Cost vs. benefit analysis

[katsdar]

HI,
How do you package hackle feathers and how much do you charge, never thought of this.

 

[wsmith]

Depending on the breed and quality, I have seen them go for over $35. The last one I sold was local for $35. It was dried and in a ziplok bag. Of course, it was a VERY nice Dominique full hackle, with fantastic color and pattern. Other's mileage may vary.

 

[Smoochie]

I guess where I was coming from is that many people get chickens thinking they will be saving tons of money and then are often greatly disappointed with their chickens. Then the chickens often become neglected by the disappointed and cost. I was trying to discourage those people reading this thread that if they want to "save" lots of money this isn't the hobby you will be taking checks to the bank. Not everyone sees all the "benefits", nor care. Of course I love chickens and could careless if none of them laid eggs.

 

[QChickieMama]

This is where roosters named " Dinner" and " Delicious" would come in handy... Vicious is delicious!

Ha! We even named one rooster, "Roaster," but that didn't help. My 14yo daughter has assumed the "ewww gross" stance on all things dead or poopy. She didn't use to be that way!

 

[Smoochie]

Ha! We even named one rooster, "Roaster," but that didn't help. My 14yo daughter has assumed the "ewww gross" stance on all things dead or poopy. She didn't use to be that way!

OMG I love the name Roaster!! My next eggs are going to have a Roaster.. Hehe I do not eat my extra Roosters but like giving them funny names.

 

[Pele]

This might be slightly esoteric, but there are more non-monetary benefits that could be mentioned. One such benefit is of major interest in our modern day medical world: Bacterial genetic sharing. The commercial chicken industry contributes BIG to this phenomenon through heavily abusing atibiotics, and using them incorrectly. Here's the steps in the cycle:

1.) Commercial chicken farms pack tons of chickens into a small area, cheek to cheek, in order to give you those low-cost grocery eggs. Crowded conditions for ANY animal species leads to rampant disease.

2.) Commercial chicken farm sees the disease spreading, and immediately doses the crud out of their flocks. Wether the hens are infected or not, they get dosed. And the doses are extremely aggressive, and MUCH higher than necessary.

3.) Antibiotics do not fully wipe out bacteria. Especially when abused or incompletely used. The bacteria that are left over have genes that make them resistant (why they survived). They live happily in the chickens' environment and waste.... until they are washed down the drain during a cleaning.

4.) The surviving bacteria enter the water table. Bacteria have a very nifty trick of being able to share genetic material with other bacteria. Species that had no chance before to get ahold of antibiotic resistance now have access to the genes, and the spread of resistance is accelerated.

5.) All of this industrial abuse of antibiotics, and shoddy waste disposal systems, leads to fewer number of years that you can go into the doctor's office and actually have a disease successfully treated with antibiotics.

Price-wise, I think that's a pretty big monetary gain not to contribute to that system. Also, I hate making animals suffer to provide me with food, and commercial facilities are abyssmal.

 

[QChickieMama]

I agree that the lowest-cost chicken production system is a mess. Even if I didn't raise chickens here, I would NOT be purchasing regular grocery chickens. I try to find organic chickens at Whole Foods if we don't have one of ours in the freezer.

Mis-use of antibiotics is sad. All we can do is make good choices for ourselves.

 

[Chambertin]

I say dont buy "organic" buy LOCAL.
Organic is just another marketing tool, the benifits just dont measure out to the price. Its like starbucks coffee to me.
The tiny bit of good doesnt change the fact some twat is trying to charge me $10 for a $0.012 cup of coffee. (ok, so the fancy designer cup and packaging probably costs $0.25)
Free trade my butt... Try giving 1% of profits to the farmer and see how their life changes.

So before I go on a tyrade about marketing an image vs producing a product to match the image I'll get back to the topic.

I think chickens come in two categories.
Pets and Food
Sorry but its the basics and its true.
While there are so many levels of grey between the two you have to commit to one of the two sides before you can make honest cost decisions.

Here's my little chicken story.
I'm on the food side of the fence, but I love having my food as a pet. My wife and mother in law are the exact opposite. They could care less if our girls ever produce an egg, and even the meanest rooster would be welcome here.
Still we do our best to manage the flock away from an expensive hobby side of the balance sheet. My best advice is think long term, but calculate everything you do that day. Dont be afraid to spend money on a good investment, but dont lose track of the little daily costs that can kill your margins.

Tip one: Suppliment feed with anything and everything FREE
Everyone has said this, the problem is doing it. There is a whole world of edibile goodies for chickens they probably want more than any feed or treat, you just need to find access to it where the chickens dont get eaten first. To be honest this is one of the two keys to monetary sucess.
The other option is to give them everything you can that doest cost extra or has already been paid for.
I dont have a trash bin, I have a chicken bucket. Dogs get first pick, then chickens, then turkeys. If I could the turkey leftovers would then be used to farm flies. (too stinky for my locale)

Tip two: Manage food waste
You must be very proactive about how you feed and what you use to feed if you want to keep a good conversion rate.
Chickens are messy, they evolved scratching the ground and tearing up any edible plant matter they could find, cleanliness was not on the list. Feed is really just another form of dirt to a chicken: "Sure you can eat it, but lets look under just incase." is all a chicken ever thinks at the feeder.
Why else do superchicken farms spend so much money on feeding and watering systems?
Make a very good feeder and then make one more so you can support a large flock without them fighting for the best position.
I think this is the other key to monetary sucess.
FEED is NOT for Scratching, EVER. If your birds can scratch feed, change the feeder.

I had to settle for an old aquarium filter trough, its tall enough they can scratch without wasting much. I still hate it, but it will have to do...
(I was vetoed out, food time should still be "play time")

Tip three: A safe coop is the best coop
You can mke it as pretty as you want, you can spare no expense on decoration and ammenities, but the real matter is how well your coop protects your birds. Your birds, pets or food, need to be safe before all else. Think about the cheapest most basic system you can that keeps them 99% safe (nothing is perfect) and then go up from there.
Buying a coop or chicken tractor is easy, but I think its terribly inneficent when our world and culture supplies a never ending ammount of matierial for recycling.
I dont mind spending money on the coop parts and much to the annoyiance of the rest of the houe I insisted on spending good money on the roof, but I more than made up for it in building everything else by hand.

Building your own coop is so rewarding I cant even begin to explain it. Every time I think about how early it is, or how I'd rather be sleeping in that quick reminder of how I made everything I see helps put it in perspective.

Also think about this: Pet or food you dont want some disease, predator, or parasite taking away your food or loved one. Make sure you have a good quality and safe enviroment for your flock. Dont buy or build without taking a good look at what your coop will look like and how to care for it.

I could go on, but I think that covers it. Pets or not, make sure they are safe, happy, and not wasteful.

For our flock we spent about 100 in feed, 200 on the coop, 33 on the birds and maybe another 60 in food scraps in 6 months (no one was going to eat them, but we still paid for it).
So our initial investment was $393. It sure looks like a lot, but thats 6 months. The coop can be used forever and there's many an egg to come.

Right now, here is our $400 egg. Not so efficent... heh

I'd do it again in a heartbeat. The side benifits to the chickens so greatly outweigh the costs.
Will I ever come close to the truly cheap price, no. Economies of scale can only be won by scale. Either land or number of birds must be large.
Still I'm going to beat the organic, free-range, and whatever the next marketing term will be in price, quality and enjoyment by following those 3 tips.

My long winded much more than two cents

 

[Fred's Hens]

If it were possible to divorce the organic issue, the philosophical issues, from simply the cost/profit equation, it makes no difference. Organic feed vs Regular Feed.

Again, purely on the economic issues, if one pays double for the feed, then the eggs must also sell for double. It's that simple. This takes a local market that will support, be willing to pay for organic products. Our local sales base is very, very soft at best. That the eggs come from chickens who live a natural life, get to free range and breath fresh air in the sunshine is enough for our customers. That means $2.50 per dozen. That local price simply will not support the necessary $4.00 to justify the cost of organic feed. If we had a customer base that would pay $4 a dozen? Sure, we'd be all over it. Maybe that culture will evolve, we shall see.

Again, just the economic realities, not necessarily the philosophical.

 

[katsdar]

Hi,
Very much enjoyed your post. Don't eat your egg all at once.

Kat