Could this be Mareks?

missmarans1719

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I have some 4 week old Ameraucanas purchased from a very reputable breeder. Within a week/2 weeks, 3 mysteriously died. They are all in a brooder inside of my basement (clean, dry, no contact with outside) with 13 other chicks that I hatched from my own stock, all the same age. I thought possibly coccidiosis but it seemed a too early for that.

Five days ago I found one huddled in the corner under the rest, acting like it’s legs were bothering it. I separated it into a brooder with 2 day olds. It’s alive but it’s slowly deteriorating (not cleaning itself, but still eating and drinking). It’s legs are stretched straight out in front of it. I’ve been giving it straight poly vi sol drops. It seems fine other than it’s legs not working. I was giving nutri drench that seemed to perk it up the first couple of days.

Last night, another chick started acting strange so I moved it to the ICU brooder. Last I checked last night it was laying on its side with one eye closed tightly. I also gave it poly vi sol, thinking it wouldn’t survive the night but what could it hurt. This evening I went in and to my surprise, it was standing, eating, and drinking somewhat. It staggered over to the other side and walked in a circle like it was drunk. The eye is still closed tightly.

None of the others are acting odd, which makes me think possibly a vitamin deficiency. I did hatch two chicks with wry neck a few weeks ago, and blamed on the cheap feed (Dumor) my husband mistakenly bought a few months ago. I also considered the possibility of the wry necks hatching from eggs that the mothers had received a dose of ivermectin (maybe we hadn’t waited long enough? A month??) but that wouldn’t explain the breeder’s chicks I bought. Unless something is up with the Purina medicated chick feed...botulism? Aspergillosis??

Of course, the paralysis points to Mareks...and that I brought in live chicks from another source. It’s been long enough for the 3 week Mareks infection to begin. However, I would expect more to be sick. I haven’t noticed any other signs. At this point all eyes are bluish gray in the light, so I can’t really go by that.

I will send for a necropsy if and when these chicks die. If it is Mareks, I’m prepared to cull the entire basement dwelling flock. Even the $400 chicks :(

Avian Encephalomyelitis?
Mycoplasma?
Avian Lymphois Leukosis???
Riboflavin deficiency?
That’s all I’ve come up with.

Nothing sounds good except vitamin deficiency...that can hopefully be reversed. If it’s worth mentioning, I also hatched 2 of this breeder’s eggs (the reason I bought chicks was because I ordered eggs twice and USPS dropped the ball on them twice). Of the 2, one had an eye grown shut (I thought it was born without an eyeball at first)... that kept getting infected and bleeding. I put erythromycin ointment in it for a few days and as the chick grew its eye started to grow open. It looks strange but is starting to look normal.

I did also have some Greenfire chicks in the same room at one point, but they’ve been vaccinated. I know it’s not 100%, but they’ve been fine.
 
I thought possibly coccidiosis but it seemed a too early for that.
Hi there, welcome to BYC! :frow

Sorry you face this. :(

Were the chicks outdoors or being raised (or hatched) by a broody before coming to your place?

Chicks can suffer from coccidiosis early... only 6 days form exposure before symptoms present.. and coccidia (oocysts) are in every chick poop.

I personally won't have Marek's vaccinated bird at my place.. hiding the disease if it is present so it can continue to proliferate. There has been one gene identified that creates resistance. If it were me... and you do get a necropsy that confirms Marek's... I would only cull those who present with symptoms... immediately.. and all those who were vaccinated.. keeping only those who thrive. But we all have different flock goals. To me this is how I protect my investment... which sounds like you have heavily invested.

It’s been long enough for the 3 week Mareks infection to begin. However, I would expect more to be sick.
You can't go by that since each bird has their own immune system. :hmm

Maybe consider culling the paralyzed chick now and sending for necropsy... so you have a definitive answer. Since even if it does recover... doesn't mean it was vitamin deficit or coccidiosis... as lot's of people have confirmed Marek's birds who did recover and continue to live among their flock even laying eggs... some relapse, some waste slowly, some don't succumb.

Adding your general location to your profile can help others make the best suggestions possible at a glance. Here are links to help with necropsy if you reach that point...
How to Send a Bird for a Necropsy

State poultry labs

:fl
 
Thanks for your reply! The chicks from the breeder were hatched in an incubator. That’s what I can’t figure out. How could it be Marek’s if no outside exposure occurred? Unless the breeder had a positive bird she interacted with before boxing these chicks. I feel as if it’s highly unlikely Marek’s....but it’s the only thing that really makes sense. I have never had an incident amongst my vaccinated and unvaccinated adult birds, so I don’t think it could’ve came from me. We’re strict about bio security on our farm. I plan to cull tonight an send the chick to our state lab. I’m in Virginia.

Do you know if an initial Marek’s infection could have been responsible for the week old chicks that died? I have read conflicting timelines on the disease. As far as I’m aware it’s more common in older chicks but can happen the earliest at 3 weeks due to the disease process.


Hi there, welcome to BYC! :frow

Sorry you face this. :(

Were the chicks outdoors or being raised (or hatched) by a broody before coming to your place?

Chicks can suffer from coccidiosis early... only 6 days form exposure before symptoms present.. and coccidia (oocysts) are in every chick poop.

I personally won't have Marek's vaccinated bird at my place.. hiding the disease if it is present so it can continue to proliferate. There has been one gene identified that creates resistance. If it were me... and you do get a necropsy that confirms Marek's... I would only cull those who present with symptoms... immediately.. and all those who were vaccinated.. keeping only those who thrive. But we all have different flock goals. To me this is how I protect my investment... which sounds like you have heavily invested.


You can't go by that since each bird has their own immune system. :hmm

Maybe consider culling the paralyzed chick now and sending for necropsy... so you have a definitive answer. Since even if it does recover... doesn't mean it was vitamin deficit or coccidiosis... as lot's of people have confirmed Marek's birds who did recover and continue to live among their flock even laying eggs... some relapse, some waste slowly, some don't succumb.

Adding your general location to your profile can help others make the best suggestions possible at a glance. Here are links to help with necropsy if you reach that point...
How to Send a Bird for a Necropsy

State poultry labs

:fl
 
Well I came home just now and checked everybody, the one that showed improvement last night is acting totally fine, it even has its eye open now. The one with it’s legs straight out in front of it seemed much better too. It still somewhat paralyzed but it had positioned itself between the feeder and waterer, eating and drinking like normal. Would Marek’s clear that fast? I’m leaning toward vitamin deficiency now, but I’ve been feeding the best chick starter available at TSC. It is not old but is it possible I got a bad batch? Seems like all of our problems started when I opened this new bag!

Hi there, welcome to BYC! :frow

Sorry you face this. :(

Were the chicks outdoors or being raised (or hatched) by a broody before coming to your place?

Chicks can suffer from coccidiosis early... only 6 days form exposure before symptoms present.. and coccidia (oocysts) are in every chick poop.

I personally won't have Marek's vaccinated bird at my place.. hiding the disease if it is present so it can continue to proliferate. There has been one gene identified that creates resistance. If it were me... and you do get a necropsy that confirms Marek's... I would only cull those who present with symptoms... immediately.. and all those who were vaccinated.. keeping only those who thrive. But we all have different flock goals. To me this is how I protect my investment... which sounds like you have heavily invested.


You can't go by that since each bird has their own immune system. :hmm

Maybe consider culling the paralyzed chick now and sending for necropsy... so you have a definitive answer. Since even if it does recover... doesn't mean it was vitamin deficit or coccidiosis... as lot's of people have confirmed Marek's birds who did recover and continue to live among their flock even laying eggs... some relapse, some waste slowly, some don't succumb.

Adding your general location to your profile can help others make the best suggestions possible at a glance. Here are links to help with necropsy if you reach that point...
How to Send a Bird for a Necropsy

State poultry labs

:fl
 
Do you know if an initial Marek’s infection could have been responsible for the week old chicks that died?
At one week old... failure to thrive is the biggest suspect as neither coccidiosis nor Marek's will have impact that early. Some chicks don't connect with food or can't digest it after the yolk has been used up. If I am using a supplement in the water most live to about a week before failing.

Other most likely possibilities at one week would be a blockage from eating bedding or pasty butt.

Yes, Marek's can clear that fast... or at least appear to. And not before 3 weeks of age. :hmm

While it is hard to believe a vitamin deficit can take place when you feed a good feed and don't see any bullying... according to my hatch analysis SOME birds simply don't process or absorb things as well as others do. I feed quality feed only (Purina flock raiser), not diminished with treats to my free range flock... and still experienced quitters on a certain day of incubation. Research said vitamins... but it wasn't ALL of the eggs that had issues.

The most accurate information I have found on Marek's is here...
Marek's
 
I think I’ve found the culprit. We decided not to cull just yet but to wait until Sunday in order to mail out for a necropsy on Monday. Last night i noticed the one born with the messed up deformed eye was acting odd. Picked it up, looked it over....half of the good eye is almost white—like a cataract. So I go to the ICU brooder to check the eyes, the 2nd chick I had mentioned that is now acting fine with the closed eye—it’s eye is completely white. This has to be viral, and from what I’ve researched I’m looking at Avian Encephalomyelitis.

This is very unfortunate, but I feel better that it’s probably not Marek’s. Apparently it goes away and birds become immune for life without being carriers.

I read that cataracts in chicks can also be caused by vitamin A deficiency, but considering they get purina, and the eggs hatched came from different sources, along with the symptom of paralysis—I think viral. Nobody is moving out of my basement until I have an answer.


At one week old... failure to thrive is the biggest suspect as neither coccidiosis nor Marek's will have impact that early. Some chicks don't connect with food or can't digest it after the yolk has been used up. If I am using a supplement in the water most live to about a week before failing.

Other most likely possibilities at one week would be a blockage from eating bedding or pasty butt.

Yes, Marek's can clear that fast... or at least appear to. And not before 3 weeks of age. :hmm

While it is hard to believe a vitamin deficit can take place when you feed a good feed and don't see any bullying... according to my hatch analysis SOME birds simply don't process or absorb things as well as others do. I feed quality feed only (Purina flock raiser), not diminished with treats to my free range flock... and still experienced quitters on a certain day of incubation. Research said vitamins... but it wasn't ALL of the eggs that had issues.

The most accurate information I have found on Marek's is here...
Marek's
 
This is the one that hatched with a deformed eye, almost like the lids were grown together. Now the good eye is turning cloudy
 

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The 2nd chick I referred to
 

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A 4th chick with a closed eye and sensitivity to light I discovered upon examination of all. The eyeball itself looks sunken into the skull. No runniness, no resp issues.
 

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