3.79 lb.

Back to those eggs. Where do I find my customers? I advertise on Craigslist. People have ordered eggs. 1 person ordered 1/2 a beef... from an egg ad. I have orders from egg customers for chickens that go next week.

How much am I making off those eggs?

No, I haven't made any money yet on the farm, but I have just begun.

 

[fowlman01]

If anyone figured out their true return on investment, they would not even think about selling eggs .....unless they have some of those Tolbunt Polish eggs that go for $75.00 each. You would have to get a lot of free overhead to make money with a small scale operation. Now, if you are raising them cuz you love them, selling eggs is a good way to pay for part of the feed. Speaking of feed.....those egg customers don't care that corn is going to be fifty cents a kernel soon..they still want their eggs for $4.50 a dz cuz they are already paying more than they can buy them at WalMart. I don't know of anyone who made money with chickens in their back yard.

Walt

 

[Fred's Hens]

If anyone figured out their true return on investment, they would not even think about selling eggs .....unless they have some of those Tolbunt Polish eggs that go for $75.00 each. You would have to get a lot of free overhead to make money with a small scale operation. Now, if you are raising them cuz you love them, selling eggs is a good way to pay for part of the feed. Speaking of feed.....those egg customers don't care that corn is going to be fifty cents a kernel soon..they still want their eggs for $4.50 a dz cuz they are already paying more than they can buy them at WalMart. I don't know of anyone who made money with chickens in their back yard.

Walt

Yup.

When asked why we have chickens I tell folks, "For the poop."

Actually, that's not too far from the truth.