Chickens for 10-20 years or more? Pull up a rockin' chair and lay some wisdom on us!

[Fred's Hens]

This Quiz has a Genesis. It involves my wife. (She, the city mouse, remember). She's a good gal and my partner in life for now almost 42 years. It was her question that spawned this Quiz. I figured if she needed to ask it, and yes, she needed to ask the question, then this could be a learning experience.

Bee is so right. Sometimes, we've who've done stuff for a decades and decades, know things, but no longer consider how it is we know. Only when someone like my wife asked, "How do you know that?" do I have to stop and think and then articulate, Oh, gee.
Doesn't "everyone" know that? NO!!! you big dummy you. Everyone doesn't this.

 

[Maven]

whew!! We've had thunderstorms here most of the day and our internet was out - didn't know if I was going to be able to get back on to do the quiz or not.

I know we were supposed to quote the quiz to answer, but to do that I'd have to go back and find it and that would mean seeing other people's answers and I didn't want to do that before I gave my rambling, nonsensical, answer.

So I'm going to just put down what I've been thinking through since looking at the birds all morning this morning.

At first, I thought, well, obviously if they are the same age and there is THAT much difference in the comb/wattles, then bird #2 is a cockerel and would be culled because I bet he'd really SUCK at laying eggs. Piece of cake, quiz over! Ah, but THEN I remembered that Fred made it clear that these are ISA birds that came straight from the hatchery which means they are sex-link birds and there wouldn't BE any red cockerels in his batch of red birds - they would be a different color! Well played, Fred, well played!!


So then, it got hard. A LOT harder.

Bird #1 - in one picture, she looks pulled into herself like she doesn't feel well. But in the other she is standing pretty normally so I wonder if she was just sleeping in the one with bird #2. Her comb and wattles are not nearly as developed, and Fred always says that a slower maturing bird will be the stronger bird and longer layer in the future. The comb and wattles have fairly good color - not as bright red as bird #2, but as they mature I'm sure they'll brighten up. She has nice sturdy legs fairly well set apart - nothing like Al's cornish, but what is? heh.

Bird #2 - She looks like a lively bird. Bright-eyed and inquisitive. She looks slimmer and more efficiently built for egg production than bird #2. She has obviously matured much faster. Her legs aren't as thick, but seem set fairly well apart in the picture with bird #1.

We don't have a full on view of either one's rear end, and I can't really tell if they have 'pinched up' tails from a side view - I'm just not that good.

In the end, I don't know enough to know if I'd cull either one. Hands on experience and watching them move around would help. These are just some of the things I've observed.

Can't wait until Fred weighs in on his birds!

 

[Fred's Hens]

She is also the Genesis of my screen name. When some of her choir folks or people like that stop by, they may exclaim, "OH, you have chickens?"

My wife is lightening fast to correct them. "I don't have chickens. Those are Fred's Hens!!!"

Now you know the rest of the story.

 

[NikkiMiChickie]

I am certain that you make the duct taped boot look good.  And It also brings to the fore front your thrify nature which is yet another good quality in a person.  The fact that you are a good cook as well means you are very likely the whole package and your wife is a very blessed and fortunate woman.  However,  I maintain that you, as well as others, are not completely up to speed on the best use for duct tape.
L

Oh Lisa, puh-lease tell me that is not a 50 Shades of Grey reference!? Best uses of duct tape... I'll bet Christian Grey could think of a few that don't involve a work boot......
I once used duct tape as a make-shift strapless bra of sorts for my little sister's strangely-shaped homecoming dress that didn't allow her to wear her bra, although she needed one. Let's just say it worked.... And I'm glad it wasn't me who had to peel that stuff off.... Ouch!

Don't forget!  He has a horse and some bee-e-A-UTIFUL chickens.  Stack that up on his good side.... 

 

My husband has a horse. Well, he had a horse, but I was the only one who rode the dumb blonde jerk, so I sold him. Now my husband doesn't have a horse! Haven't had to cull my flock yet, but I can cull a herd

 

[Beekissed]

She is also the Genesis of my screen name. When some of her choir folks or people like that stop by, they may exclaim, "OH, you have chickens?"

My wife is lightening fast to correct them. "I don't have chickens. Those are Fred's Hens!!!"

Now you know the rest of the story.

I've always wondered about that! Now we know....

 

[Mountain Momma]

Quote:

Oh Lisa, puh-lease tell me that is not a 50 Shades of Grey reference!? Best uses of duct tape... I'll bet Christian Grey could think of a few that don't involve a work boot......

I once used duct tape as a make-shift strapless bra of sorts for my little sister's strangely-shaped homecoming dress that didn't allow her to wear her bra, although she needed one. Let's just say it worked.... And I'm glad it wasn't me who had to peel that stuff off.... Ouch!
My husband has a horse. Well, he had a horse, but I was the only one who rode the dumb blonde jerk, so I sold him. Now my husband doesn't have a horse! Haven't had to cull my flock yet, but I can cull a herd

Oh my my. At least you have been a good influence on your sister! Teaching her not to let those babies loose!
I dont see how anyone could feed a horse these days.


The best use of duct tape it to reconnect ducts of course!
L

 

[mkcolls]

C

Pop Quiz

Ok, here is the promised Pop Quiz. But here are the rules and background info.

There are two birds focused on here. I will try to identify them simply as Bird #1 and Bird #2. They are both ISA Browns, the quintessential layer. Think the CX of the layer birds. These are not dual purpose fowl. They are dedicated purpose fowl. Eggs, eggs and more eggs. They are both 8 months old, all the birds came in a box of 25, hatched on the same day, brooded together and raised together. Always been fed the same feed, in the same environment.

Apologize for my crappy photography and camera quality. It is what it is. While it doesn't come through on the camera well, I can give you this hint. Their feathering quality is vastly different in real life. You'll have to decide which is which and why.

Rules for the Quiz.

1. Only those who've kept backyard birds for less than 3 years are allowed to take the quiz.
2. No one can reply right now. Anyone who replies today, will be DQ'd. No ifs, ands or butts.
3. The window of turning in your Quiz responses will NOT be until this time tomorrow. There will be an open window of 8 hours in which to turn in your Quiz. Anytime tomorrow(NOW TODAY, DEC. 9) is just fine, after 1 pm EST. Noon CST, 11 am MST and 10 am PST. Sure, this is a gimmick, but hey. I want to think about this quiz and not give instant, knee jerk responses. OK?
4. Tell me what you see in comparing these two birds.
5. Tell me if you would cull one, both, neither, and why you think so.

OK, there it is. Is everyone ready for the photos to judge?




Bird # 1



Bird # 1 Bird # 2



Bird #1 Bird # 2



Bird # 2



Bird # 2

We've had a mixed flock since June 2011 and have learned something new every day from them. We come to Poultry Univ. (PU) aka BYC OT thread for reality poultry keeping.
This is our response to Fred's Pop Quiz.

Our "knee jerk reaction" if keeping for egg production cull #1 and keep #2. We came up with this separately.

Our visual responses:
Bird #1 - Cons - body squat, neck retracted, comb & wattle small and pale, appears listless, not responding to her surroundings. (we know it is a picture, so just a moment in time - would love to have another picture of her off the roost) Pros - full sturdy legs.

Bird #2 - body lean, alert, bright eyes, checking out her environment, and her coop mate. Bright full comb, face and wattle. The body type seems good for egg layers. The lean mean egg machine. It appears that she may have some feather loss on her back. Is this from mating?

We currently have a Speckled Sussex that looks like Bird #1. She has had internal laying issues, and bumblefoot. The internal laying issue has been treated, but she has not laid an egg for 7 weeks. The bumblefoot was treated and she is well.

Our flock philosophy has been a dual purpose one. Those who did not produce eggs would become meals. For the most part we have done well. We have our favorites, and have kept a few stinkers only to have them at the top of the next culling list. Since we started with hatchery stock we don't expect them to suddenly become SOP. We have enjoyed our continuing education, entertainment and times of laughter with our feathered flocks.

Thanks for this class Fred.

 

[Rachel'sFlock]

FRED's Quiz:

Ok, here is the promised Pop Quiz. But here are the rules and background info.

There are two birds focused on here. I will try to identify them simply as Bird #1 and Bird #2. They are both ISA Browns, the quintessential layer. Think the CX of the layer birds. These are not dual purpose fowl. They are dedicated purpose fowl. Eggs, eggs and more eggs. They are both 8 months old, all the birds came in a box of 25, hatched on the same day, brooded together and raised together. Always been fed the same feed, in the same environment.

Apologize for my crappy photography and camera quality. It is what it is. While it doesn't come through on the camera well, I can give you this hint. Their feathering quality is vastly different in real life. You'll have to decide which is which and why.

Rules for the Quiz.

1. Only those who've kept backyard birds for less than 3 years are allowed to take the quiz.
2. No one can reply right now. Anyone who replies today, will be DQ'd. No ifs, ands or butts.
3. The window of turning in your Quiz responses will NOT be until this time tomorrow. There will be an open window of 8 hours in which to turn in your Quiz. Anytime tomorrow(NOW TODAY, DEC. 9) is just fine, after 1 pm EST. Noon CST, 11 am MST and 10 am PST. Sure, this is a gimmick, but hey. I want to think about this quiz and not give instant, knee jerk responses. OK?
4. Tell me what you see in comparing these two birds.
5. Tell me if you would cull one, both, neither, and why you think so.

OK, there it is. Is everyone ready for the photos to judge?




Bird # 1



Bird # 1 Bird # 2



Bird #1 Bird # 2



Bird # 2



Bird # 2

Here is my absolute freshman stab at breeding characteristic identification.
Up to now, my qualifiers for being part of this flock have been: Are you an Australorp? and (except for Max) Are you a hen?
I know what I want my birds to look like, health-wise, but that is the beginning and the end of my knowledge up to now.

That said, I am blessed to have the opportunity to learn more because of the wealth of knowledge Walt, Fred and Al,and all of us learning from them have brought to this thread.

Bird #1
I notice the comb is paler than #2, immediately, but also see she is beginning to bed down on a roost, in both pictures. She is an considerably more relaxed state, already ready for sleep, than #1. There isn't a pic of her moving about for comparison. It s a smaller comb, but this is common in a "box of 50" hatchery birds.
She is in beautiful condition. Her feathers gleam. She is healthy and has a bit of a rounded, plump look. She reminds me of my BAs, who have that really curvy look.
As she is bred specifically for egg production, and not dual purpose, this may mean she is heavier than an outstanding egg bird of her breed. I am not familiar with the breed's look, beyond googled pics.
She has thicker legs and does appear to have matured more quickly than #2.
Bird 1 conclusion~I like the look of her the best, and would watch to see what her production is like for the coming months into Spring, when she will be at the height of what she's capable of. I would also watch to see if her "plump" appearance is the result of being a first to the feeder and last to leave/in relation to production, this her pullet winter.

Bird #2
She has a much larger, redder comb. She is alert, 'frisky' and has an overall "busy" appearance.
She is not in as beautiful condition as Bird #1, but ths isn't the best time of year to be having your picture taken. She appears healthy, and young to me.
As she is sleeker of body, and a breed specifically for egg laying, and based on this, I would guess she has been a better layer, this pullet Fall.
Her legs seem a little spindly, compared to #1.
I would be inclined to lift both birds to compare their relative actual weight.
Bird 2 conclusion~ If I had to choose just one bird, even with my limited knowledge of the breed, I would have to choose 1. Bird 2 does not have that gleam of health I like to see, despite her super bright eye. Now, that said, it is Fall, and Bee says to cull in the Spring when everyone is at their peak. Not when there is a blizzard going on outside.
I would watch her this winter, and evaluate her production as she comes into First Spring of pullet year laying.

If, in the Spring, they laid the same, and ate the same and still looked the same, I would be inclined to keep Bird 1 for breeding. I would keep Bird 2 for egg laying, but not breeding.

Thanks for this quiz. I am happy to be completely wrong on everything, just to learn what is really right

 

[Fred's Hens]

Myth Buster
​

"The Red Sex Link is a cross between a Rhode Island Red rooster over a Rhode Island White hen"


This mythology is very, very entrenched and mainly caused by hatcheries using this bogus statements on their website. Remember folks, these same hatcheries often use photos from poultry shows of award winning birds, shown in their show cages, suggesting that this is their parent stock for the chicks you can order!!!

Geesh! Could anything BE more inaccurate? OK, now the myth stated above. This is absurd, of course, as the RIW is likely either rare as hen's teeth or extinct with a few breeders perhaps "rebuilding" them along the lines of Kathy's Delaware project. The hatcheries aren't using RIWs. First, folks, please remember the RIW has a rose comb, yet we never see any rose combed RSL birds sold. Sorry. The average RSL is more likely a commercial bird, sold through the retail hatcheries with nice, cute, retail type names for the consumer. Meanwhile, the brown egg industry buys them by the millions, around the world, as a Bovan, Hubbard, ISA, Hi-Sex, etc, etc, etc.

The ISA Brown was one of the first. It has been bred for now over 35 years, the product of poultry genetics. 4 separate lines are involved. Two lines for the red side and two lines for the white side. These are of European origin and the lines are secret and proprietary. The two white lines likely include lots of European white sussex type blood as well as white Leghorn blood. The red side includes Rhode Island Red, but also likely has Brown Leghorn as well. In any case, NONE of the grandparent birds would be "pure" anything, in that they are no longer "breeds" but hyper specialize strains of grandparent stock. The commercial broiler, commonly called a CX is produced for the meat industry in a very similar way.

 

[Rachel'sFlock]

She is also the Genesis of my screen name. When some of her choir folks or people like that stop by, they may exclaim, "OH, you have chickens?"

My wife is lightening fast to correct them. "I don't have chickens. Those are Fred's Hens!!!"

Now you know the rest of the story.

From the minute I saw your name, I knewwww what the story was. We have some Rachel (NOT Phil's!) Hens at my house, too.