Chicks not roosting

[USMC chicken mommy]

Hello again
So, last year was our first year with chickens. Started with 10, lost 6 to a neighborhood dog, dog came back several weeks later and took a chunk out of one of the last 4 birds, ran her to the vet where we kept her in the makeshift “icu” unit in our jacuzzi tub for 3 weeks......and her feathers grew back and she has been an upstanding chook citizen since!
This past March, I bought 2 more baby easter eggers, and they started off little devils with claws and feathers. Something happened to where they became as docile and gentle as can be, wanting to be petted and held, etc.
I kept them from the original flock, where they can see each other, letting them out with the others a little at a time. My original flock is an Wyandotte, an Easter egger and 2 Orpingtons. The orpingtons have no issues with the younger ones. The other 2, they are out for blood. Since the 2 younger ones are so docile, they just hunker down and take the beating. I don’t let it go for long, as I am afraid they are going to kill them. I have a permanent coop and a chicken tractor, and the 2 younger birds stay in the tractor. They won’t use their roosting bars, however. They literally sleep in the nesting box, on top of each other.
Can someone please give me some advice on how to incorporate them with the original flock or how to get them to roost?
Sorry for the long post. Thanks for taking the time to read and possibly help me.

 

[CluckerFamily]

I would be helpful if you included pictures of the roost area for the young ones.
For integration, I always do a 2-3 week see but no touch integration where the new members are always part and within the flock but no one can peck each other for 2-3 weeks. Some people just put the new members in with the flock but things can go bad very fast.

 

[aart]

Here's some tips about.....
Integration Basics:
It's all about territory and resources(space/food/water).
Existing birds will almost always attack new ones to defend their resources.
Understanding chicken behaviors is essential to integrating new birds into your flock.

Confine new birds within sight but physically segregated from older/existing birds for several weeks, so they can see and get used to each other but not physically interact.

In adjacent runs, spread scratch grains along the dividing mesh, best if mesh is just big enough for birds to stick their head thru, so they get used to eating together.

The more space, the better. Birds will peck to establish dominance, the pecked bird needs space to get away. As long as there's no copious blood drawn and/or new bird is not trapped/pinned down and beaten unmercilessly, let them work it out. Every time you interfere or remove new birds, they'll have to start the pecking order thing all over again.

Multiple feed/water stations. Dominance issues are most often carried out over sustenance, more stations lessens the frequency of that issue.

Places for the new birds to hide 'out of line of sight'(but not a dead end trap) and/or up and away from any bully birds. Roosts, pallets or boards leaned up against walls or up on concrete blocks, old chairs tables, branches, logs, stumps out in the run can really help. Lots of diversion and places to 'hide' instead of bare wide open run.
Good ideas for hiding places:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/a-cluttered-run.1323792/

 

[Bear1978]

Take the nesting boxes out of the coop the younger birds are in too.

 

[USMC chicken mommy]

The nesting boxes cannot be removed. I can block them off, but that’s where they lay their eggs, too. I can’t show pics, but it’s 2 roosting bars inside the coop, they would just rather lay on top of each other, I suppose.
As for the 2-3 week separation, I’ve had them since March. I let them out into the yard together, as we have 2 acres, and the 2 aggressive hens will chase and bludgeon the smaller hens, no matter where they are. And they do try to keep their distance as they are afraid of them. There’s not a space issue at all. There was no blood the last time, but the one hen hurt one of the pallets legs so badly that she wouldn’t even stand on it. There was yet another vet visit for Xrays and pain meds.
Allowing them to fight it out concerns me, as I’m sure it does everyone. I’m not really an expert on hen behavior, but I have seen the dominance within the coop to gain territory with my older ones. However it never comes to this extent with them.
Thanks for your help. I appreciate it!

 

[NatJ]

My original flock is an Wyandotte, an Easter egger and 2 Orpingtons. The orpingtons have no issues with the younger ones. The other 2, they are out for blood.

You could re-arrange, so you have a flock of 2 mean ones in the chicken tractor, and 4 birds in the main coop.

If the younger ones become comfortable with the Orpingtons, then they will be part of a larger group.

The mean birds may settle down when they find that "their" group is now the smaller group. (Or they might not. In which case I'd consider whether to make them into chicken soup, or whether to keep them as two separate groups.)

Just to check--you say all the birds in both groups are mature and laying eggs now?

 

[CluckerFamily]

The way I do the 2-3 week see but no touch is that the new members are literally in the same coop as the others but they have their own space that the older members can't get to them. I don't separate them into different coops.
You could block the nesting boxes at dusk and then at dawn before they lay, you could open up the nesting boxes.
If you are willing to have two different coops/flocks, I like the idea of switching up the residence to put the mean hens in the smaller coop by themselves.

 

[One Lucky Momma]

Is it feasible to block nest boxes for the night and unblock early for laying? Sounds inconvenient but would encourage roosting- tho they may well be using boxes for security.

NatJ, above, the idea of letting youngsters align with Orpingtons sounds good. It’s amazing how dominance and aggression shift, depending on how the teams are made up!

Good luck with this. You’ve obviously put a lot of thought and effort into creating an agreeable situation for everyone involved. And hopefully your neighbor’s dog is out of the picture.

 

[aart]

Is it feasible to block nest boxes for the night and unblock early for laying? Sounds inconvenient but would encourage roosting- tho they may well be using boxes of the sense of security.

It is and works very well for me here....I uncover nests after dark when I lock up so I don't have to get up early.

 

[SegiDream]

I'm confused. You said you have the main coop and the tractor and that the two young ones are in the tractor. But then you said the young ones are sleeping in the nesting box and you can't close it off because that's where they lay eggs. Are you keeping them separated during the day and together at night? They need full separation until they are ready for integration even at night. Do you have a lower roosting bar for them to use? Older chickens are probably going to stick to the top roosting bars...

IMO they need to be separated until they exhibit behaviors that they will get along. I don't usually have integration problems. When I was a teenager and before all the information in the world was at my finger tips via the internet, I figured out that it was easier to integrate newcomers by keeping them together but physically separated so they couldn't do any harm but still get used to seeing each other. IE if the chickens are kept in a run then the newcomers get placed in a large wire cage/divider inside the run for full view near the main food/water stations.

I personally don't go by time stamps I operate by observing their interactions and behavior. Like when the newcomer is pretty much ignored by everyone when they exhibit a "flashy" behavior such as flapping wings that's a positive sign. It's also positive when the newcomers are chill and relaxed around the other chickens because fear or excessively "flashy" behavior has a tendency to trigger a territorial alpha chicken. When everything seems good (usually a few days to a week maybe longer) real introductions happen by simply opening the cage and backing away. I can usually tell very quickly if there are still unresolved issues and they'll go back in if needed and they'll be observed closely for the remainder of the first day. There will always be some light aggression until their place in the pecking order is firm but watch for excessive feather loss or wounds.

As someone has already previously mentioned they definitely need space, cramped quarters will exasperate tensions. And multiple feeding/water stations for the same reason they need space and safe retreats to avoid top ranking chickens. HTH.